Climbing Techniques

[Tree Machine]

Especially when carrying a big saw when I would not mind being on 2:1. I will sometimes go to 3;1 climbing in these situations. Sort of a (RADS) One of the things that is necessary is to transfer more work to your legs.

Here is where you're having to determine and set up, either in advance or in the moment, your climbing rig to accommodate what it is you're doing.

On this specific note, a twin line, over a single line, offers double the rope for footlocking, making footlocking much more certain and simple.

And it doesn't matter whether you're out hanging in space, or up against a trunk, footlocking is just plain easier than single.


Note that both 2:1 DdRT and SRT give your feet only one line to grip. Asecond, parallel footlocking line offers twice the friction in a place where that makes a substantial difference.

And because the difference is so substantial, you will find that adding a foot ascender into the mix is entirely unnecessary, eliminating one of the 'pieces' that make up the system.


In further comparing and contrasting the systems, we should count the physical number of pieces in the system required for it to function as intended. I've seen SRT setups requiring 6 or 8 pieces, kind of a lot of parts if you ask me.

Kevin, can you list all the components of the wrench system?

I'll start:
Rope Wrench
cord from wrench to connector
friction hitch
micropulley
stainless steel clevis
The connector itself

5 piece, six if you count the connector (caribiner)

In a 2:1 DdRT you might throw an additional dogleash, a friction saver and the multiple components necessary to set and retrieve that remotely.


Any of the gear setups for any one of the three rope techniques can be seen as piece-intensive, based solely on the number of parts, or action-intensive depending on the number of hands required to operate the system, or motion-intensive depending on the number of motions needed to accomplish your tasks. Or expensive depending on how much each of the components to the system costs.

Any system should be judged on its stand-alone merit. The above partially outlines what should be looked at regarding the physical parts and pieces.


I feel that if mankind can develop a space shuttle and international space station,we can come up with a ONE-PIECE device that can handle all three rope techniques. Am I out of the park on this one?

 

[jefflovstrom]

Climbing old school on a blakes is a good technique to Know but you are going to want to move on to some type of split tail system pretty quick. You're climbing on what is called a closed system. A split tail/prussic/eye to eye is the way to go. Allows you to incorporate a dynamic system where you just unclip a carabiner and throw the running end of your line around different tie in points. Much faster and easier than having to untie and retie a blakes hitch every time you need to change TIP's. This will also reduce the need for redirects, although redirects come in very handy for positioning as Tree Machine has mentioned.

I think you are stupid.
Jeff

 

[Tree Machine]

Now, now Jeff. We're all in this together.

 

[jefflovstrom]

Now, now Jeff. We're all in this together.

Jeff

 

[Tree Machine]

Jeff could be saying the old-school approach to training climbers is stupid.



We've been training climbers in this 'hardest way first, next hardest way & next' and then a few years down the line you're on the SAME 2:1 system, only with a lot more pieces and complexity and time setting up, dressing, installing, retrieving and putting away. Every single technical climb you get all the working parts and pieces together & tie what needs to be tied & seated this ritual of before (the climb) and after (the climb).


Jeff's point may be that we've done it this way since the age of Mariners on ships with sisal and manila rope. Synthetic ropes changed the way of modern climbing, but up until very recently have TREE CLIMBERS begun a migration to 1:1 methods. If the gear is sound and does what we want it to do, is it necessary that we start at the difficult end and work our way up, or should we start at the easy end and learn the more difficult methods later?


Seriously, why not start with a setup that allows you full confidence and safety and ease of setup and ease of use. Master the skills necessary to do the the job of an arborist and then go back to more difficult and inefficient methods and you possess, then, a fundamental and direct-experience basis to compare the different techniques and the different ways they are approached..


See right now, our entire industry weight is heavy to the 2:1 side, and they may have no basis to compare to 1:1. This is because the ideal device does not exist, NO ONE has the ability to compare, except for a few guys on experimental prototype gear. As far as arborists, we just don't have the ideal 1:1 gear yet and therefore are not able to do side by side testing 2:1 vs the 1:1's. We are denied this information, nothing at fault, this is just the way it is.


But if the gear were to come around, and both 1:1 techniques were made so frickin easy that you now climb in utter disbelief of how easy footlocking really is, would that not be the more logical place from which to start out and teach modern climbing?

Just something to think about.

 

[treemandan]

So basically running this srt for working the friction given out by the singing wood piece just absorbs just enough friction to keep your other friction hitch from binding down tight? You are just reversing the procedure for a rappel on a figure 8 where the 8 would be at you belt and the friction hitch would be above?
I say TM, you are doing a marvelous job describing this and yes, I quit doing tree work for a little bit cause trying to get into a tree used to suck. Deep rep yer way.

 

[treemandan]

I am one who likes to keep it simple and find I get annoyed with to many gadgets but I will most likely be wittling myself a rope wrench for Christmas.

 

[Kottonwood]

who needs to footlock

What is all this talk about footlocking and all this crap?

Real arborists use this

http://www.sherrilltree.com/Profess...eTeks-Wraptor-Motorized-Rope-Ascension-Device

 

[jefflovstrom]

It used to be if you can't foot lock, you were not hired.
Jeff

 

[Kottonwood]

haha if anyone showed up on my jobsite with that thing he would not be hired

 

[jefflovstrom]

What thing? Foot locking?
Jeff

 

[Kottonwood]

no that ridiculous motorized ascender that I posted a link to

 

[jefflovstrom]

Oh.

 

[kevin bingham]

What is all this talk about footlocking and all this crap?

Real arborists use this

http://www.sherrilltree.com/Profess...eTeks-Wraptor-Motorized-Rope-Ascension-Device

Getting into the tree is such a small part of tree work. To me, that 1-10 minutes of the day really isn't part of the discussion. use a complex ropewalker system, the wraptor, body thrust, footlock, or fly.... whatever, so your in a tree somewhere. so what.
Branch access and work positioning are what real arborists are concerned with and the wraptor can do none of those things.

 

[Kottonwood]

well said, I hope people caught my sarcasm, I wouldn't never spend that kind of money on something that simply gets me in the tree..... unless it's a bucket truck

 

[treemandan]

well said, I hope people caught my sarcasm, I wouldn't never spend that kind of money on something that simply gets me in the tree..... unless it's a bucket truck

do you have 125 foot or better sticks out there?

 

[Kottonwood]

I wish we did, but no. Biggest thing you really see around here is 80' or so.

So do you guys use stuff like that on bigger trees?

 

[jefflovstrom]

I wish we did, but no. Biggest thing you really see around here is 80' or so.

So do you guys use stuff like that on bigger trees?

Oh my, yes! Hahaha! Fun stuff.
Jeff

 

[treeclimber101]

I love to see guys with a belt full of #### all it does it make your knees hurt from the weight , A throwline or pole and I can access any tree , if I am climbing alot of little guys to prune than I will bust out the ladder ...I can body thrust as fast as just about anyone I ever worked with can climb a rope , as far a positioning tye high and clear all those little hang up branches and you can access more than 50% of the top with 1 crotch...If i need to redirect I just use the other end of my rope and pull myself to the work , and I have been working with a 2 over 2 and won't use anything else ..

 

[Kottonwood]

I like your style 101, That is pretty much how I operate, except I use a ten foot lanyard to redirect or pull myself around, also for safety because I usually free climb to enter the tree. I can use my climbing rope as one lanyard and the 10 ft as another so I am never untied. I just changed over to a spliced rope though, so now I can quickly unclip and reset my rope without having to untie anything. It's nice but I still trim most if not all of the tree from one TIP, and I don't really use a pole saw or pruner in the tree. I walk out and use my handsaw. I find with a pole saw I always seem to leave it behind and have to go back for it. I know my technique is old school, but it's how I was trained and I am fast with it, so for now it works.