Interesting different oil/ratio observation today

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Ed Penney

Ed Penney

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LOL, Dirrahea of the expansion chamber. I really haven't researched what new synthetic oils are obtained from. Some kind of oil can be extracted from any plant or animal. I know some two stroke oils do smell like food substances.
 
bwalker
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All the castor oils had their place back in the day . Primarily within racing applications where proper mixing to prevent separation & religious engine decarbonizing scheduling were the norm . Today with modern 2T oils , bean oils are just a liability in my opinion !
Yep, a huge liability. The gum everything up, corrode parts and seperate in the fuel very easily.
 
Ed Penney

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Yep, a huge liability. The gum everything up, corrode parts and seperate in the fuel very easily.
I read a lot of your post on oil. I have been using the same 2 oils for years (all synthetic) but it is good for someone post their tech knowledge on them GOOD INFO. I am old school and got a habit of shaking my can up everytime, even when you don't have too. haha, cheers
 
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I read a lot of your post on oil. I have been using the same 2 oils for years (all synthetic) but it is good for someone post their tech knowledge on them GOOD INFO. I am old school and got a habit of shaking my can up everytime, even when you don't have too. haha, cheers
When castor seperates shaking up the fuel is of little use. It almost immediately drops out of suspension. The cooler the temps the worse this problem gets.
 
MacAttack

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Yep, a huge liability. The gum everything up, corrode parts and seperate in the fuel very easily.
It's interesting to read how poor castor oils actually behave, I've never used them. However growing up, we knew this family that drag raced anything that moved, snowmobiles, dirtbikes, motorcycles, cars, atvs, they would have drag raced a wheelchair if it had a 2-stroke engine with an expansion chamber.
Those guys were crude and unscientific, but they went fast, and they SWORE by putting castor oil in every 2-stroke they raced, I loved the smell, still do. They never seemed to complain about the side effects, but then they were always blowing up engines left and right and probably wouldn't notice anyway.
 
HansFranz

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It's interesting to read how poor castor oils actually behave...

Reportedly, castor oil is pretty effective at restoring the lubricity of ultra-low sulfur diesel fuel to protect diesel injectors, though.

I have an old 2001 Powerstroke diesel (7.3 liter) that was made before ULSD was common/required. According to the paper at

https://cdn.intechopen.com/pdfs/38157/InTech-Lubricating_aspects_of_automotive_fuels.pdf
if you add castor oil at a mix ratio of 200 ppm (about 1 tablespoon per 40-gallon tank of ULSD if I recall correctly), it vastly improves the lubricity of ULSD. (See pages 102-103 of the paper for that discussion.)
 
bwalker
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It's interesting to read how poor castor oils actually behave, I've never used them. However growing up, we knew this family that drag raced anything that moved, snowmobiles, dirtbikes, motorcycles, cars, atvs, they would have drag raced a wheelchair if it had a 2-stroke engine with an expansion chamber.
Those guys were crude and unscientific, but they went fast, and they SWORE by putting castor oil in every 2-stroke they raced, I loved the smell, still do. They never seemed to complain about the side effects, but then they were always blowing up engines left and right and probably wouldn't notice anyway.
Back in the day before nicisil cylinder, coatings,liquid cooling and rudimentary knowledge of head and pipe designs castor was needed in many cases. The engines just could not get rid of the heat. They were on the verge of seizure all the time.
I've personally never ran straight castor, but have ran plenty of Maxima 927 and Klotz Super Techniplate castor blends. But even those only on my open class dirt bikes when dune riding. Also ran leaded fuel while at the dunes. Those huge cylinders are very prone to detonation when wrung out at full throttle in a high load situation like dune riding.
A chainsaw has a very small bore size, a very low compreasion ratio, operate at high rpm and combined with low output they just don't stress oil much.
 
MacAttack

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Back in the day before nicisil cylinder, coatings,liquid cooling and rudimentary knowledge of head and pipe designs castor was needed in many cases. The engines just could not get rid of the heat. They were on the verge of seizure all the time.
I've personally never ran straight castor, but have ran plenty of Maxima 927 and Klotz Super Techniplate castor blends. But even those only on my open class dirt bikes when dune riding. Also ran leaded fuel while at the dunes. Those huge cylinders are very prone to detonation when wrung out at full throttle in a high load situation like dune riding.
A chainsaw has a very small bore size, a very low compreasion ratio, operate at high rpm and combined with low output they just don't stress oil much.
The era for those castor antics were the early 90's right up to present day, but the old patriarch was racing the old air cooled stuff you described for decades. So he probably just kept using castor oil out of habit haha.
I have an old KTM 300 2 smoke, too bad it has a power valve or I'd toss in a little castor for the smell.
Good info.
 
MacAttack

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Reportedly, castor oil is pretty effective at restoring the lubricity of ultra-low sulfur diesel fuel to protect diesel injectors, though.

I have an old 2001 Powerstroke diesel (7.3 liter) that was made before ULSD was common/required. According to the paper at

https://cdn.intechopen.com/pdfs/38157/InTech-Lubricating_aspects_of_automotive_fuels.pdf
if you add castor oil at a mix ratio of 200 ppm (about 1 tablespoon per 40-gallon tank of ULSD if I recall correctly), it vastly improves the lubricity of ULSD. (See pages 102-103 of the paper for that discussion.)
I get the sense the castor oils do have some legendary lubricity qualities, but just come with baggage.
And damn do I love the smell.
 
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The era for those castor antics were the early 90's right up to present day, but the old patriarch was racing the old air cooled stuff you described for decades. So he probably just kept using castor oil out of habit haha.
I have an old KTM 300 2 smoke, too bad it has a power valve or I'd toss in a little castor for the smell.
Good info.
Actually more like the 70's with some exceptions like Yamaha KT100 kart engines and the like.
 
MacAttack

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Actually more like the 70's with some exceptions like Yamaha KT100 kart engines and the like.
Yep we're saying the same thing, the guys I knew started using castor in the 70's in the old air-cooled sleds, and then even by the 90's when they were running liquid-cooled, nicasil bore engines, they kept using castor religiously. I guarantee they STILL do.
I will say that same clan of Neanderthals did start me using Klotz Techniplate, which is my favorite for power sports.
 
North by Northwest

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Actually more like the 70's with some exceptions like Yamaha KT100 kart engines and the like.
Early 70's is correct within the Castor era for race applications , ran it in numerous race engines , never had an engine failure . Decarbonizing was routine maintenance protocol . Dirty oil , but it was what is was back then lol. Today several castor based oils have been blended with ester oils for a cleaner final product , however I still see no need for their usage in any of my recreational engine applications .
 
North by Northwest

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I get the sense the castor oils do have some legendary lubricity qualities, but just come with baggage.
And damn do I love the smell.
Exactly , ledgendary protection lol. Castor bonds to local hot spots instananously preventing galling between metal to metal surfaces . In extreme service , back in the day this ensured reliable performance short term but at a cost of religious tear downs for required cleaning of piston crowns & rings , cylinder heads & exhaust ports . The only things i miss from the castor oil days is the aroma of castor & racing fuel on a Saturday afternoon at the track !
 
bwalker
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Yep we're saying the same thing, the guys I knew started using castor in the 70's in the old air-cooled sleds, and then even by the 90's when they were running liquid-cooled, nicasil bore engines, they kept using castor religiously. I guarantee they STILL do.
I will say that same clan of Neanderthals did start me using Klotz Techniplate, which is my favorite for power sports.
The problem with castor in snowmobiles is that it drops out of suspension very easily in the cold. I never new of anyone to use it in sleds, but I wasn't racing in the 70's.
Techniplate has no castor in it and was/is used in sleds commonly.
 
bwalker
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Exactly , ledgendary protection lol. Castor bonds to local hot spots instananously preventing galling between metal to metal surfaces . In extreme service , back in the day this ensured reliable performance short term but at a cost of religious tear downs for required cleaning of piston crowns & rings , cylinder heads & exhaust ports . The only things i miss from the castor oil days is the aroma of castor & racing fuel on a Saturday afternoon at the track !
Super Techniplate mixed with VP MR2 gives off a heavenly odor. Of course it's not good to smell the fumes of leaded fuel doped with MTBE..
 
North by Northwest

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Not even close to the same. When an ester reaches its end point it unzips and turns to gas. When castor reaches the same point it polymerizes into a grease like substance.
Could not aggree more Ben , a dirty sludge like homogenous mass . I would rather tear down any commercial x frame diesel , then an 2T engine running Castor for 50 hrs .
 
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