Is softwood really that soft?!?

[slowp]

Here's my Madrone story.

A snag was cut so I cut it up for firewood. It needed to be split as well. I pounded on it with a wedge and maul, and it didn't want to split. A guy walked by and did the Here, I'll show you how to split it statement. Three swings and he gave up. I put it under a water sprinkler overnight, then it was easier to split, and since it was the start of summer, there was time for it to dry.

Respect the Madrone!

 

[wheelman]

Git ye a ol dry hickry or a ol dry locus frum heer in Tennessee and ye got sumthin werth talkin bout.

 

[thomas72]

Around here usually the harder the wood the easier it is to split holding the wood has straight grain. Sweet gum is some of the hardest to split around here and is a soft wood.

 

[RiverRat2]

yes sir.

someone rep Gary for me.

O Tay!!!! I Did!!!!

 

[Cope]

note that the PNW bigleaf maple that Gary was cutting is a lot harder than the more common type.... oh my, look at that... its harder than beech):

Huh. The beech is harder. Last time I checked 850 < 1300.

 

[GASoline71]

Brian... that 372 is friggin' sick! Nice saw!

Gary

 

[RiverRat2]

+ freaking 1

Brian... that 372 is friggin' sick! Nice saw!

Gary

I wants one!!!!!!!!

 

[Cedarkerf]

Brian... that 372 is friggin' sick! Nice saw!

Gary

Its ported so pulls 32 great. After using it a while pretty much like Stihls except the AV is better on the 372. Miss the 3/4 wrap.

 

[edisto]

What? Why Jethro, that just cannot be! Nothing west of the Mississippi is harder than anything back east! All we have here is balsa wood!

Some western mushy hardwoods compared to the three midwest balls on species listed to smack Gary previously in this thread include (note that the PNW bigleaf maple that Gary was cutting is a lot harder than the more common type.... oh my, look at that... its harder than beech):

Bigleaf Maple: 850
Oregon White Oak: 1290
American Beech: 1300
California Black Oak: 1308
Bigleaf Maple (Pacific Coast spp): 1450
Pacific Madrone: 1460
Pacific yew: 1600
Black Locust: 1700
Apple: 1730 (What, there are apples in Washington?)
Hickory: 1820
Blue oak (est): 2000
Mesquite: 2345 Beat that!

Where are the Kansas boys at? Osage orange/hedge apple is 2040 green.

 

[tdi-rick]

Where are the Kansas boys at? Osage orange/hedge apple is 2040 green.

And Grey Ironbark is 16.3kN/3660lb
It's a common fencepost/firewood here.

River Redgum is 9.7, Forest Redgum is 11.3/2440, etc, etc.

Even our soft Cypress Pine is 6.1/1380 (used a lot as a building timber as it's termite resistant)

Just to stir the pot some more,here's a pic of Rooshooter carving up a Forest Redgum from this thread
http://www.arboristsite.com/showthread.php?t=101714&page=2

 

[windthrown]

Huh. The beech is harder. Last time I checked 850 < 1300.

Different maple sub-species. Lookey farther down the list there. See, I highlighted the west coast species in blue. Maybe you are color blind? Or was it just too subtle? I will let you do the math:

Bigleaf Maple (Pacific Coast spp): 1450

If it is too complicated to figure out, Gary lives along the Pacific coast here, see.

 

[pastryguyhawaii]

Mesquite: 2345 Beat that!

Kiawe out here. Let it bake in the Kona sun for a few years and it really gets hard. I'm the only one dumb enough to make tables out of it. It's like working with granite.

 

[BobL]

.
.
.
Mesquite: 2345 Beat that!

One thing to point out though is that the Janka hardness tests are done on dried wood, with 12% moisture. When they are green, they are a lot softer. Of couse, this side of the Mississippi, you can see by the list above that all the woods here are softer, or rather, way mushier.

In Australia both Green and Dry Janka hardnesses are reported.

The softest thing I normally mill is Jarrah with a Janka hardness of 1280 lbs green and 1912 lbs dry
Then in increasing order
Tree Green Dry
Marri 1485/1600
Karri 1350/ 2025
Redgum 1598/ 2250
Lemon Scented Gum 1800/ 2474
Tuart 2115/ 2475
Wandoo 2228/ 3375

So something like Wandoo is almost as hard when it is green as mesquite is when its dry.
All of these except the redgum and Lemon Scented are Western Australian Timbers.

The Grey Iron Bark value of 3660 lbs reported by tdi-rick is a dry Janka hardness

Then if I can every get hold of some I still have these to try(all dry Janka hardness)
Red Morrel 3850
Dundas Blackbut 3960
Gimlet 4095

Gidgee is one of the hardest Aussie woods and it is above Gimlet. FInally there is something called the Western Australian Black Desert Oak with an unknown hardness but a density similar to Lignum Vitae 81-83 lb/ft^3.

Hardness is one thing but then many of these trees, particularly when stressed, will suck up silica which messes with your chain above and beyond hardness. Tuart is one example. It's only 2115 lbs Janka green but it can act like well over 3000 lbs if it comes from a stressed tree.

 

[stinkbait]

I cut lots of firewood each year for my grandmother and my future inlaws. I have, what I call, my four firewood saws. They are a SP125C with a 36" bar .404 chisel chain, Super XL-925 with 28" bar and 3/8" chisel chain, Pro Mac 700 with 20" bar and 3/8" chisel chain, and 011av with 14" bar and 3/8" lo pro. I usually only carry two of these when cutting. Which ones I take depends on the size of the tree I plan on cutting up. All these saws pull these bars very well with plenty of extra power. I have also never had a problem with oak dulling my saws after a few cuts, unless there is metal in it or I hit the ground. Usually all we cut is white oak, red oak, or poplar.

 

[Cope]

Different maple sub-species. Lookey farther down the list there. See, I highlighted the west coast species in blue. Maybe you are color blind? Or was it just too subtle? I will let you do the math:

Bigleaf Maple (Pacific Coast spp): 1450

If it is too complicated to figure out, Gary lives along the Pacific coast here, see.

Not color blind and I assure you that you can entrust me with the math. The only thing that seems complicated is where you are getting your data. I checked the list in the link. These are the only maples I see:

maple, bigleaf Acer macrophyllum 3.8 850
maple, black Acer nigrum 5.2 1180
maple, red Acer rubrum 4.2 950
maple, silver Acer saccharimum 3.1 700
maple, sugar Acer saccharum 6.4 1450

The sugar maple is 1450 and its range does not extend to the west coast. I don't see a bigleaf maple that is listed as 1450. I searched the entire list and did not find a "Pacific Coast spp" maple. As a matter of fact the only tree on the list that has a value of 1450 is the sugar maple.

I did a quick internet search on bigleaf maple and I've found that it is of medium hardness, similar to cherry. Where are you getting that 1450 figure?

 

[GASoline71]

Sheesh... who broke out the mathematics???

HAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!

Gary

 

[slowp]

Not color blind and I assure you that you can entrust me with the math. The only thing that seems complicated is where you are getting your data. I checked the list in the link. These are the only maples I see:

maple, bigleaf Acer macrophyllum 3.8 850
maple, black Acer nigrum 5.2 1180
maple, red Acer rubrum 4.2 950
maple, silver Acer saccharimum 3.1 700
maple, sugar Acer saccharum 6.4 1450

The sugar maple is 1450 and its range does not extend to the west coast. I don't see a bigleaf maple that is listed as 1450. I searched the entire list and did not find a "Pacific Coast spp" maple. As a matter of fact the only tree on the list that has a value of 1450 is the sugar maple.

I did a quick internet search on bigleaf maple and I've found that it is of medium hardness, similar to cherry. Where are you getting that 1450 figure?

It doesn't take into consideration the volcanic ash that is embedded in the mossy dirty stuff on the maples. I think that would push it off the scale, would it not? Silica from 1980. We never ever use that moss for emergency tissue.

 

[Cope]

It doesn't take into consideration the volcanic ash that is embedded in the mossy dirty stuff on the maples. I think that would push it off the scale, would it not? Silica from 1980. We never ever use that moss for emergency tissue.

Eureka! That must be where the 1450 comes from.

Isn't it great when someone calls you out for not looking closely enough at something when, in fact, they didn't look at it closely enough themselves in the first place. I wonder how crow tastes?

 

[Jtheo]

You match the bar and chain to the kind of trees to be cut.

I run a 24 or 28 inch bar for some of my big pine trees.

For red oak or hickory I drop back to an 18 or 20 inch.

So, same saws, different bars for different wood.

 

[Cedarkerf]

Eureka! That must be where the 1450 comes from.

Isn't it great when someone calls you out for not looking closely enough at something when, in fact, they didn't look at it closely enough themselves in the first place. I wonder how crow tastes?

Windthrown prolly laughing like crazy you taken him seriously get a grip already. Gullible whats gullible whos gullible am I gullible .