Plasma Cutters

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Glad that someone started talking about keeping water out of the air and filtration. And yes a 220 unit you will need if you want to cut anything. From a production perspective that is not me buy I bout an 1.25 inch cutting esab been happy with it. And yes consumables are an important part. In my opinion you need two units I should likely get a 3/8 machine for thin material but never worry much about that. Propane is cheap and a pain to use don't do it if you are getting a torch. Dad had bought a power hacksaw years ago we cut miles of material on that unit lol you have to be patient as it is not fast. Cut off saws are way faster and cost more to run as the disc's wear out way faster than a blade does. Never owned a metal bandsaw. A high quality plasma is about the same cost as ten high quality chainsaws. Likely the same not sure as I have never looked a low quality is likely the same as ten low quality chainsaws. I find the frustration level to high to buy pos tools.
 
I used to sell Cebora (Italy) plasma cutters (under the AstroPneumatic label) to the automotive repair and restoration shops. Very affordable. As has been mentioned make sure that you use dry air. Loosen the tip retainer and rotate the air nozzle occasionally to even the consumption of the air jet hole since as you move the torch, one side will slowly elongate.Try to hold the torch perpendicular to the material being cut. ALWAYS make sure that the ground clamp is connected before cutting ....do not try to cut without a good connection. The pilot arc feature is only used to initiate the plasma arc, not to maintain it....if you run it while not cutting (waving it in the air like a StarWars lightsabre) you can easily consume the inside of the torch head as there is no other grounded path for the energy that would normally be doing the cutting to go.That was an expensive mistake for customers that did not read the book of instructions.
 
Question for those with the proper knowledge on this kinda stuff.

My breaker is 50Amp 2 pole single throw. Basically two 50Amp breakers coupled together. IS my total current draw 100 Amps?

There is a version of the above Bestarc cutter, that is 65Amp, currently on backorder, i.e. not available. I'm tempted to hold out for the 65Amp, but wondering about my electrical situation and whether or not if I have to rework the breaker box.

This is what I currently have.
1701451153925.png

Do I simply R&R with this?
1701451320683.png
 
A "double 50" breaker lets you draw 50 amps at 240-ish volts. Check the docs on the 65-amp plasma, it probably doesn't need more than 50 amps of input current, but probably has 65 amps output current (implying lower output voltage than input).
 
A "double 50" breaker lets you draw 50 amps at 240-ish volts. Check the docs on the 65-amp plasma, it probably doesn't need more than 50 amps of input current, but probably has 65 amps output current (implying lower output voltage than input).
The max input current on the BTC500 is 40A @ 220V; the BTC650 is 49A. The NEC recognizes the intermittent nature of welding operations and allows wiring with a reduced ampacity and a breaker rated higher than the conductors when the duty cycle of the equipment is considered. A bunch of interpreting required to get it right when doing this, but the easy answer in your case, with no messing with duty cycle, is a 50A circuit is more than adequate for either machine.

Article 630 in NFPA 70 is the source on this stuff if you're really interested.
 
A "double 50" breaker lets you draw 50 amps at 240-ish volts. Check the docs on the 65-amp plasma, it probably doesn't need more than 50 amps of input current, but probably has 65 amps output current (implying lower output voltage than input).

Yup. I found the manual but does not address the electrical source. I wrote to the company, and will see what response I get back.
 
The max input current on the BTC500 is 40A @ 220V; the BTC650 is 49A. The NEC recognizes the intermittent nature of welding operations and allows wiring with a reduced ampacity and a breaker rated higher than the conductors when the duty cycle of the equipment is considered. A bunch of interpreting required to get it right when doing this, but the easy answer in your case, with no messing with duty cycle, is a 50A circuit is more than adequate for either machine.

Article 630 in NFPA 70 is the source on this stuff if you're really interested.

Thanks! :yes: 👍
 
My breaker is 50Amp 2 pole single throw. Basically two 50Amp breakers coupled together. IS my total current draw 100 Amps?
It's 50Amp for the breaker not 100Amp, you must check the wire size and wire run if you want to up breaker size to make sure the wire size can handle the extra amps. Remember if your shop runs on the 50 amp breaker and not just the welder or cutter then you would need to add extra load amps for the compressor and other things. If you need to rewire here is a good source for wire and price.
Nassau National Cable
You would need to calculate wire size for amps needed and the run.
Wire size calculator
 
It's 50Amp for the breaker not 100Amp, you must check the wire size and wire run if you want to up breaker size to make sure the wire size can handle the extra amps. Remember if your shop runs on the 50 amp breaker and not just the welder or cutter then you would need to add extra load amps for the compressor and other things. If you need to rewire here is a good source for wire and price.
Nassau National Cable
You would need to calculate wire size for amps needed and the run.
Wire size calculator

I have a dedicated breaker for the welder which is what I plan to use for the plasma. Using the calculator, it looks like my 40' extension cable is a bit under what is required. I bought what I thought was correct is 8awg, whereas the calculator says to buy 6awg. I've never really cranked up the welder to its max, and it does give me the length so I can move my work outside. I've welded at 120A whereas the machine will dial up to 220A or 240A. It all seems like magic to me the Volts vs the Amps via the internal transformer. Bottom line, I have no idea what is flowing thru the wires. Guess I'll have to be careful, and possibly expect a wire failure or popping the breakers if I try and weld up something real ambitious.

Here is what I have and seems to be okay, at least for what I've put thru it.
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B08HGQPFWJ/ref=ppx_od_dt_b_asin_title_s00?ie=UTF8&th=1
Damn! I see now that the cable I bought is now rated for 40A.

To buy 40' 6awg cable with plugs at both ends, would exceed the price I paid for my welder. 👎
 
Hmmmmm. Power cable for the welder is stamped 10/3, which I take to mean 10awg, course it is only 6 feet long. Does that mean no extension cords allowed, as the welders cable is the limiting factor. You got to have a PhD to get this all just right.
 
Here is what I have and seems to be okay, at least for what I've put thru it.
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B08HGQPFWJ/ref=ppx_od_dt_b_asin_title_s00?ie=UTF8&th=1
Damn! I see now that the cable I bought is now rated for 40A.

To buy 40' 6awg cable with plugs at both ends, would exceed the price I paid for my welder. 👎
You're fine. The duty cycle for the machines you're looking at is 60% at max output. The factor I mentioned in my previous post for 60% duty cycle is 0.78. Max input current for the larger cutter is 49A. The current carrying capacity required for your conductors is 49A x 0.78 = 38A

If it's voltage drop you're worried about, don't. Remember, the machine will run down to 110VAC input (with reduced output). Unlike an induction motor, it's not real sensitive to voltage. It's also very likely your line voltage is 240V -- it is almost everywhere in the US -- so even a 20V drop would still be above what's required by the machine for max output.
 
Hmmmmm. Power cable for the welder is stamped 10/3, which I take to mean 10awg, course it is only 6 feet long. Does that mean no extension cords allowed, as the welders cable is the limiting factor. You got to have a PhD to get this all just right.
Strictly speaking, the cord and extension are not covered by the NEC, which applies to "premises wiring" and does not include anything beyond your receptacle. But the NEC is conservative and you're unlikely to have trouble if you at least use it as a guide.
 
You're fine. The duty cycle for the machines you're looking at is 60% at max output. The factor I mentioned in my previous post for 60% duty cycle is 0.78. Max input current for the larger cutter is 49A. The current carrying capacity required for your conductors is 49A x 0.78 = 38A

If it's voltage drop you're worried about, don't. Remember, the machine will run down to 110VAC input (with reduced output). Unlike an induction motor, it's not real sensitive to voltage. It's also very likely your line voltage is 240V -- it is almost everywhere in the US -- so even a 20V drop would still be above what's required by the machine for max output.

Strictly speaking, the cord and extension are not covered by the NEC, which applies to "premises wiring" and does not include anything beyond your receptacle. But the NEC is conservative and you're unlikely to have trouble if you at least use it as a guide.

Thank You!!!
 
Got the reply back from the BestArc. "Hello, 50A breaker is enough, don't worry." -- nice to get additional confirmation.

I had already decided to get the BestArc 2 Gen cutter of 50Amp. The extra $100+ to cut another 2mm cutting thickness, that I might never do, did not make sense.

Good News -- BestArc on their web site has extended their Black Friday sales. $160 with free shipping ChaChing!!!. Hopefully these cutters are warehoused here in the States. I figured this was a deal to jump on and waiting til after Christmas for an even better deal was a hope to much.
 
Indeed. Much it went over my head, but still enlightening.

I've decided to get the Blue One. LOL! A bit more cost but good reviews and the #1 seller, if that means much.

I'll order it sometime after Christmas. Don't even need it til spring time.

View attachment 1132046

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0C6G3SQ3W/ref=ox_sc_act_image_2?smid=A3PBBBQFQLG1L7&th=1
I see that one (like most import cutters today has a built in torch height interface (2 prong plug) second from the bottom. The issue with that is, different CNC plasma tables use different raw voltage multipliers so you have to determine exactly what the machine is in putting to the connector as the incorrect raw voltage will screw up the table's torch height controller software.
 
I see that one (like most import cutters today has a built in torch height interface (2 prong plug) second from the bottom. The issue with that is, different CNC plasma tables use different raw voltage multipliers so you have to determine exactly what the machine is in putting to the connector as the incorrect raw voltage will screw up the table's torch height controller software.

CNC equipment is so far out of my league it is nearly impossible to imagine. More so then Junior Soprano and his dreams of Angie Dickinson. :yes:

1701699420322.png
 
Not really. Today's CNC plasma tables have very user friendly proprietary software that eliminates the tedious inputting of G codes to control a table. Pretty much plug and play today. All the 'grunt work' is handled by the software and your laptop computer which directly interfaces with the table via a serial cable. The old buzzword was 'Conversational Programming' and that has been taken to a new level by the software. The issue is, you have to buy a table with the most user friendly software package and for me, that is a Langmuir Systems table. I also have conversational programming on my Bridgeport Versa-Trak vertical mill but it's a bit more complex than a modern plasma table as in not real user friendly and being an old fart I'm not overly versed in programming anyway.

I looked hard at every plasma table before I settled on Langmuir. They have the best software package of anyone and the most 'user friendly' plus they host an online forum for owners where you can ask any questions you might have and get answers quick.

I bought a table simply to cut parts (in steel and aluminum) that I was sub contracting out and having to wait for them, sometimes a long wait depending on how busy the sub contractor was and then paying for that. Easier for me to bring that in house and not have to wait plus it's a for profit thing now instead of a revenue drainer. If I need say 'X' part, it's already saved as a file on the laptop so all I have to do is put the appropriate gage of material on the table, attach the air line to the plasma cutter, grab the laptop from the house (the one I'm posting this on btw), plug it into the table, download the file and cut the parts and I don't even need to be watching, the machine knows what to do.

Lots of people buy tables to make what I refer to as 'artsy-fartsy' stuff like custom signage and custom furniture stuff which I'm not interested in at all and most software comes with many designs you can custom modify to make (cut) whatever you want to and it can be a very profitable venture I've been told. Again, I got it to cut parts I was subbing out and nothing else.

Couple things that ally to ALL plasma cutters no matter what make they are is:
They have to be supplied with clean (particle free compressed air) and it has to be moisture free as well. I suggest you buy a point of use Motorgard cannister air filter (5 micron pass) filter and attach it to the air inlet port on the plasma cutter, The Motorgard filter has a replaceable element inside that will remove 100% of any moisture and any particles that may be present in your compressed air supply and are very easily replaceable. In fact most all Motorgard filters will come with additional elements and they are very easy to change. They are in Amazon or you can buy them direct from the Motorgard website. I use the 5 micron filter attached directly to the back of the plasma cutters, I actually have 3 units and all of them have Motorgard cannister filter on them.

Dirty air is death on any plasma cutter. One, it will foul the air solenoid inside the cutter and secondly, it will destroy the consumables in the torch head quickly. No plasma cutter likes dirty air, especially dirty air with moisture in it. and the Motorgard filters aren't that expensive either. Think I paid around 70 bucks for mine when I bought them and I bought all 3 from the Amazon website.

Second thing you need is a compressor that will supply compressed air in the quantity and pressure your plasma cutter requires. Most of them will require clean compressed air around 4-6 CFM and sufficient pressure as well. Depending on the unit that can be from 90 psi to 120 psi. Compressed air is the medium that projects the plasma arc and allows it to cut metal. The specifications on the unit you purchase will determine both the supplied CFM as well as the required pressure, they are all different but if the pressure drops below the minimum required pressure the unit won't cut and if there is moisture in the air supply, it will destroy the consumables in the torch head quickly. Tips, electrodes and swirl rings won't last long at all.

Third, always wear a welding hood when cutting. The arc produced by any cutter is the same as a welding arc so always wear a hood and set it to at least shade 10 or better ff you have an auto dark hood. If you don't, a standard shade 12 works well as well. Wear suitable welding attire as well. The plasma arc produces ultraviolet rays the can cause severe sunburn on expose skin and I'd suggest a face respirator as well. I use a 3M one with replaceable cartridges, they are cheap and work well. Plasma cutting metal will give off noxious fumes, just like welding does.

I use an auto dark hood with 'grind mode' myself. I like the grind mode because I can leave the hood down and actually see what I'm grinding because the lens in the hood is clear.

Finally, all plasma cutters will produce 'dross' and particles of the cut material will drop to the floor or collect on your welding bench and need to be cleaned up. They are gritty and you don't want to be tracking that stuff into your house on the bottoms of your shoes-boots.

Hope that helps but don't depend on the tiny separator that is suppled with most plasma cutters today to 'clean the air and remove any entrained moisture' because they won't. You need a point of use filter of sufficient capacity to remove the contaminants.

Myself, I have a refrigerated dryer on my main air line from the compressor but moisture will still collect in the flexible line between the air supply QD fittings and the plasma cutter point of entry, why I use point of entry Motorgard filters.
 

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