been training a groundie for a month or so, always close supervision when using the saw, today was the first day i let him cut on his own. 10 min later he kills the saw walks over to me and says he cut himself. got real lucky,just a flesh wound ,six stitches, no tendons etc.
wounded groundie
- Thread starter coydog
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Kevin
Addicted to ArboristSite
Where did he cut himself and how?
Spooky, wasn't it?
Ya know what though? For many people it takes a little jolt of reality to countersink a point home. Believe me, you should celebrate because it was relatively minor, it could've been worse. Things like this make us better or we're in the wrong business. If he remains a helper for you, you're gonna have to invest a little observation time for a bit, see if it will happen again or that he learned from it successfully.
Ya know what though? For many people it takes a little jolt of reality to countersink a point home. Believe me, you should celebrate because it was relatively minor, it could've been worse. Things like this make us better or we're in the wrong business. If he remains a helper for you, you're gonna have to invest a little observation time for a bit, see if it will happen again or that he learned from it successfully.
Doing some storm work, I have about 15 trees to fell and cut up, I had him cut all the bushy stuff that wasn't under tension while I was working about 20 feet away on another tree. He cut through a branch and lost his balance and brought the saw down on his inside ankle missed his achilles by about a centimeter.
Kneejerk Bombas
ArboristSite King
That's how we weed out the bad groundmen, give 'em a saw and no training, and send them out cutting. If they come back unhurt, they are hired. If they get cut, we just push them through the chipper. 
John Paul Sanborn
Above average climber
Comon Mike, he said he was traning him for 4 weeks! What do you do, make them drag for a year before touching a saw?
I had a very similar situation as Coy, went off to talk with somone else and the guy over reached. Thank got for syntrifical clutches. The brake engaged and the sharp teeth cut into the side of his knee.
That was not far from you Mike, out on Abitzs Rd. 'tween Cushing and Waterville Rd.
I had a very similar situation as Coy, went off to talk with somone else and the guy over reached. Thank got for syntrifical clutches. The brake engaged and the sharp teeth cut into the side of his knee.
That was not far from you Mike, out on Abitzs Rd. 'tween Cushing and Waterville Rd.
Kneejerk Bombas
ArboristSite King
I worked on abitz a few times over the years.
So did you put him through the chipper?
So did you put him through the chipper?
John Paul Sanborn
Above average climber
I did think of making him walk home
I'm glad we had a pickup out with us on that job. I was able to let him go to the clinic for stitches by his lonesome.
I'm glad we had a pickup out with us on that job. I was able to let him go to the clinic for stitches by his lonesome.
gene martin
ArboristSite Lurker
CUT
Made me laugh, cuz i dont think there are any tree service related individuals out thtere that have been around it "awhile", that dont have a nick or two! cracked 020t handle left 4 good cuts on finger, and 044 gave me lil scar on left knee. Kinda like that climber that calls for a job and they always say " I have never hit anything or crushed anything"! Either they are new to the field or real lucky,, fences always seem to move!
Made me laugh, cuz i dont think there are any tree service related individuals out thtere that have been around it "awhile", that dont have a nick or two! cracked 020t handle left 4 good cuts on finger, and 044 gave me lil scar on left knee. Kinda like that climber that calls for a job and they always say " I have never hit anything or crushed anything"! Either they are new to the field or real lucky,, fences always seem to move!
Jumper
Addicted to ArboristSite
I am curious-did this guy have on chainsaw pants and\or a good pair of leather boots? I have a pair of the former that protect the bottom of my legs right to my feet, thus the likelihood of getting injured in this manner is reduced, though given Murphy, not totally eliminated. Like a post above, i think everyone here will get cut one day.
John Paul Sanborn
Above average climber
If you ain't bleedin, you aint workin!!!
Nickrosis
Manned by Boderators
Good to see you again, Jumper!
FSburt
ArboristSite Operative
where's the chaps. I have been training new sawyers to precommercial thin plantations and have yet to make it through the first week without sombody nicking their chaps. Most are during idle down with the chain still spinning and trying to walk and pull leg into chain. I 've only seen one that saw was running at agood clip when it bit him but he was thankful for kevlar because he did not even relize what had happened until his saw died and he looked down the see all the yellow fibers clogging the chain and clutch. $100 for chaps is a good investment. I'm sure there are some guys out there with some scars on the knees and legs to second that opinion. Take care and watch the demon it has no conscience and will cut whateveer is put in front of it.
Nickrosis
Manned by Boderators
Agreed. I've heard of a pair of chaps taking a Husky at full bore while they were laid across a log. The professor smashed the bar down - nothing touched the log. I would consider them a worthwhile investment.
Nickrosis
Nickrosis
no chaps, I think that I'll get some now. Seen several knicks and cuts before, but they always seem to happen to more experienced sawyers that get careless, In all honesty, I've never used or worked on a crew that used chaps. not to say thats a reason for not using them I guess it's just easy to get tunnel vision when you grow up using a saw, anyway, I have a hell of a time finding and keeping good groundies, the last one just couldn't seem to "get it" that it wasn't a good idea to stand on or in front of the rope during rigging operations, and its always a good feeling when you look down and theyv'e got the rope wrapped around their wrist for extra holding power. I haven't had one learn a bowline yet. I just had an idea while writing this thread, because I was going to ask for opinions on training new groundies, maybe if being able to tie a bowline was a prerequisite to using a saw it woulsd at least insure they were paying attention, maybe I should start them at a lower wage with the incentive for a raise after learning to perform certain skills? right now I pay my groundies 10 an hour.
Chain brake, well used and alert can take you far!
If ya ain't paying the BeaST (Blood, Sweat and Tears), ya ain't werking hard enough!
If ya ain't paying the BeaST (Blood, Sweat and Tears), ya ain't werking hard enough!
Nickrosis
Manned by Boderators
Try starting them at $9/hour. After 30 days, go over a checklist of things they were expected to learn: chipper safety and operation, proper use of PPE, how to tie 3 knots, 4 forces of a chainsaw bar, etc. If they pass, throw them the buck you were going to give them anyways.
To facilitate this, I highly recommend getting the Tailgate Safety manual from the NAA. We recently revised our employee manual and employee handbook. By having the TS program, we were able to cross-reference information, saying read pages blank to blank for more information.
Nickrosis
To facilitate this, I highly recommend getting the Tailgate Safety manual from the NAA. We recently revised our employee manual and employee handbook. By having the TS program, we were able to cross-reference information, saying read pages blank to blank for more information.
Nickrosis
groundies
What,your saws don't idle with the chain break on??? Time for new toys for the guys I'd say. Husky pants work but so should your new saw idle with the break on. Aside from the $100 pants I'd look for saws that idle with the break on. If you withhold the $ an hour till the ground guy is trained, he has earned enough for you to give him a saw that idles with the break on and the new pants. He will think of it as a bonus for good preformance and you will have guys that preform good. X weeks for the pants and Y weeks more for the saw that idles with the break on,then bring them up to scale and tell them they are responsible, to get their own from now on .
What,your saws don't idle with the chain break on??? Time for new toys for the guys I'd say. Husky pants work but so should your new saw idle with the break on. Aside from the $100 pants I'd look for saws that idle with the break on. If you withhold the $ an hour till the ground guy is trained, he has earned enough for you to give him a saw that idles with the break on and the new pants. He will think of it as a bonus for good preformance and you will have guys that preform good. X weeks for the pants and Y weeks more for the saw that idles with the break on,then bring them up to scale and tell them they are responsible, to get their own from now on .
John Paul Sanborn
Above average climber
Ya learn the bo'lin .15/hour raise
Clove .10/hour
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I see ya put the chain break on the saw every time it is cutting, +.10/hour
I work with different people so often that I have this mantra the first few times.
"put on some gloves, and hold the end of the rope over by that tree.
Dont take any wraps in your hands or arms.
Ensure that you are not standing on the rope.
When i cut the limb, let the load fall a little before you stop it...."
Been told i sound like a flight atendant.
Sorta the same with a saw, " break is on at all times that the saw is not actualy cutting. Use two hands at all time, no mater what you see me do
Clove .10/hour
.
.
.
.
I see ya put the chain break on the saw every time it is cutting, +.10/hour
I work with different people so often that I have this mantra the first few times.
"put on some gloves, and hold the end of the rope over by that tree.
Dont take any wraps in your hands or arms.
Ensure that you are not standing on the rope.
When i cut the limb, let the load fall a little before you stop it...."
Been told i sound like a flight atendant.
Sorta the same with a saw, " break is on at all times that the saw is not actualy cutting. Use two hands at all time, no mater what you see me do
Very good JP!
i think that chain brake and not turning at idle are 2 diffrent safety factors.
Every once in a while someone comes up with a real good saw etc......... OOOOOps, no chain brake ? Can't touch it! Give'em the speach and i'm off the hook! Who says safety equipment always gets in the way?, make it work for you!
Any way i wouldn't use saw wtihout one anyway, and enact the chain break constantly. Even if i one hand saw in tree, i will bump chain break after cut, saw off or not. Sometimes bumping it on one hand reach to target in the reverse fashion.
i think that chain brake and not turning at idle are 2 diffrent safety factors.
Every once in a while someone comes up with a real good saw etc......... OOOOOps, no chain brake ? Can't touch it! Give'em the speach and i'm off the hook! Who says safety equipment always gets in the way?, make it work for you!
Any way i wouldn't use saw wtihout one anyway, and enact the chain break constantly. Even if i one hand saw in tree, i will bump chain break after cut, saw off or not. Sometimes bumping it on one hand reach to target in the reverse fashion.
