Tuning - pulling damn hair out! Take my carb!

[Vintage Engine Repairs]

Hey guys,

Had some excellent tuning advice from many experienced people here, on YouTube and using manuals. For the FRIGGIN LIFE OF ME I can’t tune my ms 180 with AM copy of a Walbro 215.


The saw is flawless, it’s brand new and the carb (non adjustable) it came with, man the saw just screams and has wicked throttle response.

Putting the AM in, and matter who’s instruction I follow, I get bogging when I open the throttle. Spent about 6 hours over 3 days during the past couple weeks trying with ZERO success.

Can someone who owns an ms 180 and has a lot of experience with tuning please take this damn carb and see if they can get it to work? I’ll pay postage to you and you can keep it. I just want to know if it’s me or not

I cleaned the carb 5-6 tines and adjusted the metering level correctly.

I feel like I have tried everything.

Thanks heaps in advance guys will happily post world wide.

And yeah, here is me ripping my hair out...

 

[Bob Hedgecutter]

The AM carb is a dud?
That would be my first guesstimation.
Second guesstimation would be you goofed something up in the conversion from what the carb is meant to fit, to what you want it to fit.

Pretty good supporting evidence for stick with the OEM, use an MS 180 for what it was intended to be used for and don't expect to hotrod it. They work okay with the non adjustable carb they come with.

 

[trains]

its the carb. I have had pretty average results from these chinc clones

edited to add.

And what did I say about putting that 215 clone on your good saw ????????????

 

[Vintage Engine Repairs]

its the carb. I have had pretty average results from these chinc clones

edited to add.

And what did I say about putting that 215 clone on your good saw ????????????

I know I know I just couldn’t resist or wait for the new top end to arrive .
I’m young and impatient and kinda stupid in that respect, but I just want to learn so badly.

 

[Vintage Engine Repairs]

The AM carb is a dud?
That would be my first guesstimation.
Second guesstimation would be you goofed something up in the conversion from what the carb is meant to fit, to what you want it to fit.

Pretty good supporting evidence for stick with the OEM, use an MS 180 for what it was intended to be used for and don't expect to hotrod it. They work okay with the non adjustable carb they come with.

I completely agree! I love the non adjustable it’s wonderful, I just heard others have such good success tuning their 180’s easily with w-215’s and I want to learn to tune, but just can’t get it. I don’t intend to keep it in there, I just really want to learn tuning. I will bin the carb. @trains I promise I won’t put It back in my good saw lol

 

[Vintage Engine Repairs]

On a more positive note... I cleared space in my office wardrobe and picked up a desk that is the perfect size. This will be my rebuild area and be able to close the doors and keep things clean and fairly dust free in there. Just need to figure out a good light

 

[Whiskers]

If you want to learn to tune, start with a know good adjustable carb not some aftermarket dodgy 50/50 garbage carb. Sounds like you’ve already wasted 6 hours, but at least you’ve learned something about am carbs.

 

[Matt93eg]

I have tried the chicom carbs as well as the kits. I’m not using either anymore. I have had better luck with kits than the actual complete carbs but it’s just not worth the hassle to me anymore.

 

[alexcagle]

They are the carb of last resort.
OEM Carburetors are designed and machined down to the micron on certain parts to achieve uniformity. Can you imagine how hard it is to get the jetting of a non-adjustable carb to perform correctly on a saw sent sent to all areas of the world, and in different climates and altitudes?

I've seen several of those chinese carbs tune too rich at an eighth of a turn out on the idle adjustment needle.
That kind of speaks to how close their design tolerances are.
Their throttle shafts aren't chrome, which is an obvious shortcut.
It's like they invested 95% of the time and money in reverse engineering a product, only to have the final 5% of detail and quality control cause it to be unusable crap.

 

[alexcagle]

Sounds like you’ve already wasted 6 hours, but at least you’ve learned something about am carbs.

You are 100% correct.
Been there, done that. Got a T-shirt for it.......

 

[Vintage Engine Repairs]

Cheers guys, I really appreciate the response, the carb is in the bin. I won’t make that mistake again.

 

[Cease232]

If the saw or carb has an issue you can turn those screws all day and it’s not going to respond appropriately. As whiskers said start with a good running saw, make minor adjustments and listen for the change in RPMs/4 stroking. Once you get an ear for proper tune it’ll make diagnosing problems much easier.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

 

[Vintage Engine Repairs]

If the saw or carb has an issue you can turn those screws all day and it’s not going to respond appropriately. As whiskers said start with a good running saw, make minor adjustments and listen for the change in RPMs/4 stroking. Once you get an ear for proper tune it’ll make diagnosing problems much easier.

Thanks mate I have binned this one nownthough, will just put genuine stihl carby in. Learn my lesson!

 

[Gord404]

Part of your learning curve, comes with the CAD

 

[BangBang77]

Over the course of my career, I became a Six Sigma Master Black Belt, often mentoring and coaching other engineers and managers in the Six Sigma processes and methodologies to improve operational performance.

A simple equation that I always taught and hold dear to my heart is y = f (x), where y = output and x = input. The equation basically states that output is a direct function of input and is a fancy way of saying crap in / crap out.

Your operational difficulties are directly related to the quality of the AM components you have procured. Stick with OEM for all critical components, i.e. bearings, seals, carbs, pistons/cylinders, cranks. Buy once, cry once. Can you get the occasional good quality AM component? Yes, but even a broken watch is correct twice a day.

Leave the AM purchases to covers and non-essential components that are not directly related to overall performance of the equipment. Just my two cents...

 

[Bobby Kirbos]

Friends don't let friends buy ****** carburetors.

 

[Vintage Engine Repairs]

Over the course of my career, I became a Six Sigma Master Black Belt, often mentoring and coaching other engineers and managers in the Six Sigma processes and methodologies to improve operational performance.

A simple equation that I always taught and hold dear to my heart is y = f (x), where y = output and x = input. The equation basically states that output is a direct function of input and is a fancy way of saying crap in / crap out.

Your operational difficulties are directly related to the quality of the AM components you have procured. Stick with OEM for all critical components, i.e. bearings, seals, carbs, pistons/cylinders, cranks. Buy once, cry once. Can you get the occasional good quality AM component? Yes, but even a broken watch is correct twice a day.

Leave the AM purchases to covers and non-essential components that are not directly related to overall performance of the equipment. Just my two cents...

Thanks for the comment mate, it’s much appreciated! It’s an important lesson to learn, and very valuable!

 

[Vintage Engine Repairs]

Friends don't let friends buy ****** carburetors.

Haha

 

[Vintage Engine Repairs]

Part of your learning curve, comes with the CAD

Thanks mate, no harm done this time with AM but valuable lessons learnt!

 

[svk]

It's like they invested 95% of the time and money in reverse engineering a product, only to have the final 5% of detail and quality control cause it to be unusable crap.

Isn't that the truth!