"Green" Bar oil question?

[Adirondack]

I like the idea of being friendly to the woods and not slinging motor oil all over everything. I would not dump my used motor oil out in the woods so it only makes sense to use the Green stuff. I bought a gallon of environmentally friendly stuff from Bailey's. I was wondering if it was any different from Canola oil? I saw a post where someone was using canola oil, which sparked my question. Is using canola oil that a good idea? I think the issue is how well the oil 'sticks' to the bar. What is the origin of Bailey's stuff? I was thinking if it was basically the same stuff as canola I can get that very cheap and save in the pocket as well as the environment. Let's hear from the experts.
Thanks

 

[volks-man]

i am not an expert.

canola works.
i am currently using a blend of mostly canola and a little bar oil (was left in the jug).
it seems to work fine. it does leave the bar easier so i turn the oiler up.

i have not yet had a problem with it. but i do hear that when stored the oil can harden and gum up the oil system. to that end i suggest flushing out the oil tank with mix and then running regular bar oil the last few times you plan to cut before a long storage.

 

[HolmenTree]

I'm not an oil expert but Stihl had or maybe still has a bio degradable chainoil called bio plus. Its not cheap but then it depends how much your willing to protect yourself. According to my Husqvarna owners manual regular chain oil mist off a rotating chain is a health hazard.

 

[Adirondack]

Volks-man

Thanks for the info. What do you mean flush out with mix? Thanks.

 

[willsaw4beer]

I like the idea of being friendly to the woods and not slinging motor oil all over everything. I would not dump my used motor oil out in the woods so it only makes sense to use the Green stuff. I bought a gallon of environmentally friendly stuff from Bailey's. I was wondering if it was any different from Canola oil? I saw a post where someone was using canola oil, which sparked my question. Is using canola oil that a good idea? I think the issue is how well the oil 'sticks' to the bar. What is the origin of Bailey's stuff? I was thinking if it was basically the same stuff as canola I can get that very cheap and save in the pocket as well as the environment. Let's hear from the experts.
Thanks

Try it out and report back. I used it in a crappy old Craftsman for cutting barbecque wood but I would not even think about using it in a saw I cared about. I would worry about crust forming in the oiler and wear to the bar...

 

[volks-man]

Volks-man

Thanks for the info. What do you mean flush out with mix? Thanks.

empty the oil tank. pour some gas/oil fuel mix in to the tank. replace cap and shake the dikcens out of the saw. then dispose of the 'rinse' in a responsible way (like a little at a time in the lawnmower).


disclaimer: i am not an expert. use canola at your own risk.

 

[Orange Hill]

Have you thought about the longevity of your lubrication system. Unless the oil is mineral oil based I would worry about rancid gumming of the vegetable oil and bacterial spoilage unless you run a constant supply. Read the directions on the "green oils" and they mention how the system must be flushed for storage. Regular bar oil is biodegradable to some degree. Each year billions of gallons of oil seep up from the ocean floor and is dissipated with minimal impact. On our family ranch there has been steady cutting of firewood every year with chainsaws for over 50 years and I can see no evident impact from the 100's of gallons of bar oil used in just a dozen or so acres where we cut. I would not use it unless I were mandated to do so. Petroleum bar oil is cheaper and has better anti-wear properties then the eco stuff. But that is just the way I think. I like my bar oil of the organic variety, meaning carbon based. Hold on there is a knock at the door and a black helicopter flying over my house...

 

[Adirondack]

Thanks for the posts. Does anyone know the difference between bailey's green stuff and canola oil? I assume it is some type of vegetable oil?

 

[habanero]

I just bought my first gallon of bio-based bar oil last fall. It is made by a local company called Renewable Lubricants that has an entire line of bio-based oils and greases. I was, and still am, a little skeptical of it, but so far I have to say I've been impressed by it. At least in their case, they start with a vegetable oil base stock (usually canola), then add in tackifiers, friction modifiers, and anti-oxidants.

Straight vegetable oils would go rancid pretty quickly, and probably wouldn't cling to the chain as well as regular bar oil, but purpose-made bar oil from vegetable oil stock is a lot more stable and should perform very closely to petroleum based products. I do have some concern about the bio lubricant adversely affecting plastic and rubber components in the oiler system, but on my old homelites about the only rubber components I worry about are the o-rings on the manual oiler. I rigged up a spare manual oiler to stay filled with the bio lubricant and have kept it next to my woodstove since November (elevated temperatures should accelerate degradation) and so far it still works fine.

 

[Taxmantoo]

On the stale oil issue:
Veggie oils have differing shelf lives, I'm sure you can find a list somewhere if you search.

For example:
Linseed oil would be horrible (it's used for a wood finish, not food oil, I think it's poisonous),
soy oil gums up quickly but not like linseed,
canola/rapeseed is probably the slowest gumming oil you'll find cheap on the grocer's shelves. I'd stick to canola and not leave it in the saw long term.

 

[Mad Professor]

I've used the stihl veggie oil in my 066 when milling, works great.

The main reason was so I can mulch my blueberries with the sawdust.

 

[2dogs]

For several years now I have been using Stihl Bio Plus. I am not a full time professional but I do a fair amount of cutting. A 5 gallon jug will last me from 3 to 6 weeks so the price ($75.00/5 gal) is not a huge factor. On those jobs where I am working for my employer he buys the bio bar oil. For the last 30 years I have rinsed out the oil tank every 6 months or so with saw mix. I see no difference in performance between petro and bio bar oil and i se no "build up" of residue in the oil tank or anywhere else. Bio Plus washed out of clothing and chaps easier and also cleans off the saw and bar easier than petro oil.

I also filter all my used cooking oil (canola only) into my stock of bar oil without any problems.

Much of the work I do is in watersheds or directly in a river channel. Using bio oil, including Stihl ultra is a no brainer. I have found the customer is very happy to hear what we are using. At times when bidding a job the other person will refuse to use bio oil and we end up with the job before the bids are opened. I would highly recommend the use of bio oil for most jobs.

Having said all that I use bulk oil on jobs where I will be using alot of oil every day. $75.00 every 10 days or 2 weeks does get expensive.

 

[teacherman]

Used motor oil makes me want to

What is Stihl's bio oil made from? I may start using it, because I am president of my community garden, and it would promote the clean green stewardship ethic we are attempting to model for others.

 

[HolmenTree]

good points about the bio chain oil, easier to clean work clothes and saw. Probably more healthier for your skin and lungs too. Like my Husqvarna owners manual says ,chainoil mist is a hazard.

 

[BlueRider]

Ive been using Stihl Bio+ bar oil for almost 2 years. I started using it because I was milling some wood in what was going to become an organic vineyard. I liked it so much I gave away a full gallon of dino bar oil.

A couple of weeks ago I got out my saws after storing for about 4 months and every thing was just fine, same as last year. I have found that when putting a saw away for a long time it is best to wipe any excess oil of the saw and bar as it can get a bit crusty. The crusty oil will wipe off with a oil soaked rag so it is not too big of a problem.

 

[Labman]

Fromhttp://www.arboristsite.com/showthread.php?t=81213

I know a lot more about oil based paint than chain saws. Most vegetable oils are unsaturated and will harden on exposure to heat or air, and lead isn't the only metal that will catalyze it. I have really dumped on the idea of using them as motor oil on another forum.

Bar oil is different. It isn't expected to be in use for months at a time. It is quickly transfered into the enviroment where the highly stable hydrocarbons in conventional oils take a long time to degrade. Using a vegetable oil should help the enviroment a little, and besides I like American farmers more than of many of those we buy crude oil from.

We don't want our saws gummed up either. If you have had trouble, your idea of blending it in may work. You might also make the last fill of the day all mineral oil.

I can't say if the vegetable oil would work in a saw used every day. As homeowner whose saw sets for months at a time, I would never risk it.

Note, brake fluid attacks almost any solid or gummy organic material. Ever spill any on the paint on your car?

 

[Labman]

....
For example:
Linseed oil would be horrible (it's used for a wood finish, not food oil, I think it's poisonous),
s....

With the decline in the use of oil based paint, they are now marketing linseed as flax seed oil to the health nuts. They can even buy dog foods with it.

 

[Nitroman]

good points about the bio chain oil, easier to clean work clothes and saw. Probably more healthier for your skin and lungs too. Like my Husqvarna owners manual says ,chainoil mist is a hazard.

How often do you stand at the end of the bar with the motor running flat out? The oil mist is considered hazardous (not just from bar oil), because the oil would cover the surface of the alveoli preventing the transfer of oxygen to blood. It won't matter whether you use green freak oil or organic dino based oil. Now if the chain is in the wood, how much mist is created? Better slow it down if worried about it.

Why not use peanut oil? At least it smells good.

 

[ray benson]

I have used canola oil for the last 2 years. Saws are drained around December and refilled in the spring. No trouble so far.
http://www.arboristsite.com/showthread.php?t=38827&highlight=canola+oil

 

[habanero]

Labman's right about the potential problems with untreated vegetable oils, but bio-based bar oils aren't just plain oil. The additive package should, if designed properly, give the oils plenty of shelf/tank life.

That being said, though, even untreated canola is stable for an awful long time under "normal" conditions. Several years ago I managed an oilseeds chemisty research lab at Oklahoma State and we did a lot of shelf-life studies with various vegetable oils. We had some canola samples that had sat for months at 120 degrees farenheit under an oxygen atmosphere (probably the worst possible conditions an oil would ever see as storage conditions) with insignificant change in physical properties of the oil. Of course the oil had some funky odor molecules giving it a definite "off" odor, but we don't really care how our bar oil smells.