Advice/ideas sharpening chains

[Huskitoter]

Do you file with a clamp on guide?
If so does your filing guide not have a back and front tensioner on it, all the ones I have seen have a bar across the back and front that snugs up against the tiestraps holding the chain snugly.

I've never used a guide. The simple ones I have seen didn't tension the chain. Thanks for the info.

 

[pioneerguy600]

I've never used a guide. The simple ones I have seen didn't tension the chain. Thanks for the info.

In my original post I did mention clamping a guide to that bar and was thinking the chain guide/tensioner would hold the chain chassis in an snug upright position to prevent roll over. I do not use a guide myself but do own 6 of them, made by different manufactures and they all have the tensioning feature. I have tutored a fair number of beginner filers over the years and always start them out using a filing guide to get them to forget any bad habits they may have. After filing with a guide and showing them over and over what they should be looking at to get consistent angles and shape then give them time to free hand file. I took note the OP was using a clamp on filing guide like the ones I have and directed my reply towards him and his original question. I didn`t think of the guides like the FOP and the like that do not have the clamping features.

 

[Philbert]

Sounds good but wouldn't a .050 link want to lay over when you push a file across it? I'm guessing a new bar with a tight groove would be easier to work with than an old bar with a worn groove, especially with no tension on the chain.

Depends how fussy you are; how sharp your file is; how much you are taking off.
Some guys are happy to 'work' with the chain movement. Some guys hold a block of wood up against the opposite side of the chain to keep it steady. The chain filing vise can hold a chain rock solid, especially for guys making race chains, etc.

Philbert

 

[HarleyT]

Yes, that has been my greatest problem with hand filing, is the chain flopping around, and not being held in the correct angle.
But of course the better grinders handle that problem......

 

[HarleyT]

The better grinders have a clamp that locks tight the drive link tangs and holds them solid, so the sharpening "tool" can sharpen them all at the same angle.
For those stalwart "File fans" that have never tried correctly sharpening a chain.....
It is pointless to try and discuss sharpening with those that have already decided that their way is the best.


A file is superior, if the guy doing it does it correctly, compared to guys that cannot use a grinder properly...


A grinder is superior, if compared to a guy that cannot file a chain properly.....

 

[HarleyT]

And everyone here is "SURE" that their way is the "SUPERIOR" one!!!!!

 

[HarleyT]

When I started, I just aimed at making the chain the same as a new one....
I never strayed from that.......
So........

 

[pioneerguy600]

Stop using psychology on us Harley! You can`t fix what aint broke.

 

[HarleyT]

We are all "broken" here actually....
That is kind of why we are here.....

 

[Charlie1124]

Thank you Philbert.y your Replys helped. As far as the being broke.. we all are broke in some way

 

[jchipps]

Okay Charlie,
Let's try to figure out a solution to your dilemma, because I'd genuinely like to help you.
You said you free-hand file when in the field working. Is that correct?

If that's the case you've already won half the battle. I'd really like to help you eliminate any issue you're having, and walk out your door each morning ready to roll.

But if you don't mind sharing, I'll need more info.

I'm assuming your saw work involves those things you mentioned:
Firewood for yourself and selling, Occasional tree work - trimming and removal, Selling to sawmills (I assume that's an occasional butt log from the Tree removal work?) Clarify if I'm assuming anything incorrectly.

How much firewood, and/or how many trees are you normally cutting each day? I'm sure it varies daily, but a rough estimate?

How many saws are you running each day?

What size saws are you running?

Do you have employees, or working alone?

On average, how many times per day are you swapping to a backup chain?

When you do swap, what is your reason for swapping?


After answering the above questions, we can possibly start (Lesson 1)

(You already said you don't care for grinders or dremels etc., so I know you gotta be somewhat smart, and possibly even teachable)

 

[old guy]

I'm an old hand filer but have 4 grinders in my shop. Last week I picked up a nice little Stihl 025 that didn't run well, got it running, now the chain had been abused some so I sat down to file, then noticed the outside corners of the .325 semi chisel chain had been worn back about .025 thou., this will take a lot fileing, so to the grinder it goes.
I do not like the wheel that is on the grinder I have set up for .325 so went to the 3/8 grinder & ground away the bad corners, I thought it looked like not enough hook but threw it back on the bar & took 3 swipes off the rakers, I would normally have taken a file & tuned up those cutters after grinding but did not.
I took it out to some 8'' frozen green white oak and ya know, that chain cut really well.
It's great to have options.

 

[Philbert]

I'm an old hand filer . . .

File the whole hand, or just your nails?

Philbert

 

[old guy]

File the whole hand, or just your nails?

Philbert

Philbert! I shoulda knowed yew was lurkin!, how the heck is ya?

 

[Charlie1124]

Yes I free hand file in the Field.. iv even free hand file a chain when I was climbing and found old barb wire bout 30ft in the tree.. I use the Oregon guide just to set angles. And it makes things simpler for me when I'm at the bench.. set the angle and file depth and go..

I own a tree company. Trimming removal.. clearing acreages. So a daily count of trees varies. Yes trunks from tree jobs go to mill.if not they go to my lot to season and split..
But I also have log buyers looking for certain types. So I'll go out and cut them too.


My main saws are ms200t.. 024 AVSEQ and a ms661. I maintain them all myself.. chains/bars/power head maintenance.

I own countless chains. That have been used by friends and neighbors that have dulled out n just given to me bc they bought a new one. Iv offered to sharpen them but they decline. So I was just looking for a way to sharpen them then rehang them until needed.
I try to avoid sharpeng with chain on bar to be used. To avoid filings in the bar. I normally don't swap chains in the timber. It's easier to sharpen a sharp chain. Then restore a dull chain.

 

[Philbert]

I own countless chains. That have been used by friends and neighbors that have dulled out n just given to me bc they bought a new one. . . . It's easier to sharpen a sharp chain. Then restore a dull chain.

That's a very different situation than your first post: "I tend to sharpen a couple chains a night . . . ". In batches, I much prefer a grinder, especially if cleaning up other people's chains. If you like a final, filed edge, you can always do that at the end to 'sharpen a sharp chain'.

I think most folks that do not like grinders, have never been around someone that uses them correctly.

This.

Philbert

 

[jchipps]

Yes I free hand file in the Field.. iv even free hand file a chain when I was climbing and found old barb wire bout 30ft in the tree.

I try to avoid sharpeng with chain on bar to be used. To avoid filings in the bar. I normally don't swap chains in the timber. It's easier to sharpen a sharp chain.

You free-hand file in the field, but try to avoid sharpening with the chain on the bar to be used, to avoid filings in the bar?

I admit, I'm a little confused by all that.
But sounds like you're pretty adamant on using your file guide, with your chain on a bench, and swapping out to a sharp chain each evening.

Guides and Off-the-Saw filing isn't the way I roll, so unfortunately I can't help you in that regard.
I'll leave it to those with more experience with that sort of thing to give you suggestions on how to best fabricate a good guide filing set-up in your shop.

Good luck

 

[Charlie1124]

So y'all are telling me that everyone single one of you does not have extra chains laying around that you sharpen and use when the time comes?. Ya and I'm uncle Sam. Yes I free hand file in the field when needed BC as iv stated before. It's a hell of alot easier to keep the chain sharp. Then it is to run it dull then try to restore them.
I don't swap chains every evening as there is no need if kept sharp. But there are days I hit metal n dull it beyond saving in the field. Swap n go again.

 

[Philbert]

I have a lot of extra chains. I often sharpen batches (6 -20?) of chains for others. I use a grinder for that.

https://www.arboristsite.com/community/threads/511a-grinder-improvements-tweaks.197073/

I try to have at least 3 chains per saw in the field, and swap them if I hit a rock, or just do not feel like sharpening. Otherwise, I may just touch up with a file and a standard file guide.

I get it: some guys get confused that I just mentioned 3 different ways of having a sharp chain. Don't care. Works for me. Not offended if they do something different.

What makes it work for me is that I 'file as I grind, and grind as I file'. If your cutters look different whether you file or grind, it is a lot of work, and a waste of cutter life, to go back and forth.

Philbert

 

[jchipps]

So y'all are telling me that everyone single one of you does not have extra chains laying around that you sharpen and use when the time comes?

No, there are lots of chain swappers out there. And there's no problem with that, if that's the way you roll.

I personally don't have an excess of chains laying around. I'm not a 'chain swapper'. I'm a chain filer.
When the chain that's on the saw gets dull, regardless of how it got dull, I sharpen it on the spot and move on.

Even when I occasionally hit metal, I sharpen. (this is an instance that a grinder could be helpful for some, but I prefer to file it back myself)

But in the instances that I do hit metal, I DON'T continue boring and burning through it.
I STOP immediately to avoid further damage, file it back and sharpen it, and then choose a different spot to cut ... avoiding the metal object.

When I put a new chain on, it STAYS on the saw until it is worn completely out (other than occasional removal for maintenance etc., cleaning the bar groove, etc.)
With the chain that's on the saw being used, and one backup chain in-case of unforeseen circumstances, I'm comfortable.

It's always good to have extra chains readily available, but all the 'swapping' of chains just makes no sense 'for me', but to each his own.

It's a hell of alot easier to keep the chain sharp. Then it is to run it dull then try to restore them.

I couldn't agree with you more!