Arborist and protesters

[treeseer]

Most of these "Dirty hippies have gone on to become congressmen/women, lawyers, environmentalists, senators, etc."

And consulting arborists.

"Pay for my flight and expenses... I'll have the trees cleaned out, cut down, and hauled off in short order."

Cut first and ask questions later, eh? :monkey:

Brother crouse, my fellow tarheel--I see evidence of this mindset at work all around me. Thanks to this approach, in ten years Raleigh will be like Atlanta, in 30, like Cleveland.

 

[2FatGuys]

Simmer down now... Simmer down...

Themadd1 & Treeseer - Guys... I'm not jumping on ANY bandwagon. Read my profile and you will see that I am an architectural project manager 4 out of 7 days a week. I specialize in construction administration, code interpretation and enforcement, and arbitration. That pays the bills so that I can do what I LOVE the other 3 days... tree work.

My comments are specificaly from a legal and "public responsibility" perspective. I agree that there is a proper place and time to air one's grievances against planned changes in a community, or in a society as a whole. However, the "tactics" being exercised in this example are nothing short of domestic terrorism. These people are holding a legal landowner hostage, preventing them from using their own landholdings as the see fit. This is part of the basis for the formation of our country - private property rights. In this process, they have put the owners of the property (in this case the taxpayers) at a loss for the use of their land. And in this case, the taxpayers are also having to foot the bill of security and sanitation.

Legally, what they are doing is, simply put, tresspassing. They have no legal right to the homesteading they are doing. During this exercise, they have put the public health at risk by storing human fecal matter in a way that meets no health codes. I was always taught that one person's freedoms end where another person's begin. These people, by costing the taxpayer money for their own agenda, have crossed the line of freedom.

Contrary to how you took my comment about cutting the trees, I don't cut for the sake of cutting. I was only offering to help enforce the legal process that has already transpired in this case. The design team and owner have been through their public comment sessions. They have complied with the regulations and requirements placed on them by the jurisdictions having authority over their proposed plans.

Tree - I actually have a HUGE respect for the development process in Raleigh. I've done several projects in the area and the arborculture staff with the city is top notch in enforcing tree retention and replacement. There is a huge amount of development going on in that area. They are doing MUCH better than the other major cities in our state. OH... and FYI... I've lived here all my life but will NEVER accept the title of "tarheel"! I'm a "WoofPacker" through and through.

 

[Fuzly]

Like TreeCo said... Unless you were there or old enough you just dont get it.

Most of these "Dirty hippies have gone on to become congressmen/women, lawyers, environmentalists, senators, etc. They were usually college students that found certain things to be against what we call freedom in the United States.

I think one is running for President, isn't she?

I have experienced some protests in my area in the past few years, anti-mining, anti-logging, and a pro-dope smoking fest. They are mostly college students that really "don't get it". What I mean is they aren't as dedicated as the "original" hippies. Being a hippie is cool until the Sheriff's Department shows up then it's "call Mom & Dad for bail money" time and go home to Madison.

My personal opinion-take a bath, lay off the dope, and graduate so they can get a job and be productive-maybe even see the light and become conservatives.

They are smelly and annoying, but I support their right to express themselves, just like I express my thoughts and opinions. (Star Spangled Banner playing in the distance)

 

[treeseer]

the city is top notch in enforcing tree retention and replacement. They are doing MUCH better than the other major cities in our state.

Well that says zilch for those other cities. Understand that we are looking at the process from opposite perspectives. I do acknowledge there are good people there making good efforts. But many times they are like that protester in Tienanmen Square, hlding a flower in front of a tank.

I'm a "WoofPacker" through and through.

And I bleed dark Blue for the Devils. pm me next time you're in the Triangle. We can have a cold one and climb a tree--not in that order, of course.

Fuz, it sounds like protests in WI have really gone downhill. I remember wearing a scuba suit at a Teddy Kennedy rally in Madtown, waving a "What about Mary Jo" sign.
Those were the days, my friend, I wish they'd never end...
o and thanks dan but it don't matter.

 

[AxeKnot]

Background--Protesters don't want these oaks cut down to make room for an expansion of athletic facilities next to a stadium in Berkeley.

I support the protesters any day of the week over a bunch of steroid ingesting, blood doping, pillpopping sham atheletes!

Marian Jones was once held up as the new hope of athletics! ha ha She was riddled with illegal drugs when she won all those gold medals. Justin Gatlin and the rest of these phoney idiots can get lost - long live the trees!

 

[Bigus Termitius]

I believe that the cream of the "dirty hippies squatting" crop have since already moved on to finish their homework, entertain political pursuits, and enjoy indoor plumbing.

 

[D Mc]

I remember wearing a scuba suit at a Teddy Kennedy rally in Madtown, waving a "What about Mary Jo" sign.

Treeseer, Come on now, be honest. Do you actually remember? or do you just have the picture? :hmm3grin2orange:

D and S Mc

 

[treeseer]

Treeseer, Come on now, be honest. Do you actually remember?

Well it is a little fuzzy, but I do recall it; it was a rare protest against a liberal politician. Picketing the math building for doing research to help the vietnam war, that memory's more vivid. some idiots blew it up a few weeks later. Ho, ho, ho chi minh...

If the last grove of trees (and the ones at berkeley are the last in that part of campus) were about to get the ax to make room for more jock play, for sure I'd've been up em. Legal processes are certainly to be respected, but civil disobedience is a time-honored tradition.

Think Gandhi and ML King. Courage in peaceful action.

 

[moray]

...Think Gandhi and ML King. Courage in peaceful action.

Think the underground railroad. I would have been out at the docks trying to scuttle those slave ships before they could leave for Africa.

You guys bring tears to my eyes dredging up memories of the 60's. Those WERE the days!

 

[smokechase II]

Plan ahead

"Half a dozen sitters left....100 trees. Hmmmm. I have a plan."

I like it.



Really, the best plan (aka sink the slave ships before the underground railroad is needed), is for Universitys to not plant any trees.

Trees cause problems.

 

[oldirty]

If the last grove of trees (and the ones at berkeley are the last in that part of campus) were about to get the ax to make room for more jock play, for sure I'd've been up em. Legal processes are certainly to be respected, but civil disobedience is a time-honored tradition.

Think Gandhi and ML King. Courage in peaceful action.

hey seer. how much money do you think that the school has generated in its name through the "jock play"?

i bet you have never thrown a game winning TD pass or maybe sunk both ends of a one and one, down one to win a game. or thrown a no hitter.
those highs are free but earned through effort and dedication. and also a talent that not many people possess. therefore you, not having much athletic talent, would be against an idea like making a bigger facility for athletes. even at the cost of a few trees, a renewable source.

you see meaningless tree death while i see cramped lockerrooms, out dated shower/bathrooms, and a not up to par weightroom for a multisport division1 athletic program.

those jocks are bringing in an a pretty good amount of money to the school that i dont think the chess team or botany club or even the band can bring in.

whatever though.

 

[Bigus Termitius]

I got it! :monkey:

Can we get the athletes to plant offset trees since no one else looks like they are really up to it, physically, mentally, or emotionally?

 

[tree MDS]

Shush... dont get moray all turned on with too much talk of cramped male locker rooms ! LOL ! yeah, thats right I said it and I'm proud of it - so what ! Man its boring around here lately, I even tried to start a thead on bucket trucks but that fizzled quickly, after some very strong initial response, I was dissapointed. It seems all anyone wants to talk about is dirty hippies or trees pissin on them ! Go figure.

 

[beowulf343]

Protest where protest is due...I don't know the situation or what, but can see points for both sides.
Maybe they can plant more trees to offset the ones they remove...I dunno...

BUT protest can be effective, just last year over here the Gummint decided that we are going to need a new hospital by 2012 and that the most cost effective place to build it (but not doing phased rebuild on site) was next door on 10 acres of the BOTANICAL GARDENS!! Bulldozing 100 year old trees, display houses and collections!!!! The Minister of Health told us to 'get over it' and we (the general taxpaying population of Bermuda, rich, poor, black white, locals, expats) REFUSED! There were town hall meetings, activities in the gardens, the talk shows were hopping, people put green banners on their cars...it worked, the Gummint backed down.

But hey, I play hockey on an artificial surface in a stadium (teensy by your standards) that took up some open space to build so...no-one is snow white in every situation.

So, is the hospital going up somewhere else, or is tree health more important that advanced medical care for humans?

 

[senechal]

On a similar note... Municipality put a price on a tree in the path of development, and the community rallied for the funds.. $350,000 worth.
They managed to do it while maintaining basic hygiene and without any major theatrics. At the same time, think of all the mature trees you could spade for 350 grand...

http://www.halton.ca/News/MediaShow.cfm?MediaID=2006-12-21-08-42-34

Up the road in Guelph are an eco-terrorist sect that have been racking up a bunch of arson jobs on development housing projects. Their message is not finding much of a fanbase, and they give Guelph's overwhelming hippy population a bad name.

Oh yeah, while I'm at it, environmental activists with rock climbing equipment including engineered fabrics and alloys, are widely known to be very damaging to the environment to produce. I'd of called them on it -- A real repulsive eco-activist would have free-climbed it!

 

[Fuzly]

Fuz, it sounds like protests in WI have really gone downhill. I remember wearing a scuba suit at a Teddy Kennedy rally in Madtown, waving a "What about Mary Jo" sign.
Those were the days, my friend, I wish they'd never end...

Now that's what I'm talkin' about! Heck, I would go to something like that just for entertainment (and because it was Teddy).

State Street on a Satuday night was quite an experience for this young lad from the Wisconsin Northwoods. Quite a culture shock, but Madtown is FUN!

 

[DonnyO]

hey seer. how much money do you think that the school has generated in its name through the "jock play"?

i bet you have never thrown a game winning TD pass or maybe sunk both ends of a one and one, down one to win a game. or thrown a no hitter.
those highs are free but earned through effort and dedication. and also a talent that not many people possess. therefore you, not having much athletic talent, would be against an idea like making a bigger facility for athletes. even at the cost of a few trees, a renewable source.

you see meaningless tree death while i see cramped lockerrooms, out dated shower/bathrooms, and a not up to par weightroom for a multisport division1 athletic program.

those jocks are bringing in an a pretty good amount of money to the school that i dont think the chess team or botany club or even the band can bring in.

whatever though.

Amen bro! and how many of these anti-jock types actually have the stones and athletic ability to be top notch climbers.

F-in hipppy drug using losers

 

[TimberMcPherson]

So, is the hospital going up somewhere else, or is tree health more important that advanced medical care for humans?

In my book, the trees would win, as they are a feature of area that cant be simply replaced with a flick of a checkbook.
Its not like in the future people will look at that space when whatever building is due to come down and put in a tree. As our cities become more built up, good mature specimens are getting less common, they are the rare thing amongst the concrete and brick things.
The health and well being of people is important, and the better health of people, who are around, travel past or live in areas of mature trees has been documented.
All to often in this world developers or those who stand to turn a profit get to much say in how things are going to be. Whether its removal of a park to put in a mall or the invasion of a country to get its resources. Look at what was going to happen to Penn station in the 80's.
A nation without protest isnt a nation, its north korea. Go the hippies! At the least people will have greater appreciation of the trees when they go.

 

[treeseer]

In my book, the trees would win, as they are a feature of area that cant be simply replaced with a flick of a checkbook.
Its not like in the future people will look at that space when whatever building is due to come down and put in a tree. As our cities become more built up, good mature specimens are getting less common, they are the rare thing amongst the concrete and brick things.
The health and well being of people is important, and the better health of people, who are around, travel past or live in areas of mature trees has been documented.
All to often in this world developers or those who stand to turn a profit get to much say in how things are going to be. Whether its removal of a park to put in a mall or the invasion of a country to get its resources. Look at what was going to happen to Penn station in the 80's.
A nation without protest isnt a nation, its north korea. Go the hippies! At the least people will have greater appreciation of the trees when they go.

Thanks, Timber--it's good to see that someone has some vision of the big picture.

Donny, I can climb as high and as wide as you can. But what in the world does that (or suspected drug use--put down your beer before you answer!) have to do with anything?

 

[Bigus Termitius]

That's why they call it dope!

I'm all for the right to protest....this isn't protest, it's half a dozen homeless space cadets pooping in public trees . !

Came across this open letter to the tree sitters from a local Berkley resident.
Nice to have some local input available.

http://www.craigslist.org/about/best/sfo/466281874.html

I've read some more on this issue from various sources. The plans call for the removal of only 38 trees, not the entire grove. That ought to add some perspective to our little spat here.

Furthermore, the new construction is for an athletic training center, a four story underground parking garage providing 900 parking spaces, and new facilities for the university's law and business schools.