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Mmeloche

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Hi i am wondering if it is normal . when i cross cut i make big chip string like if i tey to mill with the same saw and the same chain and the same sharpness i dont get the same chip i get big dust or flake like thinker then sawdust but not chip or string like things is it normal ?
 

BobL

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8/10 times It probably your raker depths.

1) Throw any standard raker depth gauges away.
2) A general rule for milling in hardwoods is the raker depths should be about 1/10th of the gullet width
3) In softwoods try 1/9 or 1/8 of the gullet width.

If you post a close up fully side on picture of some of your cutters I will give them the once over
Like this.

MalloffBobLchain.jpg
 

Mmeloche

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8/10 times It probably your raker depths.

1) Throw any standard raker depth gauges away.
2) A general rule for milling in hardwoods is the raker depths should be about 1/10th of the gullet width
3) In softwoods try 1/9 or 1/8 of the gullet width.

If you post a close up fully side on picture of some of your cutters I will give them the once over
Like this.

View attachment 1008284
Here you go
 

Mmeloche

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Here the pic
 

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HumBurner

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Wait for Bob's suggestions, but two things I see:


1) you have a pretty long flat portion at the top of the depth gauge. I would round that off better for improved entry into the wood. Try to keep the shape of each depth the same, consistently.


2) you have a fat bit of metal remaining where the cutting portion of the tooth meets the gullet (note the "bump" in the gullet in your second photo.) I would file that metal flush to the cutter, redefine the gullet, and give the tooth a few licks to even out what you just did. This could be affecting your cutting angle somewhat and preventing good feed.



Just my opinions. We all sharpen and maintain chain differently.
 

blades

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Looks like a milling grind, 10 deg or straight across the top?. That when done on a chop saw grinder leaves the side plate almost square - you could chase that edge with a file to get a better knife style edge. Depending on the grinder if it is possible to move the vise fore and aft you could move it and get some angle on the side plate by getting off center of wheel , if the vise is of the type allows for a 10deg tip but not moveable that also might help to get a bit of edge on to the side plate. if you look at the side plate on a new chain you will see what I mean. that sq. edge slows thing down. The top lifts a chip the side shears it off
 

Mmeloche

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Looks like a milling grind, 10 deg or straight across the top?. That when done on a chop saw grinder leaves the side plate almost square - you could chase that edge with a file to get a better knife style edge. Depending on the grinder if it is possible to move the vise fore and aft you could move it and get some angle on the side plate by getting off center of wheel , if the vise is of the type allows for a 10deg tip but not moveable that also might help to get a bit of edge on to the side plate. if you look at the side plate on a new chain you will see what I mean. that sq. edge slows thing down. The top lifts a chip the side shears it off
It is a.35.degree normal cross cut chain from Oregon that is. Not filed recently i just took a pic as requested and i file by hand no grinder
 

BobL

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Yeah rakers definitely look too high.
Some good advice from the above replies so I won't go into that.
I could go into my usual rant about how to set rakers but its probably easier to give you the old school solution,

1) Take the rakers down 3-4 swipes each- make sure they are rounded over.
2) try milling,
3) repeat 1 and 2 until the chain starts to grab - before the chain grabs the chains should be making chips.
When the chain starts to grab that means you have gone too far with the raker, so take some metal off the cutters until it stops grabbing.
If you want to be accurate about it measure the raker depth (D). Use a straight edge across ant two adjacent cutters and feeler gauge between straight edge and the raker top in between the two cutters.
Measure the gullet width (W).
W/D is your optimum "gullet/raker depth" ratio. usually its between 10:1 and 7:1 depending on a bunch of stuff like saw power, cutting width, wood type etc,
Expect more vibe, and bar&chain wear and tear, good sux oiling is essential to minimise this.

To set the rakers accurately

I don't do this every time I touch the rakers - I only do this once every now and then. In the field I swipe rakers 2-3 times after every 3-4 touch ups. I usually do an accurate reset back in the shop after every 3-4 days of milling.
 

Mmeloche

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Thx for the info when i cross cut it grab and pull nice chuck i don't have to push it and eat the log like crazy. I get of the cross cut and mill like in the same second and the pull big dust it bog the saw if i push a bit . maybe saw not strong enough and need a skip chain ?
 

blades

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milling yes to skip or make your own from full comp by grinding off every other set of cutters. you could also do a scratcher style by just removing the top plates, every other set.
 

Mmeloche

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So to understand i grind off 1 left 1 right keep 1.left 1 right then off the next set that is what you mean by every other set 1.set.on 2 is removed
 

blades

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yes, some call this a cowboy skip. skip or semi skip chain can be difficult to get at times. I have only seen it offered in full size 3/8 or .404. Generally it costs more per drive link as well.
 

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Thx for the info when i cross cut it grab and pull nice chuck i don't have to push it and eat the log like crazy. I get of the cross cut and mill like in the same second and the pull big dust it bog the saw if i push a bit . maybe saw not strong enough and need a skip chain ?
Milling & x-cutting are using different areas of the cutter to do the hard work & so the chain needs to be sharpened quite differently to cut efficiently. Milling is cutting end grain so by default it's much harder work (think about trying to chisel by hand, much harder to do against the grain & with a poorly sharpened tool).
Milling will always be harder on a power head than x-cutting but you can reduce the load by using a well sharpened chain filed to suit the saw you are using & the wood you are cutting. That kind of grind will usually make the chain unsafe to use for x-cutting.
The chips from milling will always be different to x-cutting, which will be different to "noodling" as you're cutting the fibres from a different direction
 

Mmeloche

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I understand my saw is a husky 55 old model i think 1990 . i got a 20 inch bar and a 3\8 chain 35 degree on it . i can mill small log. That is what im looking for but if i push a bit on the saw i think to much chain hit the wood and it bog down . i dont mind switching chain if i cross cut . but if the the hyper skip help my saw to cut easyer then i will go for it . i am new to milling
 

blades

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milling chain is about 10 degrees across the top of the cutter, with depth gauges in the .020-.025 area I would guess. side plate is important as that is what cuts the chip lifted by the top plate loose. A big hook in the side plate is not good, if you look at a full chisel chain tooth the side plate is almost vertical apx 5deg., so it is not leading the edge of top plate
 

Mmeloche

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I read that a ripping chain is 10 degree the upside is the cleaner finish . i dont care about that. But i read it is not faster. Will a 10 degree givde the saw a easyer time cutting the wood on milling or the hyper skip is the way to go for easyer on the saw
 

blades

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can only go as fast as the ability of your power head to pull any chain through whatever. do not know anything about hyper skip except what ever the marketing says ( I don't pay a lot of attention to the flim flam dept. though) if you want speed get a Band mill or a circular saw mill that's going to be faster than any chainsaw mill.
 

Mmeloche

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can only go as fast as the ability of your power head to pull any chain through whatever. do not know anything about hyper skip except what ever the marketing says ( I don't pay a lot of attention to the flim flam dept. though) if you want speed get a Band mill or a circular saw mill that's going to be faster than any chainsaw mill.
Yes i understand. But the question is does a 10degree chain instead.of 35 easyer to pull in the wood for the saw i guess a hyper skip is easyer for the saw . i dont want speed i dont want to blow the saw haha since it is a small saw
 

Mmeloche

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Is 10 degree easyer then 25 degree to pull in the wood because 10 degree leave a nicer finish
 

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