Ever have a job like this....

[Brush Hog]

Had a friend of my moms call me to drop a tree and nothing else. Easy job and I told him I'd do it for a case of beer. Went today to drop it and he said do you want to put a rope in it. No, I'm just gonna notch it and drive a wedge in. All went well til the wedge I brought was too long and a gust of wind put it 180 degrees wrong way. No harm except to my ego. I knew I should've just climbed the damn thing like I want to but figured a) out in the open b) in and out quick. You can yell at me or laugh with me because I'm laughing. Right now not at the time it happened. Here's my sign

 

[rahtreelimbs]

Had a friend of my moms call me to drop a tree and nothing else. Easy job and I told him I'd do it for a case of beer. Went today to drop it and he said do you want to put a rope in it. No, I'm just gonna notch it and drive a wedge in. All went well til the wedge I brought was too long and a gust of wind put it 180 degrees wrong way. No harm except to my ego. I knew I should've just climbed the damn thing like I want to but figured a) out in the open b) in and out quick. You can yell at me or laugh with me because I'm laughing. Right now not at the time it happened. Here's my sign

At least you owned up to it, especially on a public forum!!!


All too often people won't admit when they make a mistake!!!


Chalk it up to experience.............happens to eveyone!!!

 

[Trignog]

C'mon, you gotta earn your beer man. Instead of climbing to set a line use a throw line. Throw line or climbing, the customer can't do it, so you seem impressive. Well worth the beer. Now you look dumb.

Don't sweat it, I was blocking down 6' chuncks of black locust today, about 24", big wood. I checked my gear before every cut, except once. Thought "no, I just moved my climbing line , I'm cool." Well I went to move it from under the block to over it like your supposed to. Well the piece was already tied off and I put it inside the rigging. When I let the piece go it pulled my climber, severed all but 5 strands of my 24 strand velocity. Luckily my lanyard was in the proper place(always tie in twice!). Worst part is I cut the splice clean off. Oh well, lesson learned, there's worse things in life.

 

[Treeman587]

Had a friend of my moms call me to drop a tree and nothing else. Easy job and I told him I'd do it for a case of beer. Went today to drop it and he said do you want to put a rope in it. No, I'm just gonna notch it and drive a wedge in. All went well til the wedge I brought was too long and a gust of wind put it 180 degrees wrong way. No harm except to my ego. I knew I should've just climbed the damn thing like I want to but figured a) out in the open b) in and out quick. You can yell at me or laugh with me because I'm laughing. Right now not at the time it happened. Here's my sign

No, I know what I am doing!:yoyo: j/k

Seriously though. I hate wedges for felling. I almost always put a line in. What I dont like about wedges is that you greatly increase the pressure on your hinge. That, in turn, Increases the probability of failure. Too much and it will snap, then You are screwed.

 

[Dadatwins]

Given the cost of a Big Shot and throw line, and how easy it makes it to place a pull line in just about any tree, I do not see any reason not to have one on every job. Wedges are great tools and have many uses, but nothing beats a 1/2" line near the top of a tree to pull one over. Stop asking "do I really need it?" and get a Big Shot to place a pull line.

 

[ropensaddle]

Two large wooden pole pruner extensions encased in pvc pipe,
one sharpened spike similar to a firewood poker placed in one end
and secured, makes a real good tree pusher ! I only use mine when
a good margin of safety exists, and believe it or not is capable of pushing
a pretty good tree over against a lean but mostly use a rope! I used this
pole pusher cutting new rows to keep debris out of intended row to
allow truck access for trimming . Its fast and safe when you respect
its limitations!!!!

 

[ropensaddle]

one rubber mallet handle cut off, eye screw placed in one end, small100 foot cord tied to eye, pretty good throw ball I put extra rubber on mine in layers with gorilla glue for extra weight, works better than them sacks that don't have enough weight to come down with thumping or snapping the cord!!I made mine after buying the sack couldn't find the old type throw ball for sale!!!
They were made right kinda looked like a toilet float!!!! Had plenty weight

 

[Grace Tree]

I almost always use a pull line. I used to be so confident that I'd put a traffic cone out at the end of the lay of the fall. The tree would hit the cone and fly around. All pretty impressive until I had one go wrong and swat 30 ft. of gutter off the customer's house. It was hard to take at the time but now I consider it a cheap lesson in safety and humility.
Phil

 

[ozy365]

rope puller is the best tool for flopping trees. Even use it occasionally with ground anchor and wedges. A line even 10 feet up makes a huge difference. Gotta make sure you're in around the trunk...1 ton of pull on a branch can be a problem

 

[Brush Hog]

At least you owned up to it, especially on a public forum!!!


All too often people won't admit when they make a mistake!!!

Hey nothing like a public flogging at my expense :biggrinbounce2: . Don't REAL men admit when they are wrong

 

[Jumper]

GRCS would have made the job a real cinch.

 

[pbtree]

Been there done that...

 

[geofore]

180* out

You'll have that happen more than once when the wind is up to playing tricks and the wedge is the wrong one.
Had a Mike helping me clear a few trees along the driveway at my other place yesterday. Two of the pines he cut fell 180* out. Not a problem but I got to show him how to use a limb cut to 5' as a lever to twist the tree off the stump and the very next tree he found out that grapevines can hold a tree in mid air. So, on that tree he got to use the limb trick to twist it out the vines and to the ground. Who'd a thunk that trick would be so handy he could use it on the next tree? :jawdrop: 300' of the driveway is cleared with 350' to go next weekend. Mike will learn some more tricks next week.

 

[clearance]

No, I know what I am doing!:yoyo: j/k

Seriously though. I hate wedges for felling. I almost always put a line in. What I dont like about wedges is that you greatly increase the pressure on your hinge. That, in turn, Increases the probability of failure. Too much and it will snap, then You are screwed.

Uhhh, ok. I have never done this, I have pounded the living snot outta wedges, stacked 'em, beat them mercillessly untill she went over, never seen the holding wood bust vertically. I have screwed up falling before, anyone who has done it a lot has, no big deal. Always a good idea to back up a rope with wedges anyways. Am I wrong here?

 

[Ekka]

What I dont like about wedges is that you greatly increase the pressure on your hinge. That, in turn, Increases the probability of failure. Too much and it will snap, then You are screwed.

Uhhh, ok. I have never done this, I have pounded the living snot outta wedges, stacked 'em, beat them mercillessly untill she went over, never seen the holding wood bust vertically. I have screwed up falling before, anyone who has done it a lot has, no big deal. Always a good idea to back up a rope with wedges anyways. Am I wrong here?

How can a wedge snap a hinge? The wedge lifts the tree. The same amount of weight is on the hingewood whether you are wedging or pulling with a rope or pushing with an excavator boom.

Utter BS that statement and yes, you should back up your cuts with wedges even if pulling with rope ... unless it's some pecker pole I suppose.

Wind is always a critical factor and so is the hinge thickness. Think back up, what if rope breaks, tree breaks, winch breaks, vehicle loses traction etc etc.

Just today I had to fell a gum into about a 15mph head wind, I roped around 1/2 ht for a vehicle pull but as I was doing the back cut banged in a wedge. As the vehicle pulled a little I avanced the wedge till the tree was going then cleared out of there.

Be smart, be wise and be safe.

 

[Treeman587]

It is simple physics and I have seen it happen. If you have a back lean, rather than a forward lean it makes a difference. With a forward lean you have the face cut in your favor, as the hinge is working, the tree is falling. So it is not in a bind. But with a back lean, the weight of the tree is behind the hinge and is set on the wedge, which creates a lever action that pulls up on the hinge.

Look at it this way, What does the hinge do when your face cut closes. It snaps the hinge. Well behind the hinge there is no releif in the form of a face cut, So when the tree is sitting back on the wedge it is trying to snap the hinge, until you get the weight transferred to the other side, then your face cut is providing enough fall for the tree to be on a dedicated path before the hinge breaks.

As far as a tree breaking using a rope. If you are wise with your rope placement, How can it break when the hinge has become the weakest point in the spar? I dont do a Bore cut and Trigger on larger pulls, the only time I use that is when I feel it will fall without assitance. I make one backcut, I watch the tree and when the hinge is right I signal the my guys to go ahead and lay into it. They just hold pressure on the line until I get to that point. It doesn't take 10,000 pounds of force to pull a tree over, You just have to know when to pull.

A secure line as high as possible in the tree gives you the most leverage.
Add a second line and a winch to the equation, And you can pull over some serious trees. Ones I would never try to do with wedges.

Ekka, I have always respected your opinion. But I disagree with you on this one.

 

[Treeman587]

There are a lot of variables in felling a tree. And many things we have to estimate accuratley in order to have a successful fall. To each his own. I like my way. You like yours.

 

[clearance]

Heavy leaners can be swung away from thier lean somewhat, to a point, reasonable leaners can be wedged over completely against thier lean. Good fallers can do things that most good arborists would never attempt. I ain't no westcoast faller and I cringe at the word arborist, little of both I guess (some would disagree) If you have doubt as to your abilities, by all means get a rope in it. If I figure I can just fall it with an axe and wedges I do, depends heavily on the species of tree as well. Fir, pine, spruce, good stuff, cottonwood, maple, etc, forget about it, I rope away as well. Ain't no excuse if you have rope in it but that ain't falling, thats cheating, I know it. 371xp,394xp, 395xp (Walkerized), ms200 Stihl (the little bastard in the bunch)

 

[Treeman587]

Heavy leaners can be swung away from thier lean somewhat, to a point, reasonable leaners can be wedged over completely against thier lean. Good fallers can do things that most good arborists would never attempt. I ain't no westcoast faller and I cringe at the word arborist, little of both I guess (some would disagree) If you have doubt as to your abilities, by all means get a rope in it. If I figure I can just fall it with an axe and wedges I do, depends heavily on the species of tree as well. Fir, pine, spruce, good stuff, cottonwood, maple, etc, forget about it, I rope away as well. Ain't no excuse if you have rope in it but that ain't falling, thats cheating, I know it. 371xp,394xp, 395xp (Walkerized), ms200 Stihl (the little bastard in the bunch)

Good post. Perhaps I had forgotten about the WC guys. And I am not a logger. Just a suburban treeman helping hurricane fearing citizens. Around here it is mainly pine and gum that we do removals on. While gum is fairly resilient, pine can be questionable. That and I climb almost everything I work on, So why not put a rope on it when you are already up there.

 

[Mitchell]

wedges

Originally Posted by Treeman587
What I dont like about wedges is that you greatly increase the pressure on your hinge. That, in turn, Increases the probability of failure. Too much and it will snap, then You are screwed.


For my 2 cents... after 13 years falling in the forets of BC I have never had a problem with wedges snapping the hinge wood on green sticks. I have seen jacks bust trees off, but not wedges on green trees with sufficant holding wood; even on crap like popular. I hated using them becouse it ment I was going slow, consequently I lost a few power heads over the years. I would think it could not hurt to back up any pull with a wedge. Im new to residental stuff so im adapting and i find myself using ropes to pull more and more for the added security.
cheers