There are other ways, but that's the best way. Trees hung up in other trees can get real dangerous real fast. Stay safe
Felling a leaning tree
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There are other ways, but that's the best way. Trees hung up in other trees can get real dangerous real fast. Stay safe
gwiley
Addicted to ArboristSite
Don't cut hung trees.
Depending on the size of the tree you might be able to safely pull it down with equipment, 45deg might be shallow enough angle. Out in the woods I use multiple heavy tow chains with binder hooks to couple them and an F350 4x4 to gently dislodge hung trees. The most important thing to evaluate is whether you place you/your vehicle at risk - imagine a worst case scenario and see if you can eliminate the risks.
A 45 degree hung tree that I can hook up to and slowly pull free to let it fall mostly parallel is possibly one that I would try. If your chains are long enough to keep your truck free of the tree then the only thing to worry about is not pulling so hard that the chain breaks.
Depending on the size of the tree you might be able to safely pull it down with equipment, 45deg might be shallow enough angle. Out in the woods I use multiple heavy tow chains with binder hooks to couple them and an F350 4x4 to gently dislodge hung trees. The most important thing to evaluate is whether you place you/your vehicle at risk - imagine a worst case scenario and see if you can eliminate the risks.
A 45 degree hung tree that I can hook up to and slowly pull free to let it fall mostly parallel is possibly one that I would try. If your chains are long enough to keep your truck free of the tree then the only thing to worry about is not pulling so hard that the chain breaks.
NetreeLady
ArboristSite Lurker
I suppose you do your own medical care, too, huh?
treemandan
Tree Freak
I think what he is saying is that is its going to be involved then the tree can just stay where its at as its not causing a problem at the moment, that its not worth the hassle of anybody doing it.
I would say have a few guys look at it, it might be something a pro can handle without great expense. I just did something like this for 50 bucks, just a couple well executed cuts and it was all over in a few minutes. Didn't need 6 guys and a bucket truck for the day.
I would say have a few guys look at it, it might be something a pro can handle without great expense. I just did something like this for 50 bucks, just a couple well executed cuts and it was all over in a few minutes. Didn't need 6 guys and a bucket truck for the day.
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NetreeLady
ArboristSite Lurker
A tree reasy to fall where ever they may be people present is just a liability waiting to happen.
I agree that it might be something quick and cheap to rectify.
I agree that it might be something quick and cheap to rectify.
lego1970
ArboristSite Guru
Depending on the size, lean and how it's tangled into the other tree, those are pretty dangerous and difficult to take down from ground level. Every now and then I can pull one over with a 4x4 but often times I have to climb up and piece it out. If you have any doubts don't do it. Those trees can easily become killers from either rolling on you or from widow makers busting out the top and flipping back towards you. As mentioned above you might get somebody to do it cheap since you want to keep the wood and all they would have to do is get it down safely.
Turkeyslayer
Smells Great
Call me crazy, and this may be bad advice for a beginer (but it is proper technique). But if I really wanted the tree down, I would determine which way the tree will NOT roll, than stand on that side. Then I would V notch the top about 1/3 of the trees dia., then make the backcut, from the bottom up. I would do this at a comfortable working height. Make sure you have good escape routes cleared. Once the tree is free of the stump, winch it down using your come along. Just remember if you dont feel comfortable with cutting the tree, leave it for a pro or mother nature to bring down. THIS TYPE OF TREE CAN BE VERY VERY DANGEROUS SO USE YOUR BEST JUDGEMENT.
Be safe
TS
Note: If the trunk of the tree is above waist height at the root ball or the tree looks like it might swing when cut do not attemt to cut it. Try winching it down.
Be safe
TS
Note: If the trunk of the tree is above waist height at the root ball or the tree looks like it might swing when cut do not attemt to cut it. Try winching it down.
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NetreeLady
ArboristSite Lurker
Why would you angle your back cut "from the bottom up"?
Why not snap-cut it?
Why not snap-cut it?
Komitet
ArboristSite Member
More control while cutting, and a snap cut has the tendency to drive the tree straight down dragging the say with it, or pinching.
If you posted a picture, you would get better answers here.
Big wide angle, so that we can see everything.
Big wide angle, so that we can see everything.
Turkeyslayer
Smells Great
I'm no pro here, but from the description if the tree is hung up. The compresion wood is on the top so notch there. The tension wood is on the bottom, therefor the cutting of the back cut from the bottom up. Honestly I dont know what a "snap-cut" is. That is why I suggsted what I did. That is the way I know how to properly fall hung trees.
lego1970
ArboristSite Guru
When I've tried snap cutting trees like that most the time the tree just sits back down on the saw so I prefer to notch the top if I feel the tree will actually come down. On some small trees I'm just able to cut up and it will fold but on medium to big trees, most of the time the butt just falls down and the tree is still hung up in the other tree. Sometimes you can just keep taking small chuncks out of the bottom until the tree is down but on bigger trees the angle gets steeper so your closer to the widow makers if they bust out. Also at the steeper angle it will be even harder to snap cut or notch cut the trunk without it just sitting back down on the saw. A couple times on smaller trees I've been able to bull the butt with a truck or bobcat once it's cut but on large trees, they just anchor into the ground and the truck will just sit and spin. I'm guessing probably at least 80% of the time on medium to big trees that have fallen over and tangled into another tree I have to climb it and piece out the top before I can pull it over to one side or the other and get it down on the ground.
NetreeLady
ArboristSite Lurker
Why not notch one side and take it sideways instead?
Seriously, snap-cutting it allows you to set up rigging and split, like a pull line to a heavy truck, before the tree moves.
Lego, aren't you using wedges?? Let it set down on them; you'll get them back.
Seriously, snap-cutting it allows you to set up rigging and split, like a pull line to a heavy truck, before the tree moves.
Lego, aren't you using wedges?? Let it set down on them; you'll get them back.
lego1970
ArboristSite Guru
I'm not saying you couldn't do that, since I've never tried that but I would think that your still going to have to deal with the fact that the top of the wood is compressed so while you can make a sideways notch, your eventually going to have to deal with the compressed wood on the top. And as far as heavy trucks or equipment goes. With a big enough piece of equipment like a Cat D8 Dozer in there you don't even have to break out the chainsaw, but most the one's I've done have been in somebody's yard and your lucky if you can get a truck, bobcat, or those little mini grapplers in there let alone something a little more substantial like a grapple truck.
gwiley
Addicted to ArboristSite
This sounds like the kind of situation that too often gives a less experienced sawyer like me my 15 minutes of fame and a permanent resting place shortly afterwards.
The real challenge is that without experience (or even with) it is crazy difficult to accurately judge the forces acting on a hazard tree like this. The wood just doesn't give enough hints to an unpractised eye to tell where dynamic forces are applied that might trigger a roll or explosive split.
When I face a hazard tree that might be hiding a deadly trick up its sleeve I use equipment or leave it.
If you haven't had the time to gain experience in the field I suspect one of the more effective means for cultivating a conservative attitude toward hazard trees is by Googleing FACE reports (search for "FACE logging fatality") - these are post-event assessments of fatal accidents that make it possible to learn from the costly lessons others have taken.
The real challenge is that without experience (or even with) it is crazy difficult to accurately judge the forces acting on a hazard tree like this. The wood just doesn't give enough hints to an unpractised eye to tell where dynamic forces are applied that might trigger a roll or explosive split.
When I face a hazard tree that might be hiding a deadly trick up its sleeve I use equipment or leave it.
If you haven't had the time to gain experience in the field I suspect one of the more effective means for cultivating a conservative attitude toward hazard trees is by Googleing FACE reports (search for "FACE logging fatality") - these are post-event assessments of fatal accidents that make it possible to learn from the costly lessons others have taken.
NetreeLady
ArboristSite Lurker
Lego, because the gentleman specifically mentioned preferring to not bring a pro in, I take the guess that maybe this tree is somewhere without a target, such as a house- but I am just guessing.
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lego1970
ArboristSite Guru
NETree, yes I have wedges and as he mentioned it's out a ways but he also said he didn't have access to heavy equipment. I posted these pics in another thread not to long ago. This is a tree I did a few weeks back (disregard the date on the pic). This tree was about 30" in diameter with about a 45 degree angle. I wasn't told that somebody had already made cuts on it. Looks like they started, got scared and then called me. I was pretty dissapointed that they didn't tell me about the cuts because I was about to climb it, but glad they stopped where they did because they would of been in the Accident and Fatality thread had they finished the cut halfway up the trunk. Since they had made pretty big cuts in it, I figured, what the heck I would go ahead and finish the cut on the lower side and try to yank either the crown or the trunk one way or the other in hopes that it would drop. From previous experience I wasn't to hopeful. This time I even had dry pavement in both directions and as I figured it was too tangled in the top and too heavy and anchored at the bottom (after I had cut thru the lower trunk) to pull over. It wouldn't budge and just snapped my rope. Even with that huge cut halfway up the trunk it still didn't fold. Again I wasn't too surprised. Since this tree had the other big cut in it that they had made I didn't feel safe to climb up it even though the truck didn't budge it, so I had to climb up the backside of the tree that it was leaning into, come back down and piece out the crown to get it untangled.
If it's a skinny excurrant tree alot of time you can just keep piecing out the butt since often times it won't roll so violently from side to side but on a vase shaped tree or one with a broad crown on it you can easily get your self killed because it's hard to judge which branch is supporting most of the weight and every time you make a cut it rolls violently from side to side. Every situation is going to be a little different but I've had more success just climbing it.
OP when you get pics try to put something next to it like a shovel or something along that line to help us better judge the size.
If it's a skinny excurrant tree alot of time you can just keep piecing out the butt since often times it won't roll so violently from side to side but on a vase shaped tree or one with a broad crown on it you can easily get your self killed because it's hard to judge which branch is supporting most of the weight and every time you make a cut it rolls violently from side to side. Every situation is going to be a little different but I've had more success just climbing it.
OP when you get pics try to put something next to it like a shovel or something along that line to help us better judge the size.
SINGLE-JACK
ArboristSite Guru
NetreeLady
ArboristSite Lurker
lego, I was thinking of a Z-rig and a pickup, not really heavy equipment. 
But I'll go back to the kitchen and let you men figure it out. :monkey:
But I'll go back to the kitchen and let you men figure it out. :monkey:
lego1970
ArboristSite Guru
lego, I was thinking of a Z-rig and a pickup, not really heavy equipment.
You being a woman has nothing to do with my questioning a snap cut, rigging, or use of equipment. Heck I don't even know what a z-rig is. If you've read my other post, I'm pretty honest and will say when I don't know something or got something wrong. I even said I've never really tried a sideway notch so for all I know that works good. I believe you were the one that questioned if the homeowner had insurance, the other guys suggestion of a notch on the top side and if I've ever used a wedge and I believe all those questions were not to learn but to be a funny. I could care less if your a woman but I think I'm done talking in this thread.
