Fertilizing White Oaks

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UrbanHunter

ArboristSite Lurker
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Hi Everyone,

I am new to this site but I am learning about the native plants and trees here in Ga. and am somewhat self taught. I would like to know is it better to fertilize white oak trees by digging a hole with post diggers at the dripline about 2' deep, pouring in 13-13-13 and putting about 6" of dirt on the top, or just broad casting around the dripline.

Thanks for the help!:greenchainsaw:
 
Of the two I would pick broadcasting, IMO deep root fertilization is the best method. I can't see any benefit from the post hole digger at the drip line method. If you were to use a 2" diameter auger 3' on center starting at the base of the tree and working out to the dripline(vertical mulching)you can add nutrients and relieve compaction. When ferting with any method, make sure to use the proper amount of material.(get a reference book) Good luck!
 
Ok. But do you think just broadcasting on top of the ground around the roots would be beneficial. I don't have the equipment to do the drilling.
 
Ok. But do you think just broadcasting on top of the ground around the roots would be beneficial. I don't have the equipment to do the drilling.

Absolutely. It has been recommended to me for a stand we have, by the local district forester and a timber management company.
 
Here's a great old thread on the subject:
http://www.arboristsite.com/showthread.php?t=22247
I crack me up. :hmm3grin2orange:

Do not deep fertilize!
You don't want to just go fertilize trees. You need to do a few soil tests, and then only add what's needed. Typically, soil fertility of mature trees is good, or if anything, too high in nitrogen. Only a soil test can say for sure.

Is there a specific problem with the oaks? It's very unlikely that the problem is soil fertility.
 
Soil testing is cheap or free. Your county extension agent will give you what you need. How can you know what to add until you know what is there?

Drilling 2" holes will cut some roots, and glaze the soil so nutrients won't spread laterally. Using a post hole digger will cut many roots, and putting fert in those holes will burn the rest.:blob2:

The trunk, branches and leaves are the most obvious parts of the plants to examine, but the landscape below ground is equally important. Armed with $100 in tools and following a few basic principles, arborists can learn a lot about how the earth surrounding a tree’s roots is affecting tree vitality.

A pH meter is a very useful soil-measuring tool, reading the soil’s reaction (pH), as described in the December 2006 CEU article in Arborist News. A soil probe is a simple T-shaped tool that is pressed or twisted into the earth and extracts a core of soil. This core of soil typically contains an A horizon below the mulch, turf, or groundcover; a B horizon below that where the organic matter blends into the native soil; and a C layer of less permeable subsoil, the parent material from which the soil was formed. Many of the nonwoody roots are typically found in the A horizon. White roots extending into the B horizon indicates a high level of oxygen there, where the tree can harvest enough resources fuel its various functions.

Urban soils are often disturbed, with a jumble of material from different horizons interspersed. Touching the soil also can reveal much about its properties. For example, if moist soil is rolled into a cylinder and it crumbles easily, it may be low in clay. A sour smell indicates anaerobic, low-oxygen conditions hostile to root growth, while a sweet smell can signify that beneficial, aerobic bacteria and fungi are at work. A hand lens is useful in finding fine roots, mycorrhizal strands, and other interesting things, such as soil insects.
Earthworms, arthropods, and other organisms aerate the soil and convert organic matter and minerals into forms more available to the tree. A number of references have reported that one cup of undisturbed native soil may contain the following: 200 billion bacteria, 20 billion protozoa, 100,000 meters of fungi, 100,000 nematodes and 50,000 arthropods. There are ways to encourage beneficial soil organisms:
• Use organic mulches for weed control, and amend the soil with composted organic material to provide a food source for soil organisms.
• Avoid over irrigation and **excessive use of fertilizers**, so the organisms do not drown or burn.
• Irrigate during periods of drought. Soil organism activity may be reduced due to dry soil conditions that are common in certain times of the year.
• Avoid unwarranted pesticide applications. Some fungicides, insecticides, and herbicides are harmful to various types of soil organisms.
• Use organic mulches to reduce soil compaction forces, moderate temperature, and maintain soil oxygen levels needed by beneficial soil organisms and roots.
Uncompacted soils have less root rot because they have better drainage, thanks to more pore space that air and water travel through. This pore space helps define the soil’s structure.
 
PA,

Did they tell you what type of fertilizer to use? 10-10-10? etc

Thanks:givebeer:


I'll check my stewardship plan and get back to you on this. See next quote.



How can you know what to add if you don't know what is lacking?????:crazy1:

Easy Fellas, If this is directed at me let's diffuse this. My answer was that topical application of fertilizer is effective and recommended. I too agree that a soil test needs to be done. Our local conservation district will send it to Penn State to have it done. I don't believe there is a charge. There is at least a 4 week waiting period.
 
PA,

Did they tell you what type of fertilizer to use? 10-10-10? etc

Thanks:givebeer:

Okay, this is quoted from my Stewardship plan:

"There is a grove of white oak trees located west of the bench about where the trail is located, here is a good place to encourage white oak growth by fertilizing the trees with 10-10-10 fertilizer at a rate of about 100 lbs/ac. Broadcast the fertilizer throughout this area and under the white oak canopy."

That's the quote ver batum. This was written by The Forest Management Center located at 123 Cherry Rd. Liverpool, PA dated August 5, 2005.

I still agree about the soil test needing done. Maybe The Forest Management Center uses this mixture as a "good rule of thumb" for fertilizing white oaks in our area. I don't know why they give this specific fertilizer ratio.
 
1 acre = 43 560 square feet
100 pound bag of 10-10-10 has 10 pounds of nitrogen.
This means their dose is about .23 pounds nitrogen per 1000 sq/feet.

That's a safe dose almost irregardless of soil tests, because it's so low.
I suspect it's a feel good dose prescribed as a placebo to people who inquire about fertilizing trees.
 
Thanks Guys for the Info

The whole deal here is to create sweeter acorns to concentrate the deer that I hunt. It is well known that deer will walk through a grove of unfertilized white oaks to feed exclusively at the ones that are.

Thanks for the professional opinions and more suggestions are welcomed!:rockn:
 
....This core of soil typically contains an A horizon below the mulch, turf, or groundcover; ....
You get an A horizon? I thought they always sold that off for top soil :dizzy:

As for surface applications: Is this in the woods in in the yard? Topical applications over turf will not get much nutrient to the tree roots.

Drip line applications...you will do more benefit concentrating the fertilizer within 3-4' of the trunk than out at the dripline. And I agree that auger is not the best way to do this.

I suspect that you need a shot of nitrogeon to improve acorn flavor. But as everybody else said, soil testing will confirm that. I have not seen any publications suggesting what rates you want for acorn flavor. Most recommendations are written for tree health. As I said, i am guessing your goals mean higher nitrogen which could compromise overall tree health. Too much nitrogen (assuming it doesn't burn the tree first) encourages the tree to put its resources into top growth and less into rooting and storage.
 
As for surface applications: Is this in the woods in in the yard? Topical applications over turf will not get much nutrient to the tree roots.

Surface applications are the best, lawn or not. The only way to stop grass from competing for nutrients is to remove the grass. Feeder roots of trees are mostly in the top few inches of soil.

Drip line applications...you will do more benefit concentrating the fertilizer within 3-4' of the trunk than out at the drip-line. And I agree that auger is not the best way to do this.
You never want to concentrate fertilizer. You want to apply it as evenly as possible to the entire root system. Thats why auguring it into the soil is stupid, you just make a few hot spots that just burn roots.

Roots grow where soil conditions favor them. This could be 2 feet from the trunk or 5 times the trees height away, or more. If you did a statistical analysis of root location, you'd likely find roots located throughout the drip-line and just beyond, then slowly being less concentrated as you get farther away.
The lower concentration as you move away from the tree is simple geometry, and has nothing to do with where roots like to grow.
The drip line is an area where roots are slightly more concentrated because rain water tends to drip there. Roots like water, and the higher soil gas exchange associated with it.
 
Mike's right, for a change. :jester:

"you will do more benefit concentrating the fertilizer within 3-4' of the trunk than out at the dripline."

The opposite is true. Concentrating nitrogen near the base of big oaks is just asking for disease, since decay orbanisms feed on excess N.
 
I'll check my stewardship plan and get back to you on this. See next quote.





Easy Fellas, If this is directed at me let's diffuse this. My answer was that topical application of fertilizer is effective and recommended. I too agree that a soil test needs to be done. Our local conservation district will send it to Penn State to have it done. I don't believe there is a charge. There is at least a 4 week waiting period.


No offense bro. I'm just getting tired of explaining the whole concept of fertilizing responsibly. I agree with Mike Maas that this sounds like a feel good placebo. Your original post never mentioned what you were fertilizing for or why. On a public forum like this it can never be stated enough that : A soil test shoud be the FIRST STEP in any fertilizer application. You came here for good advice right?;)
 
No offense bro. I'm just getting tired of explaining the whole concept of fertilizing responsibly. I agree with Mike Maas that this sounds like a feel good placebo. Your original post never mentioned what you were fertilizing for or why. On a public forum like this it can never be stated enough that : A soil test shoud be the FIRST STEP in any fertilizer application. You came here for good advice right?;)

I appreciate the aknowledgement. No offense taken.
 

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