owww!
That sucks...
That sucks...
Fire
- Thread starter Gologit
- Start date
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Dang, yo. I hate to hear about those incidents.
We *sort of* use a 9 line. If we call 911, the paramedics use it. If we can handle it in-house, we use a CA-1. If the injured can make it to the hospital themselves, we use the CA-1. If the paramedics show up, we still have to do a CA-1. In any case, the attending doctor will fill out a CA-20 and the claims will be processed based on whatever paperwork is filed.
Drptrch
Addicted to ArboristSite
Here in Southern California we have issues very little water or rain. Most already know that. A few months ago we had about 600,000 acres burned with about 100 lost lives. The total combined cost of the larger fires is at least $800,000,000 or more by a very conservative estimate, An area of dozens of square miles of forested area burned three years ago while it took two days for management to come up with a plan before any action took place. That only took 1500 FF personnel and $27,000,000 to control.
Recently I had a encounter with Cal Fire and was wondering if most or all personnel was as stupid as it seems or is management filled with just plain idiots. In my area there are many multi square mile parcels of land that are state county or federal land. I usually go to these areas to take my dog walking with one or more friends most late afternoons. We have problems with meth heads camping out in the forested areas because they can and nobody stops them. My friend calls me to tell me that a fire broke out where some meth heads were living and might need to change our walking plans. It will be put out by the time we go I am sure. An hour latter we go and a quarter mile down the trail is seven strike teams from Cal Fire assembled. As the entire teams were just standing around talking with no action so I walk up to the commander and tell him it would be a good idea to go ahead and put the fire out since the wind could kick up at any time. He says we can not because they do not have enough fire hose to reach the fire from the closest access. Then he tells me they asked for a crew with tractor and chain saws to get them a little closer. I tell him that I will volunteer my services if necessary to put the fire out. He says what could I do so I tell him I will grab a chain saw and a back pack out of my truck 10 minutes away. On second thought why not just send two or three guys with back packs for now and I will help mop up. He looked at me like I just killed his mother and grandmother on the same day. He says they are not set up with back packs. He tells me not to help and I tell l him this is where I live it is important to me. I said OK you know there is a old horizontal well near by to transfer water for your needs then he says he was new and did not know the layout. So I showed him where the well was and he said they had it under control. This is the same problem that I encountered when I was in the FF field. The time me and my crew was asked to be ready in 45 minutes to fly to a major fire at 2 AM and then camp out at the airport for two days. And the time two guys argued about who had the most seniority so who was in charge while 500 FF folks stood around doing nothing. Thanks
Recently I had a encounter with Cal Fire and was wondering if most or all personnel was as stupid as it seems or is management filled with just plain idiots. In my area there are many multi square mile parcels of land that are state county or federal land. I usually go to these areas to take my dog walking with one or more friends most late afternoons. We have problems with meth heads camping out in the forested areas because they can and nobody stops them. My friend calls me to tell me that a fire broke out where some meth heads were living and might need to change our walking plans. It will be put out by the time we go I am sure. An hour latter we go and a quarter mile down the trail is seven strike teams from Cal Fire assembled. As the entire teams were just standing around talking with no action so I walk up to the commander and tell him it would be a good idea to go ahead and put the fire out since the wind could kick up at any time. He says we can not because they do not have enough fire hose to reach the fire from the closest access. Then he tells me they asked for a crew with tractor and chain saws to get them a little closer. I tell him that I will volunteer my services if necessary to put the fire out. He says what could I do so I tell him I will grab a chain saw and a back pack out of my truck 10 minutes away. On second thought why not just send two or three guys with back packs for now and I will help mop up. He looked at me like I just killed his mother and grandmother on the same day. He says they are not set up with back packs. He tells me not to help and I tell l him this is where I live it is important to me. I said OK you know there is a old horizontal well near by to transfer water for your needs then he says he was new and did not know the layout. So I showed him where the well was and he said they had it under control. This is the same problem that I encountered when I was in the FF field. The time me and my crew was asked to be ready in 45 minutes to fly to a major fire at 2 AM and then camp out at the airport for two days. And the time two guys argued about who had the most seniority so who was in charge while 500 FF folks stood around doing nothing. Thanks
I'm calling BS here. You provide the names and dates of the "incidents" you are referring to and I'll look them up and see what really happened. I have no problem apologizing if I'm wrong.
BTW please tell us about your experience as a fire fighter. Tell us about "my crew". and the time when 500 fire fighters were standing around "doing nothing".
And thanks for telling the "stupid" Cal Fire personnel about the water source. That is a huge help. Those seven strike teams will use lots of water.
TBS
I have chainsaws and chainsaw accessories.
I have definitely seen what Ted is talking about while doing project work with cdrc/calfire crews. What I've seen is an arrogance problem with the younger generation in calfire. I've worked with calfire/cdrc inmate crews every year since 2005 mostly working with crews from miramonte camp and the more experienced captains are always more approachable and give their crews good instructions on what I need done, the younger captains I've worked with I find sitting at the buggy, on their phones, texting, or playing games waiting for a tone out to a fire while the crew is on the other side of the hill out of site. When you ask them to have the crew do something or tell them what needs to be done they get kind of a pissed off attitude like you are inconveniencing them.....at that point i end up running the crews which takes me away from my job.
We had an escaped prescribed burn in December called the ponderosa near cascadel woods, a number of residents reported it to the fire station in the area which had a good view of the fire, the response was its a prescribed burn(in 45mph wind?) and that not our jurisdiction. These residents had recently dealt with the mission fire. To me thats just being an *******.
TBS
I have chainsaws and chainsaw accessories.
Harlow fire 1961 20,000 acres in two hours.
It's called "Chain of Command". Concerned citizens aren't part of it. Tactics and strategy are processes, and cowboying up gets people killed. Have patience. Fire folks are doing the best they can to manage many operational objectives at once; rest assured that your house or property will be one of them but will very seldom be the only one.
Public land, not otherwise posted "no camping", is a place where any US citizen can camp for up to two weeks without further license. You don't want to kick up that fuss because if your "meth heads" have this right taken from them, so do you. Poking the government bear is a bad idea, as it is 100% reactive and 0% proactive.
That's the sort of local knowledge that fire folks need. If you can offer this knowledge, please do so ASAP and then get out of the way . Babysitting civilians is a dangerous time-sink.
I do hope that you're exaggerating. I can't think of a whole lot of circumstances where this isn't illegal at worst and dangerous at best. Don't do that.
TBS
I have chainsaws and chainsaw accessories.
Its legal on our agencies land during project work because a park employee presence is required due to the general public being in the area. When we get crews with these captains contraband drops become a big issue because the inmates bring there illegal cell phones make calls once they get out of site. When I see this going on I get a ranger over to deal with it because the captain isn't going to contact a ranger because he doesn't want to deal with the paperwork.
Nathan please include your job title. I have a good working relationship with the offender crew Captains here. I'm quite sure they will want to talk to you regarding these captains that don't look after their crew and sit in the buggy and play games while you are "running the crew". Believe me, heads will roll. Unless you just slinging BS.
My thoughts exactly. I'm not going to take it laying down if somebody rolls in and presumptively "runs" my crew and neither will any crew I've ever led. This has the faintest whiff of Alternative Fact, I think.
TBS
I have chainsaws and chainsaw accessories.
California department of parks and recreation. Those heads have already rolled thanks to our superintendent Kent Gresham.
Me not being from Caliphonia,
But what business does parks and rec have anywhere near a fire?
I was under the impression that Cal Fire, DNR, or the Forest Service where in charge of all fires in Caliphonia.
But like I said I'm not from caliphornia, just going off reading this thread for the last few years, and trusting Golgit, 2dogs, and madhatte, as well as many others some that even work for CalFire, some work for the forest service.
But what business does parks and rec have anywhere near a fire?
I was under the impression that Cal Fire, DNR, or the Forest Service where in charge of all fires in Caliphonia.
But like I said I'm not from caliphornia, just going off reading this thread for the last few years, and trusting Golgit, 2dogs, and madhatte, as well as many others some that even work for CalFire, some work for the forest service.
TBS
I have chainsaws and chainsaw accessories.
Inmate crews do project work for us, doing fire clearances, removing trees, building fences, but mostly lots of weedeating.
RandyMac
Stiff Member
I think the vaunted ''3 Stooges'' award goes to the USFS for deciding to have a circle jerk for months after the Chetco Bar Fire started and acted all surprised when it blew up.
Drptrch
Addicted to ArboristSite
....Looks like it’s “heating” up to be the Worst fire season “Ever” again... ;P
Erik
Erik
Ya and? Still not answering what parks and rec is doing on an active fire? Let alone "running" crews your not assigned too.
TBS
I have chainsaws and chainsaw accessories.
I never once said anything about me or my department being on a fire, I said project work but i should have stated that in my first post about this issue.
At the Fed level, Parks is a wildfire agency. At least in WA, Parks is not a wildfire agency. I know some CA Parks folks. They are not fire people. "Project Work" that involves fire is not the jurisdiction of non-fire people. We work hard to achieve and maintain our qualifications. It is not the policy of any NWCG partner agencies to allow non-fire qualified personnel to lead fire crews. This is consistent throughout the US and is basic ICS. I would very much like to hear an explanation of these discrepancies.
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