Generac or Kohler whole home standby generator?

[thenne1713]

Hey guys, I posted about losing power (again) in the "scrounging firewood thread", but I figure if I ask here, the question will get more exposure, and hopefully more responses.

We bought this house about nine or ten months ago. We're in the U.P., Iron River MI. Since buying the house, we've lost power due to storms three or four times now. All but one time, the power was out for a minimum of 24 hours, and this time for about 48 hours. We have another house about an hour away, and we were able to go to that house, since there was still power there. But we lost some of our freezer stuff, as we have several freezers here, and just one fridge/freezer combination at the other house, so not enough freezer room for all of our stuff.

In any event, we're tired of dealing with the power losses, and the inconvenience of it. I've already emailed a Generac company, as well as the Kohler generator division, to set up meetings with both companies for possible purchasing. Generac seems to be the big name in standby generators, but I've read somewhere, or somebody told me that the Kohler was a better unit. I don't remember why they said that though, and I'd like to know what you guys think of either or both brands of generators. What do you or don't you like about either? With a large dollar purchase, I'd like to make one that's as intelligent as possible.

If it matters, we have two 500 gallon propane tanks on our property now. One for the house, and one for the detached garage furnace. We do heat with propane, as is our gas stove and dryer. Somebody had told me last year when I was considering a generator purchase, that I may want to consider upgrading the house tank to a 1,000 gallon tank, as apparently propane powered generators are pretty thirsty.

So, any and all input is appreciated, thanks!

re: LP $$, So bought the wife a 2-burner Blackstone last year, used an entire ($6)-1# bottle cooking the first meal and quickly switched to hose and bulk tank. All was different years back when kids small, when LP was $2/# in small bottles and $1+/-/# in bulk vs $3-$4/lb today? Your mileage/ area may vary?

 

[ChasSC]

I have 3 exercise options with the Kohler. I try to do a Loaded Excercise each month. Just like the portable generators tell you not to run for long periods without a load.

 

[Sidecarflip]

You can program them how often to exercise and when to exercise. Depending on the switch gear you can do loaded run time as well. I'm not sure if generac was/is offering it, but quite a few manufacturers started installing small load banks in their diesel generators to deal with aftertreatment issues from being light loaded all the time.
It was actually one of the biggest issues we saw with generarors. The older diesels would never fully get up to temp and slobber like crazy plugging the exhaust manifold, piping and muffler. Normally tossing a load bank on them and giving them a solid load for a few hours would keep them cleaned out. Seen more then a few to the point where the exhaust caught fire internally from all the soot and snott built up. The newer engines have the same issues, just worse with all the emissions equipment. They can't be left to run for long periods of time for the same reasons, however they cost a lot more to fix then just loading them up. I know kohler, power secure, and multiquip all started installing them. I'm 90% sure the generac we had at the township also had a built in load bank, but it was also ran under load once a month.
Really the same applies to any liquid cooled engine, they just don't get worked very hard sitting there doing nothing. Another issue is everyone wants to spec a generator thats too big for their needs. You really want to see at least 60%load in use at any given time, really we liked to see an 80% load but that wasn't practical in some installations.

Good to know Sean. I don't believe mine has a resistor load bank on it as it's a pre Tier 4 diesel with no EPA mandated emissions junk on it, just like both my (getting old but well maintained turbo charged and after cooled (( air to air charge air cooled farm tractors)). The JD supplied 4 cylinder engine in my Generac standby is neither. It is turbo charged but charge air cooling is via coolant HX, much like the older Cummins and Caterpillar engines that just used a coolant water radiator in the intake plenum.

Bet I can add a resistor bank to load it however. Problem with that is, I'll need to provide ambient air cooling for them. Something to look at in the future.

I have no issue with wet stacking presently and I've adjusted the idle runtime to a bit longer than the factory setting, that was as easy as adjusting the variable resistance pot. I went from the OEM 15 minute duration to 25 minutes to give the engine more time to reach operating temperature on the temperature gage and of course, like an perm-mag excited generator head, it needs to be run regularly to maintain the residual magnetism that allows the generator head to excite the primary windings.. Been down that road before with my old, sold Winco gas driven auxiliary portable genny. At least Winco provides detailed full fielding information in their owners manual. So far, in the last 20 years or so, no issues with the Generac other than the corroding steel enclosure but that will be addressed with the new powder coated aluminum enclosure I purchased from Generac a few months ago. I was kind of pleasantly surprised that Generac actually had the upgraded enclosure for a 20 year old unit, but they did. It wasn't cheap but then today, nothing is cheap. I do anticipate having to modify the enclosure (as far as component mounting points inside) to mount my older components components correctly but I'm up to that task no issue. I have plenty of threaded Riv Nuts and the insertion tool as well.

Heck, I just put a new roof on my Clearspan Truss Arch building and the cost of the new 5 ply rip stop fabric roof was more than the entire building cost (trusses and all plus a 14 foot x 10 foot wide roll up chain operated door), that the entire building cost when I bought it. least my insurance carrier coved it though I have not got reimbursed for the contractor to install it yet and I had to pay for that out of pocket. When I did the building originally, my wife and I, with the help of one of my front end loaders and 5 guys and a case of good beer, did it. I'm way to old now to do that so I hired it out. The building is 90 feet long x 43 feet wide and 14 feet high and interestingly, the insurance paid the full replacement cost with no pro-rate. Waiting for the reimbursement for the install yet. Not holding my breath. Insurance carriers always want their premiums paid right away or they cancel you but when it comes to paying out, it's a different story.

I keep all my farm equipment in it plus my wood pellets for the stoves in the shop as well as my corn to be burned and my RV as well. Considering it's size, it's about 1/3rd the cost of a comparable pole structure and I'm cheap anyway.

 

[mbrick]

After numerous power outages along with the inconvenience of running a gasoline powered 4000 Watt generator with manual transfer switch, I installed a 11kw Generac running on NG (Installed in 2014). This unit has been trouble free and my only regret was not having done it earlier. A couple of suggestions from my experience:

1. Make sure to get the cold weather kit (oil filter warmer). Mine had a hard time starting when the temp went below 5 degrees F. I purchased mine separately as a kit and installed myself (install instructions are straight forward).

I never knew the Generac has a cold weather accessory.
Thanks for this, I'll order and get it installed.

 

[Sidecarflip]

It ain't cheap

 

[SCMtnHaul]

I'm sure both Kohler and Generac make a wide range of generators and undoubtedly some are better than others but in my experience, and all the professionals I've spoken with in my area, Generac is often a bad gamble and considered a worse gamble than Kohler. Now older Generac models are considered to be great and absolutely worth it, but I'm not sure where the cutoff point is. A local electrician who sold and installed propane fuel Generacs for many years quit doing so about 6-8 years ago because there were too many problems with units arriving DOA, failing quickly after install, and Generac was a royal PITA to get any kind of warranty service or response. So he switched to Kohler and has had far fewer problems. Generac also will not support many older models. One of my clients has a 50kw propane Generac from 2003 or 2004 and the company basically told him he's SOL now that the main computer component has failed. Even the local dealer for DR Power equipment has said that since Generac bought out DR Power they have had a ton of problems, especially with the walk-behind brush mowers. As with all things YMMV. I think Generac is trying to grab a share of so many markets that quality has tanked in favor of quantity, just my .02.

 

[Sidecarflip]

Interesting but not 100 correct. I just purchased direct from Generac, a full aluminum enclosure for my 27KW diesel fired (John Deere turbo diesel) enclosed generator, the steel cabinet was corroding pretty bad so I'm replacing it. I also had to purchase a new battery trickle charger for it and both ite4ms were a seamless purchase and shipped within a week so I don't entirely agree with your comment.

Mine has been flawless for over 20 years now. Runs the entire farm and house minus my heavy draw 3 phase my machine and welding equipment draws.

 

[SCMtnHaul]

Mine has been flawless for over 20 years now

Without a doubt the older ones are better, and I only specifically referenced propane generators as being very problematic. I'm not looking for an argument but purchasing something from Generac is not the same as making a request that will cost them. I rarely find a company that doesn't want to sell products to customers, but finding a company that will own up to a mistake or defect and handle it promptly without trying to charge the customer can be challenging. One company I really like is Grosche and they make moka pots for brewing coffee. The lid on mine broke and they sent me a new one with no questions asked. Pretty rare to find that kind of service these days, even if it's only a coffee maker.