Heating options for new home construction

[BPS. LLC]

We will be building a new house next summer, approximately 2700 square feet, including the basement. Since it is new construction, the options for heat are endless. The obvious given is heating with wood in some capacity. If you guys had the option of picking your unit, what would you choose and why?

Here are two different ideas that I was thinking of:

Outdoor unit:

+ Burn larger wood
+ No mess in house
+ Little transporting of wood

-More expensive?
-The possibility of it being banned by township

I came across this, who I believe is a sponsor of the site:
http://www.yukon-eagle.com/

+ Better air circulation than a woodstove
+ Oil/Gas backup

- More movement of wood
- Burn smaller wood than outdoor unit

All we ever had was a woodstove insert. There are so many options out there its hard to make a choice. What do you guys think? I want to do it right the first time!

 

[magusta]

I had the exact same dilemma and wrestled with it for 6 months. Our project was complete remodel of 100 yr old farmhouse. Almost everyone tried to talk me into an OWB but I went with the yukon-eagle oil/wood combo for the following reason:

1. I wanted to go through less wood. What I don't burn myself I can sell and pay for the stove.
2. The cost was equivalent to an OWB
3. I wanted to be inside when loading it (Minnesota winters!)
4. I wanted the oil as backup so if I'm not there the spouse and kids don't need to mess with it.

It is all installed and ready to go. Just need a good cold snap to see how it works!

Good Luck!

 

[trailmaker]

If I were building new I would include a reinforced section of foundation for a masonry heater. They are very efficient and have no moving parts and ash only needs to be cleaned out once or twice a year, from what I hear. They also heat in a way that doesn't dry out the air like a wood burning stove.

The main drawback I can think of is high initial cost.

 

[BPS. LLC]

I had the exact same dilemma and wrestled with it for 6 months. Our project was complete remodel of 100 yr old farmhouse. Almost everyone tried to talk me into an OWB but I went with the yukon-eagle oil/wood combo for the following reason:

1. I wanted to go through less wood. What I don't burn myself I can sell and pay for the stove.
2. The cost was equivalent to an OWB
3. I wanted to be inside when loading it (Minnesota winters!)
4. I wanted the oil as backup so if I'm not there the spouse and kids don't need to mess with it.

It is all installed and ready to go. Just need a good cold snap to see how it works!

Good Luck!

I am really leaning that way. Do you bring a good bit of wood inside? What diameter and length of wood can it handle? We are still looking for land, I think the design would be nice with a walkout basement of some sort just to wheel in a load on a wheelbarrow and just close off that section of the basement, since I will be finishing the rest of the basement at some point.

Depending on the parcel of land we find we may go with either oil or gas, if we choose this system.

Check back in and let me know what you think of it!

 

[BSD]

I've been researching this for a little while too. We're doing new construction (albeit a modular house). Our current house has forced hot air which I hate the dust, and radical temperature swings. I've made up my mind that we're going with an indoor gasifier, probably an eko 40 or 60 with storage pumping through radiant in the slab of the detached garage and on the 2 new floors of the house. The storage is key however, w/o the storage you're burning 24x7 and the stove is over-heating the house or you're choking it back to keep the fire as low as possible, which produces more smoke. I love the idea of not having to pay the oil man any more but I'm also not going to waste resources burning extra wood with an OWB . Not to mention the way the DEP and state/local laws are setup they make it virtually illegal to have one now-a-days anyway if you live in a suburban area. I didn't want to have to go outside every 10 hrs to check the owb either. My wife definitely wouldn't want to hike out there to check on it either. We're going with an IWB that'll be in a garage bay in the basement, This way I can drive right in with a pallet of firewood with the forks on the tractor. drive right up to the boiler with it. I might consider other options if I didn't' have tractor access to my boiler location. IE, there is no way I'd be carry it down stairs. You could have one by a bulkhead door if you could just dump a load down with the tractor and draw from there directly.

Gassifiers are much more efficient and not smoke-stackers when you burn clean dry wood. with the storage system you can burn 1 ripping hot fire nice and clean to get your storage water up to ~185 and then coast the rest of the day/night on that thermal mass of water. With Radiant heat you can make longer use of "low" temperature water, all the way down to ~100 degrees. if you have radiators or a heat exchanger for hot air you will need to burn more as both become inefficient with lower temps. I like radiant too cause its a nice even heat and it warms your feet, which is a mental bonus too. Radiant is also provides more flexibility to integrate solar heating or geo-thermal heating/cooling if I should ever decide to go that route too. My father has some home made solar heaters for DHW and it's nice to just have a sunny day provide all the hot water he needs, totally free of charge.

We're going to have a LP wall mounted backup boiler to kick-in if I'm not here and the system is calling for heat. we already have LP for our range (which the wife won't live without).

Masonry heaters are nice and have their place too, but for me, I couldn't work it into the style of our house in an attractive manor.

edit, there is many hours of reading to be had @ ********** forums. particularly the boiler room. I spent the better part of yesterday there reading hundreds of pages of info.

 

[woodman6666]

Geothermal with in floor heat in the long run will beat all but you have to remain in the house for a while to make the numbers work. Even if you dont do the geo I would definately do the infloor heat. Just my two cents (We went with geo 2yrs ago on our new home and no complaints cools excellent and heats well. minor energy bills to run a couple pumps and fans).

 

[magusta]

I am really leaning that way. Do you bring a good bit of wood inside? What diameter and length of wood can it handle? We are still looking for land, I think the design would be nice with a walkout basement of some sort just to wheel in a load on a wheelbarrow and just close off that section of the basement, since I will be finishing the rest of the basement at some point.

Depending on the parcel of land we find we may go with either oil or gas, if we choose this system.

Check back in and let me know what you think of it!

My basement will remain unfinished and is an area about 30' x 30'. My plan is to start the season with about 2 cords down there and then supplement as required. I have some wood that is more dry that some other so I'm thinking once I start burning the less dry wood will dry further. I have a 2' x 2' access point in the foundation where I can drop the wood in. Yes it is extra handling but c'mon, how loong does it really take to stack a cord of wood, a couple of hours at most? The opening on the yukon is about 11" x 11" and can accept wood about 22" long if my memory serves. I expect to have to fill it 2-3 times per day. I have forced air system. I agree with the other guys a radiant, hot water system would be ideal and provide the best heat but I wasn't going that far with the remodel...

 

[mtfallsmikey]

Also, if dust/dirt are a concern for those of you considering a scorched-air furnace, many good elevtronic air cleaners are on the market today.

 

[esshup]

I think it all depends on your age, how long you plan on being in the house and what your schedule is like.

Personally, because I'm single and like to hunt, there are times when I would be away from the house for over a week at a time, in colder weather. Now, I could and do turn down the thermostat, but I still have to keep it above freezing.

I hate paying utilities. For that reason, I have an insert, with the existing natural gas forced air furnace as backup, and for A/C use during the summer.

If you're getting older, and plan on being in the house for a long time, I'd look into Geo. Wood won't get any lighter as you age, and cutting/hauling/stacking/feeding the furnace takes more and more effort and time. If you're younger, Geo or a regular furnace system with a wood insert as primary heat would work.

Radiant heat isn't good for warming up a house quickly that's cold. I don't know how it would work if you needed A/C. For A/C I think you need some sort of forced air system. woodman6666, how does A/C work with your in floor radiant heat?

Keep resale in mind - if something changes and you have to move for whatever reason the next owner might not want to use wood for heat.

 

[Marc]

I've been researching this for a little while too. We're doing new construction (albeit a modular house). Our current house has forced hot air which I hate the dust, and radical temperature swings. I've made up my mind that we're going with an indoor gasifier, probably an eko 40 or 60 with storage pumping through radiant in the slab of the detached garage and on the 2 new floors of the house. The storage is key however, w/o the storage you're burning 24x7 and the stove is over-heating the house or you're choking it back to keep the fire as low as possible, which produces more smoke. I love the idea of not having to pay the oil man any more but I'm also not going to waste resources burning extra wood with an OWB . Not to mention the way the DEP and state/local laws are setup they make it virtually illegal to have one now-a-days anyway if you live in a suburban area. I didn't want to have to go outside every 10 hrs to check the owb either. My wife definitely wouldn't want to hike out there to check on it either. We're going with an IWB that'll be in a garage bay in the basement, This way I can drive right in with a pallet of firewood with the forks on the tractor. drive right up to the boiler with it. I might consider other options if I didn't' have tractor access to my boiler location. IE, there is no way I'd be carry it down stairs. You could have one by a bulkhead door if you could just dump a load down with the tractor and draw from there directly.

Gassifiers are much more efficient and not smoke-stackers when you burn clean dry wood. with the storage system you can burn 1 ripping hot fire nice and clean to get your storage water up to ~185 and then coast the rest of the day/night on that thermal mass of water. With Radiant heat you can make longer use of "low" temperature water, all the way down to ~100 degrees. if you have radiators or a heat exchanger for hot air you will need to burn more as both become inefficient with lower temps. I like radiant too cause its a nice even heat and it warms your feet, which is a mental bonus too. Radiant is also provides more flexibility to integrate solar heating or geo-thermal heating/cooling if I should ever decide to go that route too. My father has some home made solar heaters for DHW and it's nice to just have a sunny day provide all the hot water he needs, totally free of charge.

We're going to have a LP wall mounted backup boiler to kick-in if I'm not here and the system is calling for heat. we already have LP for our range (which the wife won't live without).

Masonry heaters are nice and have their place too, but for me, I couldn't work it into the style of our house in an attractive manor.

edit, there is many hours of reading to be had @ ********** forums. particularly the boiler room. I spent the better part of yesterday there reading hundreds of pages of info.

I like the cut of this guy's jib.

Platonically speaking, of course.

At least look at indoor hydronic systems.

After living in one house with forced air and two with hydronic (one with baseboards, one with cast iron radiators), I prefer the hydronic.

 

[mtfallsmikey]

Hey BSD, whilst you are prowling around on the net, go to www.heatinghelp.com

All you will ever wanna know about hydronics.

 

[CrappieKeith]

Not saying Yukon's are the only way ,but we do make a well built efficient furnace. The only U.L. listed on the market.

Going with ducted warm air you will have full control over you air quality.
Heating,cooling,filtration,humidity,airborne pathogen free.

The Yukon's do not need monsterous firewood capacities as they make the btu's that are available in a lb. of wood and then exchange all of the available heats only venting what physics says we need for a flue gas temperature.
With the proper sized furnace 30 years is A typical for a life. If parts fail they are normally in stock and can be shipped UPS the same day of the order. We also offer technical service via the phone.
Should a firebox let go they are replaceable instead of changing out the enitre furnace. You can also switch from oil to gas or visa versa if that became a choice down the road.

True....there are many choices to make in building your new home.
I believe that there is not a finer furnace than a Yukon.
I have one and if I had to loose it I'm not sure what I'd do. Finanacially speaking. It's put 30K in my pocket since I've installed it. This year will be another 2985$
I like my house warm and toasty. I like heat when we have power outages.
I like not having to re-light every day,just refire. I like sleeping through the night awakening to a nice hot bed of coals.
I like going through half the wood my neighbor goes through.
I like not dumping ashes everyday or even every week.
I like that it is sturdy and dependable,after 14 heating seasons it has preformed flawlessly.

Well there's my 2 cents.

 

[1harlowr]

If I was rebuilding my house I would do mostly the same. Have a OWB that heats my hot water that I installed a couple years after building the house. Have a back up furnace that burns propane that only runs if we are away several days in the winter. The difference this time would be radiant floor heat. I would love to wake up to heated tile in the bathroom.

I can get away with loading the stove once at night for all but the handful of coldest nights that are -0F.

I go though at most 10 cord a year.

 

[Highbeam]

If heated tile is what you want you can cheaply install the electric grid style heaters beneath the tile in just that room. I know it's power but they don't use much at all and only need to be turned on when you are going to use the bathroom.

On new home construction if you want to use a wood furnace I would strongly encourage a basement installation. That way the furnace can gravity feed the ductwork. Either a walkout basement or a good way to bring wood in would be great.

I'm not a big fan of the water pipes in the slab. Just a preference I guess.

 

[CharlieG]

They've been using Pex in slab and insulated flooring in Europe for like 50 years with no problems. Many homes use it now for hot cold potable water supply. Not like the copper lines which corroded in cement and leaked.

 

[BPS. LLC]

Not saying Yukon's are the only way ,but we do make a well built efficient furnace. The only U.L. listed on the market.

Going with ducted warm air you will have full control over you air quality.
Heating,cooling,filtration,humidity,airborne pathogen free.

The Yukon's do not need monsterous firewood capacities as they make the btu's that are available in a lb. of wood and then exchange all of the available heats only venting what physics says we need for a flue gas temperature.
With the proper sized furnace 30 years is A typical for a life. If parts fail they are normally in stock and can be shipped UPS the same day of the order. We also offer technical service via the phone.
Should a firebox let go they are replaceable instead of changing out the enitre furnace. You can also switch from oil to gas or visa versa if that became a choice down the road.

True....there are many choices to make in building your new home.
I believe that there is not a finer furnace than a Yukon.
I have one and if I had to loose it I'm not sure what I'd do. Finanacially speaking. It's put 30K in my pocket since I've installed it. This year will be another 2985$
I like my house warm and toasty. I like heat when we have power outages.
I like not having to re-light every day,just refire. I like sleeping through the night awakening to a nice hot bed of coals.
I like going through half the wood my neighbor goes through.
I like not dumping ashes everyday or even every week.
I like that it is sturdy and dependable,after 14 heating seasons it has preformed flawlessly.

Well there's my 2 cents.

I'm sure this could be answered with a little research, but I'll just ask here first. Can the Yukon be utilized for radiant heat, or only forced air? If so, is one or the other more efficient?

With radiant hot water heat, are baseboards required, or can pipes be ran on all floors eliminating the need? Our only current heat is antiquated electric baseboard...and I do not like it! That's why I love our insert. It seems as though radiant is more "even" and enjoyed by most.

As you can see, I have a lot more research to do, keep your opinions coming.

 

[mtfallsmikey]

I'm sure this could be answered with a little research, but I'll just ask here first. Can the Yukon be utilized for radiant heat, or only forced air? If so, is one or the other more efficient?

With radiant hot water heat, are baseboards required, or can pipes be ran on all floors eliminating the need? Our only current heat is antiquated electric baseboard...and I do not like it! That's why I love our insert. It seems as though radiant is more "even" and enjoyed by most.

As you can see, I have a lot more research to do, keep your opinions coming.

No. you need a boiler...no baseboards required, can be all radiant in the floor, radiant and radiant panels, or a mix of BB/radiant...and, as always, please do a comprehensive heat loss analysis first, then design the system. Disadvantage is the need for separate A.C.

 

[logbutcher]

Building from scratch we chose to go with two wood stoves in similar "wings" of the house. The wood heating is 24/7, and 99% of the load. The site was ledge, so slab foundation was the only real choice.

Like you, there were many options for wood heating.

Masonry Heater/Russian Fireplace.

1. Net cost would have been ~ 5 times the net cost of 1 high end wood stove.
2. Space. The Masonry Heater needs a large area for the unit to be efficient.
3. Reinforced foundation for the 4 tons of the unit.
4. Not so important, but we were not familar with the technique of the unit.
5. The advantages seemed to be many: single loading per day, clean long heating, little maintenance, even heating over a long time.

Outdoor Wood Boiler
Not a choice because of the outdoor loading, high cost and time for installation, electric power need, poor reps for most manufacturers.

High end gasifier central furnace.
1. Cost for the unit such as Tarm (we looked seriously) and associated installation and maintenance costs.
2. Space.

Pellet Stove or Pellet Furnace
Forget it....period. Supply problems, power needs, lack of real heat capacity,
reliability.

Stand alone wood stoves finally were the only choice.
1. There was an EPA cat stove in use in the original part of the house with no plumbing to worry about.
2. We've used wood stoves for full and partial heating for many years.
3. We know the technology, maintenance, use.
4. Cost: even high end wood stoves are way less than any of the other options (except pellets).
5. The 1100 ft² house was easily designed around one stove for the two stories.
6. The woodlot will provide the 6-8 cords/year needed for heating maybe forever (or until we don't come down for breakfast !).

IF we did not have to build ourselves on a tight budget, I would have chosen a Masonry Heater for its simplicity, ease of use, small use of fuel, aesthetics.
Just our experience building.
Friends/contractors who have radiant floor heating here find that they need additional direct sources for warmth. The floors warm up slowly with zoning. Cost for running radiant floor heat IF using gas or oil are high. Radiant (direct) heaters such as Masonry Stoves or wood stoves warm up faster and more comfortably.....romantic too.

 

[BlueRidgeMark]

I've been researching this for a little while too. We're doing new construction (albeit a modular house).

....


edit, there is many hours of reading to be had @ ********** forums. particularly the boiler room. I spent the better part of yesterday there reading hundreds of pages of info.

This whole post makes WAY too much sense! Git outta here!

 

[woodman6666]

I will say it one more time Geothermal cools and heats basically for free and you dont have to do anything. Then put in a nice wood burning fireplace for your woodburning fix.