How do you keep people out?

[benjo75]

I didn't want to hijack Jeff's thread. I can't seem to keep people out of my work zone either. A lot of times there's just two of us on the job. Me in the tree and the tractor loading brush. I specifically tell everyone during the estimate that absolutely no one is allowed within 200 ft of me, my crew, my equipment and the work zone at any time during the job. I also tell them again when we show up before starting the job. I set up cones and sometimes caution tape. Mainly for theirs and our safety. But every time I shut off a saw or truck, that's their cue to run over and start talking. Usually about something stupid. I tell them again that we all wear hearing protection and can't hear them. Plus I tell them again they're within 200 ft and if I have to tell them again, we're going to shut the job down and charge them $200 hour until they leave us alone and allow us to work safely.

Now this is the 4th time I have told them. But they keep coming. I've had them go under caution tape. I've had them move my cones and drive right under me. They will stand there with their hand on the fender of the bucket truck while I'm around wires. Until I see them. Then they get to see me throw a fit. They start hollering wanting a limb cut that us not on the estimate. I have even had one guy take the rope and try to get a wrap on the tree brake and tell me to make the cut. This was while the tractor was on the opposite side of the house loading and I was in the bucket waiting. I look down and there he is. So I have to come down, get out and give him a chewing . Doesn't even phase him ten minutes later he's back again. They have moved cones and ran over ropes. My crew has strict orders to run anyone off that's within 200 ft. But like me they're working too and sometimes don't see them until they're already on us. Evidently electric wheel chairs are exempt from cones and tape. Along with bicycles and any undesirables who happen to be strolling by.

Is there any way to keep people out of the work zone short of physically dragging them out? Do I hire an extra person to do nothing but keep people out and add it on to their bill? I run a small crew to keep costs down plus I can't find anyone who's worth having on my crew anyway. So everyone there is running 100% capacity and doesn't have time to herd cattle. When I have to come all the way down to tell someone something they have been told a half a dozen times I tend to get a little short. Rant over. Any advice? Thanks.

 

[jefflovstrom]

I didn't want to hijack Jeff's thread. I can't seem to keep people out of my work zone either. A lot of times there's just two of us on the job. Me in the tree and the tractor loading brush. I specifically tell everyone during the estimate that absolutely no one is allowed within 200 ft of me, my crew, my equipment and the work zone at any time during the job. I also tell them again when we show up before starting the job. I set up cones and sometimes caution tape. Mainly for theirs and our safety. But every time I shut off a saw or truck, that's their cue to run over and start talking. Usually about something stupid. I tell them again that we all wear hearing protection and can't hear them. Plus I tell them again they're within 200 ft and if I have to tell them again, we're going to shut the job down and charge them $200 hour until they leave us alone and allow us to work safely.

Now this is the 4th time I have told them. But they keep coming. I've had them go under caution tape. I've had them move my cones and drive right under me. They will stand there with their hand on the fender of the bucket truck while I'm around wires. Until I see them. Then they get to see me throw a fit. They start hollering wanting a limb cut that us not on the estimate. I have even had one guy take the rope and try to get a wrap on the tree brake and tell me to make the cut. This was while the tractor was on the opposite side of the house loading and I was in the bucket waiting. I look down and there he is. So I have to come down, get out and give him a chewing . Doesn't even phase him ten minutes later he's back again. They have moved cones and ran over ropes. My crew has strict orders to run anyone off that's within 200 ft. But like me they're working too and sometimes don't see them until they're already on us. Evidently electric wheel chairs are exempt from cones and tape. Along with bicycles and any undesirables who happen to be strolling by.

Is there any way to keep people out of the work zone short of physically dragging them out? Do I hire an extra person to do nothing but keep people out and add it on to their bill? I run a small crew to keep costs down plus I can't find anyone who's worth having on my crew anyway. So everyone there is running 100% capacity and doesn't have time to herd cattle. When I have to come all the way down to tell someone something they have been told a half a dozen times I tend to get a little short. Rant over. Any advice? Thanks.

Bottom line, increase the cost of the job to hire a guy to protect your work zone,,
Boring job, but it will benefit you in case something happens as you have shown what you have done to CYA.
Jeff

 

[ChoppyChoppy]

This spring I was clearing fence row trees on OUR road. I had some stranger try to chew my as for blocking the road. On the horn and everything. Public kind of uses it even though its a shortcut)He moved quickly when I opened the skidded grapple (16ft opening) and started backing to his car.

 

[treesmith]

If somebody is in your exclusion zone, you have to stop work, doesn't matter who they are. If they're not wearing full ppe inc hi vis and not specifically connected to the job at hand, as in a council arborist/body Corp rep or similar, then you have to stop until they are gone. If you need more people than you need more people.

If something goes wrong they will dissect every action, every circumstance. You must be aware of the hazards and have a plan in place to control/reduce risk to acceptable levels. If someone is in your zone and you carry on and someone gets hurt then....

It's on you

warning - this sig causes splinters

 

[jefflovstrom]

If somebody is in your exclusion zone, you have to stop work, doesn't matter who they are. If they're not wearing full ppe inc hi vis and not specifically connected to the job at hand, as in a council arborist/body Corp rep or similar, then you have to stop until they are gone. If you need more people than you need more people.

If something goes wrong they will dissect every action, every circumstance. You must be aware of the hazards and have a plan in place to control/reduce risk to acceptable levels. If someone is in your zone and you carry on and someone gets hurt then....

It's on you

warning - this sig causes splinters

yup

 

[northmanlogging]

snear and swear a lot... make fun of em a bit... it gets awkward fast... they leave I win.

but what i do isnt exactly public relations type work

 

[BC WetCoast]

Put it in your quote that there will a $200/hr charge (15 mnute minimum) for everytime the homeowner comes within the work zone.

Another way of doing it is a way a friend of mine who was a recreation consultant. If the client never talked to him during the length of the project, he reduced the cost of the job by 10%. You could do the same, if the homeowner doesn't show his sorry ass until you're ready to leave, you reduce the price by 10%.

If there is a problem with others entering the work zone, hire a traffic flagging company to supply flaggers to keep your work site safe. Add it to the bill.

Or your helper can't run the loader simultaneously, he has to patrol the drop zone. Adds to the cost.

That said, we don't have that much problems, 200' to me seems excessive. In our area, 200' is 5 residental lots. There is no way we could keep neighbours 2 lots over out of their yards. It would be a challenge to keep the next door neighbour out of their yard. I think you need to be realistic on the size of your work zone.

 

[benjo75]

I have to have a number to tell people and I can't change it every job. A lot of my work is in rural settings where people own at least several acres. On the jobs that are in town I don't try to keep people away that are several houses down. But we routinely do trees that are over three yards. Sometimes 4 yards if they're in the corner. And I have to have control of those yards also or someone could wander under me.

On one job we were pulling over a large Red Oak stub about 35 ft high. with a 150' 3/4 rope. It was an older bull rope and we were pulling with a pretty good size tractor and the rope broke. The rope went 150' the opposite direction across a service drop and across the neighbors property. That neighbor being an old lady that I had ran off several times for standing at the fence on her own property watching. Which happened to be under the drip line of this tree. If she had been standing there and if it had been a primary wire instead of a service drop, she could have been electrocuted or at least knocked down by the rope. Very freak incident but I have seen some very rare things in my 25 years of doing this. That's why I try to cover all of my bases. So if I just tell everyone to stand back ten feet, that's really not going to work for me. We regularly use 200' rope to pull with. If that rope was stretched out and broke it could go 200' the opposite direction. That would be a 400' area that could be considered dangerous. Obviously I use good ropes in most situations but if we're pulling a lot of trees especially in mud I'll use an older retired catch rope. The way I cut trees, if the rope breaks nothing goes wrong with the tree itself. It either falls in the right direction or it stands there. And I've only ever had that one particular rope break in 25 years of doing this. I inspect and change my rope more than regularly. And I knew that rope wasn't in the best shape.

I saw a show about this crew who implodes buildings in big cities. The foreman said when they pull up on the job they own the work site and surrounding areas. I know tree work doesn't cover as big an area as that but an accident is an accident. So I tell everyone 200' or go inside. Or better yet leave. I have seen chunks dropped from 70 ft hit another chunk and spin all different ways. Sometimes flying 40 or 50 ft. So if I just tell them to stand back a little bit they could still get hit.

 

[jefflovstrom]

I have to have a number to tell people and I can't change it every job. A lot of my work is in rural settings where people own at least several acres. On the jobs that are in town I don't try to keep people away that are several houses down. But we routinely do trees that are over three yards. Sometimes 4 yards if they're in the corner. And I have to have control of those yards also or someone could wander under me.

On one job we were pulling over a large Red Oak stub about 35 ft high. with a 150' 3/4 rope. It was an older bull rope and we were pulling with a pretty good size tractor and the rope broke. The rope went 150' the opposite direction across a service drop and across the neighbors property. That neighbor being an old lady that I had ran off several times for standing at the fence on her own property watching. Which happened to be under the drip line of this tree. If she had been standing there and if it had been a primary wire instead of a service drop, she could have been electrocuted or at least knocked down by the rope. Very freak incident but I have seen some very rare things in my 25 years of doing this. That's why I try to cover all of my bases. So if I just tell everyone to stand back ten feet, that's really not going to work for me. We regularly use 200' rope to pull with. If that rope was stretched out and broke it could go 200' the opposite direction. That would be a 400' area that could be considered dangerous. Obviously I use good ropes in most situations but if we're pulling a lot of trees especially in mud I'll use an older retired catch rope. The way I cut trees, if the rope breaks nothing goes wrong with the tree itself. It either falls in the right direction or it stands there. And I've only ever had that one particular rope break in 25 years of doing this. I inspect and change my rope more than regularly. And I knew that rope wasn't in the best shape.

I saw a show about this crew who implodes buildings in big cities. The foreman said when they pull up on the job they own the work site and surrounding areas. I know tree work doesn't cover as big an area as that but an accident is an accident. So I tell everyone 200' or go inside. Or better yet leave. I have seen chunks dropped from 70 ft hit another chunk and spin all different ways. Sometimes flying 40 or 50 ft. So if I just tell them to stand back a little bit they could still get hit.

Yup, I will take my work zone before people wake up, I will enforce it and I will probably get a call from someone who said I was rude,,
One day a year makes them mad,
See ya next year!
Jeff

 

[benjo75]

I agree Jeff. I have told them I don't care if they like me or not but I do care that everyone goes home safe and alive that night.

 

[banjobart]

In my perfect world...
...
...we would just shootem.

 

[Crftrapper535]

Well just saying but if you got a chipper put them on chipper duty they seem not to last long on that???? No back to the real point maybe hire a old bar bouncer to kick them off the site or something or charge them more if they bother you but also that's a problem of doing tree work in residential places people will bug the **** out of you and its always that nosey guy that lives next door asking well how much you charge? And other stupid **** I personally don't have to deal with those people since I work in the actual logging industry where very few people are around and I always go by the saying play stupid games win stupid prizes if I cut a oak tree down and it hits you what was your dumbass doing to get hit also ever think maybe there doing it for you attention? If you stopped even acknowledging there around would they give up maybe?

 

[Mad Professor]

I heard some large dogs train well and are good at herding.

 

[Seachaser]

Interruption fee?

 

[Maintenance supervisor]

They make chain link panels that link together, when I worked at a university it was the only way to keep students from coming into a work zone.
Honestly most people don't understand the danger they are in, rather then being a tremendous dic about narcissistically "owning " the work zone ,maybe explain how you wouldn't sleep well if you crippled a bystander with a branch or log .
When you're irritated by customer service so much that its ruining the job for you, word will get out and ....bonus no more customers! There are 10 other guys waiting to cut trees out there.

 

[Lightning Performance]

Interruption fee?

Absolutely after the third time. Anymore we/I leave. You still get billed. It happened twice. One paid. One paid half for the morning. Dumb neighbors get warned once then get down and flip or call the cops. They come I go back to work. Stand under the tree to block work you get arrested. Sidewalks and streets are policed by the police and they will stop traffic for you. Deliver coffee and doughnuts on cut day. Set it up before hand with a phone call. Townships rarely offer or grant shutdown permits for sidewalks or roads.

Nothing like a pissed off rope guy who has stuff to do later. Give him the nod and laugh. When people scream at me I play def and dumb while screaming at my groundie while they hide the laughter. To hell with them problem people. Just start my saw up and rev it. They usually leave at that point. This happens with fighting couples. Not my problem but work stops until I get paid in full right then right there with married people. They have joint bank accounts and now it's a cash deal or no deal we leave.