How to up firewood production

[groundup]

So I normally sell about 30 cords of woods each year. With little to no advertising and never have any wood left over.

I am confident I can sell twice that amount, so I am working on a plan to up production.

I have a full time job so I relegate wood work to weekends only.

Here are some ways I am considering to up production

Hire help 7$ an hour for someone to just split, I have a few family members that are young and out of work that help me regularly and would do it

Faster splitter - I currently have a Huskee 22 ton

Get a dump truck or trailer - I currently deliver using a 3/4 ton chevy with high sides

Spend more time working on it - I usually try to cut one day and do family stuff the other day

What would you do?

 

[leon]

firewood

So I normally sell about 30 cords of woods each year. With little to no advertising and never have any wood left over.

I am confident I can sell twice that amount, so I am working on a plan to up production.

I have a full time job so I relegate wood work to weekends only.

Here are some ways I am considering to up production

Hire help 7$ an hour for someone to just split, I have a few family members that are young and out of work that help me regularly and would do it

Faster splitter - I currently have a Huskee 22 ton

Get a dump truck or trailer - I currently deliver using a 3/4 ton chevy with high sides

Spend more time working on it - I usually try to cut one day and do family stuff the other day

What would you do?

about this:

1. cut firewood lengths to 12 inches then sell it by the thrown cord per 165 cubic feet.
2. firewood conveyor
3. sell the processed firewood by the ton-this is legal for trade in all states

 

[groundup]

about this:

1. cut firewood lengths to 12 inches then sell it by the thrown cord per 165 cubic feet.
2. firewood conveyor
3. sell the processed firewood by the ton-this is legal for trade in all states

Firewood conveyor is something I am thinking about, maybe converting a grain/hay elevator. I see them pretty cheap on craigslist occasionally, any advice on getting a conveyor?

I already have a good system for measuring out cords as my wood is stacked and I have had enough thrown cords on the truck to know what it should look like.

 

[MTNBOY]

my buddy put a higher flow pump on his splitter and it sped up ram speed alot. I also started up pricing split as to just sell it in the rounds. saves me alot of time.

 

[D&B Mack]

3. sell the processed firewood by the ton-this is legal for trade in all states

Not in PA, I specifically asked this question to the department of ag. Weight of wood can vary, so there is no standard it can be set by. (per them)

 

[jcl]

processor!!!
only way to go. mine paid for it self in two years, there's many out there at different $$$ amounts and sizes take some time to look at them before you pick one took me 6 months and a forestry trade show where there were many being run so i could see them in person.

 

[D&B Mack]

What would you do?

Spend some time and sit down and figure out the amount of time each stage of the sale process is the most consuming. Firewood profitability is concentrated on labor. Find out the most labor intensive portion first, then attack that. Keep moving down your list, and at some point, you will start this over again and keep making your operation more efficient.

When I started, it went (from most consuming to least):

1. Splitting
2. Unloading for delivery
3. Loading for delivery
4. Raw product acquisition

Solutions:

1. Bought a higher grade, faster splitter.
2. Bought a dump trailer.
3. Quit stacking in the trailer; just made sure I was a least a little over-compensated for quantity.
4. Got most of the product loading by tree services in trailer at their yard. Cut tops from loggers.

Then I did it over again.

1. Loading for delivery
2. Splitting
3. Stacking for storage while seasoning

Solutions:

1. Bought a mini skid steer
2. Bought a conveyor
3. Quit stacking, just kept turning over the pile throughout the year

And so on, just kept doing this and tackling obstacles as I could. Just have to increase efficiency as your budget allows.

IMO, loading/unloading are the worst two time consumers. Speed those up and you will save yourself a lot of time. Felling, limbing and bucking trees for firewood is a real loss unless you are getting paid to remove the tree. Otherwise, you will be working for pennies and hour, unless you get a lot more for a cord than we do here.

 

[leon]

firewood

Firewood conveyor is something I am thinking about, maybe converting a grain/hay elevator. I see them pretty cheap on craigslist occasionally, any advice on getting a conveyor?

I already have a good system for measuring out cords as my wood is stacked and I have had enough thrown cords on the truck to know what it should look like.

If your in it to win it the handstacking is costing you to much
money and time.


Buying a conveyor specifically for firewood is the best way.
The Rainier Hydraulics/Chomper Firewood Processor folks
and the Timberwolf folks have excellent units for sale.

Ideally you want a firewwood conveyor with a trash separator grid
to get rid of the dirt and small chunks of wood debris.

 

[mellow]

Do you mind saying where in MD you are? I know here on the Eastern Shore firewood is a saturated market with every tim bob and harry selling, hard to make new customers with everyone so price conscious.

I for one would love to build a wood kiln to set myself apart from others.

 

[groundup]

Do you mind saying where in MD you are? I know here on the Eastern Shore firewood is a saturated market with every tim bob and harry selling, hard to make new customers with everyone so price conscious.

I for one would love to build a wood kiln to set myself apart from others.

I'm in Harford county, about 20 minutes from the city. I don't sell to the city but to the suburbs around it.

I have a lot of competition but there's enough customers to make it work.

I don't quite understand how to get more money for kiln dried wood

 

[Steve NW WI]

Edited first sentence: Leon is incorrect about selling firewood by weight. Log for pulp are a different matter, but they're not firewood. In most states, the ONLY legal measurement is by the cord or fraction thereof. But that's a battle that's been fought over and over...

I'd vote for the dump trailer, and extra help when you can get it. 2 guys on a splitter will more than double the production of any half decent splitter. The key is to always keep the ram going back and forth and not sitting there waiting for the next split.

Last choice would be to throw more time at it. We as a people don't spend enough time with the people that matter as it is.

 

[groundup]

Last choice would be to throw more time at it. We as a people don't spend enough time with the people that matter as it is.[/QUOTE]

Amen to that and that's what I want to avoid at all cost.

The thing about the dump is that it is a lot of money/maintenance and only saves me 15 minutes per load, in that I can throw a cord of wood off in 15 minutes using my ez loader.

Where I am thinking a quicker splitter would be less money and cut a bigger portion of time off, it takes me about 2 hrs to split a cord now, how low could I get that with another better splitter?

 

[D&B Mack]

The thing about the dump is that it is a lot of money/maintenance and only saves me 15 minutes per load, in that I can throw a cord of wood off in 15 minutes using my ez loader.

Are you throwing a full cord in the back of a pick-up truck?

When you say ez loader, are you talking about those roll out fabric-tailgate contraptions? I didn't think you could put a full cord on one of those. Or are you talking about an ez dumper, dump bed insert?

Where I am thinking a quicker splitter would be less money and cut a bigger portion of time off, it takes me about 2 hrs to split a cord now, how low could I get that with another better splitter?

Depends, how are you getting the wood away from the splitter. With an inertia splitter, I can do a cord an hour (pending upon the type of rounds), but you either need a.) a conveyor or b.) the room to keep pulling your splitter back from a pile.

2 hours for a cord is pretty good for that splitter, a helper would probably increase your rate more. Unless you go for a large (expensive) splitter.

 

[mellow]

I increased my output by putting a 4 way wedge on my splitter, I can now do a cord in an hour if I have the right sized rounds and book it.

 

[D&B Mack]

I increased my output by putting a 4 way wedge on my splitter, I can now do a cord in an hour if I have the right sized rounds and book it.

Is that 'a cord in one hour', or 'a cord an hour for 8 hrs'? I'm just wondering where you are throwing the 8 cords.

 

[mellow]

I only do a cord or two at a time on the weekends so that is first cord in an hour, drink a beer, then run another cord which usually takes longer. If I had someone helping me I could probably maintain that for 8 hours, never tried.

 

[groundup]

Are you throwing a full cord in the back of a pick-up truck?

When you say ez loader, are you talking about those roll out fabric-tailgate contraptions? I didn't think you could put a full cord on one of those. Or are you talking about an ez dumper, dump bed insert?



Depends, how are you getting the wood away from the splitter. With an inertia splitter, I can do a cord an hour (pending upon the type of rounds), but you either need a.) a conveyor or b.) the room to keep pulling your splitter back from a pile.

2 hours for a cord is pretty good for that splitter, a helper would probably increase your rate more. Unless you go for a large (expensive) splitter.

Yeah roll out fabric, I have high sides ll the way around. Once I take them off the back and kick the top of the pile off I have about 3/4 cord left on and I throw the stuff around the edges off and then crank the rest, takes 15 minutes.

I have an unlimited (several open acres) amount of space to work so that's not an issue.

Currently I'm cutting my trees down and they vary greatly in size. I have free range over 90 acres of half woods between two properties. I only cut the dead or falling and can't keep up with the number of trees that need to come down. Would start buying log loads if needed but not there yet I don't think

 

[leon]

firewood et. al.

Leon, as usual is full of something brown and stinky about selling firewood by weight. Log for pulp are a different matter, but they're not firewood. In most states, the ONLY legal measurement is by the cord or fraction thereof. But that's a battle that's been fought over and over...

I'd vote for the dump trailer, and extra help when you can get it. 2 guys on a splitter will more than double the production of any half decent splitter. The key is to always keep the ram going back and forth and not sitting there waiting for the next split.

Last choice would be to throw more time at it. We as a people don't spend enough time with the people that matter as it is.

I do not think it is required of you to insult me.
Nor would I ever stoop to this.

I have never insulted anyone on the AS forum.
I havew never had the need to insult anyone
as everyone here knows.

My opinion is simply based on the legal fact and legal trade
with regard to the use of weights and measure in each state of the union.

And the fact that selling fire wood by the ton is the fairest way LEGAL way
to make a lot of money with green and seasoned wood and provide the buyer
with good value for hardwoods or softwood used for heating.

Selling firewood by the ton with alegal scale ticket from a certified scale eliminates
the arguments about ricks, face cords, cord size etc., and no one loses their shirts
or becomes an inclined plane surrounding a shaft A.K.A. SCREWED.

If you are not in it to win it by reducing your labor and increasing the value of the
product simply by regulating the weight by as the seller thereby increasing its value as
a fuel product to the consumer and creating repeat customers BECAUSE they know
that the ton of wood they have was weighed ona scale and THERE IS NO QUESTION
OR BICKERING ABOUT THE VOLUME OF FIREWOOD AS THE VOLUME ISSUE IS
COMPLETELY OUT OF THE PICTURE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


The local firewood seller in this area buys mill reject logs for 33 dollars a ton;
so tell me where I am wrong.opcorn:

 

[Steve NW WI]

Leon, I apologize for insulting you personally.

Now back to professionally, or amateur in my case. From MN, this page: http://mn.gov/commerce/weights-and-measures/images/BuyingFirewood.pdf spells out how firewood is measured and sold:

How is firewood measured?
Firewood may be measured by the cubic foot, the cubic
meter, or the cord. If measured by the foot or meter, the
wood is first stacked with all pieces placed parallel to
each other. The wood is then said to be ranked. Wood
must be ranked if it is to be measured accurately. Ranking
minimizes the space between the sticks, or pieces, of
wood. Some sellers use various cross-stacking methods to
exaggerate the quantity of wood delivered. Do not
attempt to measure cross-stacked wood.
What is a cord?
A cord has a specific legal definition in Minnesota:
• One cord is 128 cubic feet in four foot lengths.
• If the wood is sawed, a cord is 110 cubic feet when
ranked, or 160 cubic feet when thrown loosely into a
truck.
• If the wood is sawed and split, a cord is 120 cubic feet
when ranked, and 175 cubic feet when thrown loosely
into a truck.

Commercial sales of wood - NOT firewood, but logs, pulpwood, etc., are sold by the ton across the scale (note that I mentioned that in my original post), however this is not any more fair to the consumer than a volume measurement when dealing with firewood. Green vs dry red oak varies in weight by 1500lbs per cord (according to this chart: Wood Species - Weight at various Moisture Contents We can argue exact amounts, but the fact is green wood weighs more than dry wood, and that allows for cheating. Joe Homeowner can easily understand a cord, when he has a 4x4x8 stack in front of him. It's much harder for him to determine if the wood he just bought by the ton has 600 or 1200 lbs of water in it. Generally, buyers of bulk wood can assume it's green or nearly so. This old study http://nrs.fs.fed.us/pubs/rn/rn_ne133.pdf from 1970 shows logs left to air dry over 12 weeks only lost 7% of it's weight due to drying over that period. That's fairly insignificant when buying bulk logs, and most wood will not sit on a landing that long.

Feel free to quote one official state document stating that firewood can be sold by the ton, and I'll back down. Until then, everything I've seen says I'm correct and you are in error.

 

[GeeVee]

Last choice would be to throw more time at it. We as a people don't spend enough time with the people that matter as it is.

Amen to that and that's what I want to avoid at all cost.

The thing about the dump is that it is a lot of money/maintenance and only saves me 15 minutes per load, in that I can throw a cord of wood off in 15 minutes using my ez loader.

Where I am thinking a quicker splitter would be less money and cut a bigger portion of time off, it takes me about 2 hrs to split a cord now, how low could I get that with another better splitter?[/QUOTE]

With a 6X12 dump trailer, you can carry more, surely. Yes maintenacne on four tires and hubs, the occasional battery, but I dont see it being a hindrance.

Skid steer seems needed.

And put a couple of young people to work on piecemeal, then speed means less.