Is there danger in running out of fuel WOT?

[cpr]

Yeah, I come down on the "don't do it side." Not worth the risk. If you run your saws enough, you easily recognize what's going on. I can feel/hear it lean down and know I'm due. The moment it starts to lean out, I return to idle and pull the saw out. I let it run off on it's own while heading for the jug. If I have a big and/or important cut to make, I top off before going for it.

On the flip side, I don't gun a cold saw either. High idle if so equipped, but only until it will sustain on the reset. The bullet gets hot and expands way faster than the barrel. I give them a good 60 seconds plus out of the gate to heat up. Good time to put on the glasses, hardhat (if falling), earplugs, etc. Cold seizures are even more rare, but why risk it? I spent $700 on a new 372 and I'm going to cry over $0.0001 worth of mix to heat it up?

opcorn:opcorn:opcorn:

 

[russhd1997]

I'm going to cry over $0.0001 worth of mix to heat it up?

opcorn:opcorn:opcorn:

On the other side of the coin I have the oilers on my saws that are adjustable at max. I ain't gonna cry over a few cents worth of oil to protect my bars and chains.

 

[CJ1]

I run all my saws till I am out of wood or fuel, wichever comes first! Now that being said the moment the saw starts to go lean I let it idle down then shut it off. Refuel, touchup with a file and a quick choke gets me up and running again. The new primer bulb saws are nice in this reguard, a couple of hits of the primer and it is like you did not run out at all. Done this for 20+ years with no issues. I agree with everybody on trying to run a saw wide open when running out of fuel you will damage something, maybe not all at once but if you keep doing it you will pay in the long run. CJ

 

[rob066]

The bottom line for me is I try not to run my saw out of fuel. I usually keep track of how much fuel is in the tank. I dont have to worry if it is causing damage by going lean when running out of fuel. It is my preference not to run out of fuel. Damage by going lean by running out of fuel to me would be an accumuletive thing. Especially doing it over and over at wot

 

[albert]

Got an old two stroke mower than dad bought new in 1978,been run dry every time he finnish mowing before putting it away,now thats every weekend since 1978,still going strong

Yeah but that mower is only running at the speed most saws idle at. Running a 2 stroke out of fuel at full power and rpm not a good idea. I have seen the result of repeatedly do so first hand not only on saws but outboard engines. One guy blew two mecury 150hp powerheads in one season running dry at wot.

 

[Log Hogger]

LOL, that is classic. I have an uncle that smokes 2 packs a day. He is 88 years old and his lung feels great...

Most guys try to quit once they're down to one lung, but hey, to each his own!

 

[one.man.band]

wow...is the coast clear?

story about how i test drove and ruined a brand new motorcycle engine.
bike was worth about $12, or $14,000 in 1995 money. exactly how much the motor itself was worth i don't really know. this bike was not a customer's bike, it was at a motorcycle convention in new hampshire, in the month of june, where the temp was hovering about 90F.

rode an Excelsior-Henderson from the staging area, out where folks lined up to ride the new models. the test ride circuit was about 10 miles long on local highways. my wife was along for the ride. rode the bike up through the gears hard, and stayed on it, it kept pulling, so i stayed on it some more. did not realize how fast we were traveling, until my wife reminded me by punching me in the kidneys (and whispering those sweet nothings that we all want to hear at 105mph). i, of course, was having fun. ignored her for a while longer and held it on.

well, traffic was up ahead. rolled it off, slowed down to an idle. a few hundred bikes were slowly stopped in traffic moving at less than a snails pace. the motor instantly became blazing hot. the WOT, directly to idle, with no air flow over the air cooled cylinders was the reason. even with a pressurized oil flow, it was not enough. the oil light came on. the motor began lugging. i could not get over to the shoulder of the road because there were folks on my right, hundreds of folks ahead and behind me. could not shut it off, because we were on an uphill slope. bike was too heavy to push with my legs. kept it running hoping it would start to cool. made it up the rest of the hill, put it in neutral and shut it off. we glided back to the staging area. technician asked how the bike ran, told him this story. he shook his head and rolled the bike into a semi.

 

[Agoraphobia]

Stihl says to run fuel out for long term storage to avoid damage.

On my 345 Husq. it's hard not to run it out as it doesn't hold much and I have plenty for it to do. I pretty well always run it out. Of course it burbles at you when it gets about a second from running out and you can just shut it down at that point or blip the throttle and make maybe 3000 rpms, maybe for like a second before it dies altogether.

The fuel is mixed with oil in a ratio that provides proper lubrication over a wide rpm range. When the saw runs low on (both at the same time in the same proportion due to throttle position of lack of fuel) it doesn't make enough rpms to do crap.It takes friction and/or heat to kill it. When the fuel and oil mix is low you can't get enough power to make enough friction or heat to screw up your saw. Stihl counts on it and so does that guys old '78 lawnmower. :msp_thumbup:

My vote is for no damage absent other extenuating factors running it out... and maybe more damage leaving old gas in when your saw sits without being run out that is maybe more likely to cause a lean condition come spring when you fail to notice the lacquer that has built up or replace the old gas that just sat there absorbing water month after month after month.

Have to add the caveat relating to the thread title that at wide open throttle of course a lean condition will exist briefly when it runs out that will unequivocally damage a saw every time.

 

[Fish]

have to add the caveat relating to the thread title that at wide open throttle of course a lean condition will exist briefly when it runs out that will unequivocally damage a saw every time.

ok???

 

[crzybowhntr]

Too funny

Nice equipment list.

Thats what i like to hear - From the women though!!

Just havin' fun.:msp_thumbup:

 

[paduroiul]

OK, so I have to pay attention when the the fuel runs out; that's clear
but what about storage?
do you dry it out? or it's enough to just empty the tank?
I've heard pros and cons for both
1. if you let fuel in the carb the diaphragms will be affected
2. if you dry it out there's the risk of creating lean conditions and damaging the engine and also it's not OK to start the engine dry
Also heard about removing the spark plug and putting a ml of mix oil on the piston head for a lubricated start

So, which one is it? and what would you consider the minimum storage period?( how many days or weeks of not running it impose a storage procedure?)

 

[ZeroJunk]

pay attention to your saw, it will let you know when it's time .

Yep. They usually let you know when they are about to run out. I don't think it is a huge deal anyway because the vast majority run them until they quit most of the time I suspect.

 

[RandyMac]

I watched a guy seize a hard starting 032 by priming the carb about 10 times. It would run, rev out and quit, on the tenth time, it locked up tight. When I run a saw "dry" I hit the switch just as it starts to do the lean out rev up.

 

[Cantdog]

These discussions are always a hoot so I'll throw in my $0.02 worth. (Read that ...OPINION) First I 'll say when you're fully in the cut and your saw starts to run out of fuel it does not overrev.... it goes "Woooohhh"....that is the sound of a saw falling flat on its face. Second some of the oil in your mix sticks to the parts like it's supposed to some is lost to the exhaust along with the last of the spent gas. It isn't like the second the saw won't run for lack of gas there NO oil left in the saw. Now if you were holding the saw wide open at say 14,500 and it begins to run out of fuel and you just hold it wide open until it stops..then that's a chance for real damage, but that's not real world cutting conditions...for me anyway. If it were catastrophic to run a saw out of fuel the saw mfg would have some kind if automatic low fuel shut down device. Or OEM P&C kits would one hell of a lot cheaper than they are!! All that said, I always know about when my saw will run out of fuel and at the first indication of it doing so I simply stop. I dont hold it wide open trying get the last cut while running out of fuel. Lean is a very serious condition to a 2 stroke and will result in a damaged saw. But running lean is a continous process and running out of fuel is most definately not a prolonged thing at all. In my OPINION TK micro analyzed the condition and is 100% correct in his assessment.....the damage from running out of fuel is extreamely minute per occurrence..however the compilation of long time usage in this manner will have some affect on the life of your saw. (But if that is the way you treat your saw it will probably die from something else first anyway) That is why I try not to run saws completely out of fuel but it does happen....ildling to run them out of fuel is all together different...try it, then pull the cyl and see if you don't find a small puddle of oil in the very bottom of the crankcase....methinks you will...LOL!!!

 

[John D]

I've been running mine out of fuel for 25 yrs....haven't lost a P&C yet...in fact dads 30 yr old 041 still has great compression and has been used since new never town down..neither has out old 55 rancher 11 yrs old or more...Better to run it out of fuel than let it sit with fuel in it...

Sent from my DROID RAZR using Tapatalk

 

[Fish]

I've been running mine out of fuel for 25 yrs....haven't lost a P&C yet...in fact dads 30 yr old 041 still has great compression and has been used since new never town down..neither has out old 55 rancher 11 yrs old or more...Better to run it out of fuel than let it sit with fuel in it...

Sent from my DROID RAZR using Tapatalk

So when it starts to run squirrelly as it is running out of gas, do you run over and start sinking it into a 20 inch log, or just stand there and
rev the guts out of it??????

I am guessing "no" on either question.

If so, or not, WHY????

 

[Cantdog]

I can't answer for John D...but for me....I'm just lazy and don't want to have to prime the whole system again....just gas and oil one pull and back to work...but that's just me...

 

[Fish]

I can't answer for John D...but for me....I'm just lazy and don't want to have to prime the whole system again....just gas and oil one pull and back to work...but that's just me...

Me too, if it starts running out of fuel, and you are still working, just shut it off and refill. But shut it down for a few months, and want to
run it dry, I would hope they would show a little sense....

If it starts to run out of fuel, and starts to run squirrelly, and you have more work to do, do you rev the guts out of it until it dies, then refuel?

 

[Walt41]

The death of common sense is great for the repair business.

 

[Cantdog]

Me too, if it starts running out of fuel, and you are still working, just shut it off and refill. But shut it down for a few months, and want to
run it dry, I would hope they would show a little sense....

If it starts to run out of fuel, and starts to run squirrelly, and you have more work to do, do you rev the guts out of it until it dies, then refuel?

Yep I concur......