Large Inserts

[XJWoody]

Hello all, we're looking to get back into burning wood for a primary heat source. We have a newer (2004) electric heat-pump, which does OK, but the power bills are breathtaking. I have the saws, plenty of hardwood trees, and motivation, all I need is a kick in the right direction.

Basic details, 30 year old wood-frame two-story apprx 2000 sq. ft. The layout is the fireplace is in the center of the house, and faces into a room with a cathedral ceiling. Before getting the insert, we are replacing all (18) old wood/single pane windows and doors with good EnergyStar rated stuff, and I am going to go on a search & destroy mission for any other air leaks. (windows & doors are on order, and should be installed within a week or two) They claim -guarantee actually- a 30% reduction on energy costs... maybe BS, but it should help a lot.

The firebox is large: 39"w x 29"h x 24"-17" deep (apprx 15" up the rear wall, it slopes inward) so I think we can fit a good-sized insert. The hearth is apprx 12" off the floor, and extends 18" out from the firebox

The insert we used to have was not sealed... it just exhausted straight up through a (6"x 36" apprx) flue/damper. This worked OK but was not at all efficient. I was looking at it recently and saw there is some damage (metal liner buckled) so any new install must have pipe all the way up & out the chimney. Unfortunately, it isn't a straight shot, the pipe will have to do a little zig just past the damper, then it has a straight run up the chimney.

I am specifically looking at this Drolet insert from Northern Tool:
http://www.northerntool.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/product_6970_200325829_200325829

If anyone has any feedback, good or bad on this model (or Drolet in general) please advise. This selection is based on price ($1000 aprx) and high BTU output. It is not an "EPA" stove, but for now, NC isn't cracking down like other states. Yet.

Another model I've considered is Vermont Castings Winterwarm large. It is an EPA (catalytic) stove, and I am sure it has a very high initial cost. (We had a VC freestanding stove growing up...looked and worked great, but was expensive initially)

Are the catalytic inserts worth the extra bucks? Our wood is free to reasonably cheap, but I'd rather not have to feed a huge woodhog.

Also approx how much is liner pipe? (one piece stainless 'flex pipe' 6" dia.) I don't know exactly how much we need, going to guess 25 feet, maybe a bit more, maybe a bit less.

Thanks for reading & for any advice you are willing to share.

 

[coog]

I bought a liner on e bay and it worked well.I don't think you'll have too much trouble getting i past your 'zig'.In any case, the consensus here seems to be insulated liner is better, though with your chimney in the center of your house it may not be critical.FWIW, I think stoves are a better value than inserts.They offer more loader options, easier ash removal and larger capacity.I have a Jotul 600 sitting in front of my fireplace.I looked at their inserts, but decided to go with the stove based on btu output.It seems to me that this is a good time to buy a stove, both new and used.Good luck.

 

[Basso]

Hello,
Why not get a Regency Hearthstove instead of an insert. The hearthstove does just what it's name says, it sits on your hearth and not in the opening. That way the whole stove is out in the room radiating heat. I have one and it sits on our hearth which is 20 1/2 deep....I measured and 18" would work also.
You can buy a metal plate that closes off the opening and then you have to fabricate your pipe through the plate and up into a plate that seals off the damper area so no smoke gets into the firebox area...instead goes right up the pipe into the chimney. Check them out on-line !!!


Basso

 

[Adirondack]

Sounds like your where I was about 6 months ago. I did a lot of research and I think it payed off for me. I was looking for a fireplace insert to heat my entire house. I wanted a good blower system to get the heat out. I settled on a Napoleon 1402 from Flamedepot.com. They had the best price and great service. The stove heats my entire house even when it is 30 below 0.

There was a problem with the manufacture delaying shipment many times and they handled it very professionally. Anyway the stove is great and the two big blowers on each side really puts out the heat. Most of the stoves I looked at had one small fan in the center. I have had some experience with those and did not think it would have the output. I know there are a lot of stoves out there but for the money you can not beat it.

The chimney liner is what you have to do a lot of research on before you buy. I found out there are about three companies that make stainless steel 6inch liners. Two of those companies do not warranty the liner if YOU install it yourself. I went to http://www.chimneylinerdepot.com/ and got great service. Make sure you know how thick the liner is because the cheaper ones are much thinner. The entire kit will cost between 300-500 depending on how long your chimney is.
They have videos on youtube which help you understand the install. I got the 2 foot extention above the top of the chimney. It gives better draw and makes any hot particles fall farther before they hit your roof. This means more cooling time.

I also was having trouble feeding the pipe past the flue. I finally figured I could push up on the damper and removed it which made the install much easier. The cap that came with my kit actually had some of the welds break free when I was removing the Cap to clean. They sent another cap with no question. Great service. Good luck with your purchase. Researching options will only pay off.

 

[lobsta1]

Due to all the financial problems, including bankruptcy, I would stay away from Vermont castings. From what I understand, replacement parts have also tripled in price. Hearsay also says that there have been problems with the Winterwarm series. Don't know how true that is.
Al

 

[A. Stanton]

Wood, I have a Pacific Energy insert and like it. The medium size heats 2,000 ft; the big one, the Summit heats 3,000 ft. and offers an extended burn time. I would advise you to look at the weight of any prospective stove and use that as a measure of quality. The weights of the Pacific Energy for those sizes are over 400lbs. Get a good quality stove, don't do it on the cheap; your life depends on it.

 

[XJWoody]

Good advice all... thank you!

Thanks and keep it coming.

Good G2 on Vermont Castings... I didn't realize they were in trouble.

I had looked at Pacific Energy, but their closest dealer is way over in TN. Regency has a vendor aprx. one hour up the road, and it's likely that work will have me up that way this week. (I'd prefer to deal with a "local" business if at all possible, but open to online sales)

Great links for the chimney liner source... If nothing else, it has good info on the install process, and shows various adapters, accessories etc, and gets me in the ballpark price-wise. I am a visual person & that link was great.

I totally agree on doing it safe. We got rid of the old insert and mothballed the Longwood 4' log/oil burning stove since the clay liners were damaged... when we get back into it, it'll have to be 100%. NO cutting corners.

We're in no rush (what's a few more $350 elec. bills eh? ) and have to get through the window and door rehab bit first.

Thanks!
Don

 

[XJWoody]

One year later follow up...

After several years of messing with saws & cleaning up our little patch of woods, I finally put in a wood insert... a Buck Stove model #81.

We installed it yesterday afternoon, and got it hot for the first time last night - just in time for the impending snow/ice storm that is bearing down on the mid-south. I'm still getting used to regulating the air, but I must be on the right track, since it had good coals left @ wake-up time.

So now the CAD guy who has bought six new "pro" saws in the past 3 years can put them to some good use - beyond just burning up 100LL, slinging chips, & disturbing the peace.

I'm afraid it's soon gonna be time for a splitter of some sort, since my meager little woodpile will probably go bye-bye by the end of the cool season.