leaners and how to deal with them ?

[safeT1st]

I am going to attempt to post photos of leaners on my vacation property and wonder if you might comment on how to approach them for removal. They are at about 45 degrees and well hung up in a precious maple. In all honesty I'm not sure if you could approach these from the ground or would start from above.They have been down for about 8 months and there are many trees adjacent to work from or with.

 

[clearance]

I would just fencepost them down myself. You may be better off cutting them off near the stump and then dragging them back with a machine, ie. pickup, Tirfor, etc.

 

[smokechase II]

problems

There can be problems with these trees.
Your photos are good.
They look straight forward.

But, as you fence post them down in sections, you get closer to placing yourself directly under the primary danger.

If you do not have excess to equipment and one or two of these are still hanging as they are 60%+ cut up. Go buy a come-a-long that would be good to have in your pick-up anyway.

Or buy two six paks and get a logger buddy to come-by.

You probably can handle these. But don't be afraid, if it just feels wrong, stop and get a pro.

 

[gasman]

Heres a good thread. The video is real good. Its not in english but easy to get he idea anyhow

http://arboristsite.com/showthread.php?t=46928&highlight=fencepost

 

[Fireaxman]

SafeT, your picts (and the vid recomended by gasman) are too big for me to download on my dial-up, but Ive been fooling with a lot of leaners since Katrina so I'll offer up 2 cents. Fenceposting works well, especially using salami cuts so that the leaner doesn't settle back on your saw. But at some point as the leaner approaches verticle you may need to get some pull on it, to pull the top out so that you are not standing in the line of fall when it comes loose from the tree it is leaning on. Winch (on my jeep) or Tirfor is my favorite, but truck or tractor, block for change of direction if necessary, whatever, dont be under the canopy when it comes loose. When to stop cutting and start pulling is sometimes a question answered only by hard won experience.

Also, leaners tend to scrape a lot of bark and break a lot of branches off of the tree you are trying to save as they settle after each "fencepost" cut. I'm partial to climbing first (while I still have a root ball on the leaner to steady it), cutting out the canopy of the leaner down to the point of the hangup, fenceposting until the stem is light enough to pull, and then pulling either from the butt or from the top according to conditions. Even if I plan to pull from the butt, I always install a bull rope on the leaner just below the hang up point before I come down and start fence posting, so I keep a "control from the top" option available during the fence posting.

It can be risky taking out the canopy (leaner can roll, branches can springpole, hangers can fall on you when you cut supporting branches, supporting tree can give way, on and on) so you have to be very careful, but the risks can be mitigated by:
(1) being sure the supporting tree is firm or tie in to neighboring trees for your climbing (2) tie the leaner to the supporting tree at the hangup point before you start trimming the crown of the leaner so it doesnt roll out on you while you are in it and (3) stay out of the line of fire as you releave the energy on spring pole branches.

Hope this helps. Many of the pros that watch this site may be able to offer more. If you are not a pro, and safety really is first, finding a pro to hire as coach or to do the work for you may be money well spent. These things can be very much more dangerous than is readily apparent.

 

[BC_Logger]

cut the tree at the stump and then pull the tops free with a come a along if there really stuck use a machine or truck

this way you are away from the danger zone, you can use the trees weight as an advantage as you are bringing it down as a whole

 

[joesawer]

1-You guys missed that he said "precious maple" That changes things.
2-Those trees are way past 45 degrees.
The best way to get those off the precious maple without damaging it further is to climb it and piece it out, not the cheapest or easiest, but the best way not to do more damage.

 

[rbtree]

If you climb to piece the fir out, it will fall through the maple and break it up. The fir nearest it needs to be used as a gin pole. A lifting device like a GRCS ($2500) needs to be employed in order to support the leaner and lift it. Then cut off the top that is not in the maple. Mext, cut it off the stump and yard it out till it is free of the maple, then lower it down. First cut off as much of the butt as needed to reduce weight. Lacking a GRCS, you'd need something strong like a truck winch, chain saw winch, or Tirfor attached to the lowering line with a prussic.

Then there's the second tree, is it a madrona? It needs to be supported, perhaps at the same time, and maybe rigged to a different fir. Adding to the rigging complexities and time would be a drift line off to the side, installed as high as possible in another fir. Lift, cut off stump, transfer load, lower down.

This is a job for a pro, if you want to save the maple.

If I wasn't so busy, I'd drive up and help ya, but it'd cost ya about $1600, if you're less than 5 hours from me. If you could supply up to two folks to help run rigging as I direct, we could prolly have them on the ground and the spar trees derigged in 3-4 hours. I'd prolly have to use spurs to climb the spars as there appear to be no branches on them down low.

 

[nytreeman]

I would just fencepost them down myself. You may be better off cutting them off near the stump and then dragging them back with a machine, ie. pickup

+1
what i'd do

 

[safeT1st]

Input appreciated

Thanks to all for your ideas. If these trees were not mine I would not be interested in dealing with them.This is a remote island and only one logger/climber lives there.I had him in to do some falling and limbing 4 yrs ago and had no qualms paying his fee,$120 hrly with me grunting on the ground. As you know this adds up in a hurry.I have since discovered he has no insurance or WCB.Big mistake on my part but luckily there were no mishaps- never again. There is no end in sight of work on this land and it sees high winds in the winter.As trees come down the others are more exposed.I am resolved to gain the skills to deal with these situations and do some preventative maint. 10 to 15 120' firs will require spiral pruning to lessen the wind load and lots of leaners to clean up. I really value the living trees as it is like a park in there but know some must go.When I took those pictures I was there alone and stayed on the ground and out of danger,alot of bucking and stacking.If I had a competent body with me I would have looked at posting them down as so many of you suggested and I had thought was the right approach. Because I can't just dial someone up and have them drive to the sight I really need to learn to deal with this stuff myself.By the way, the Stihl 066w I had spoke of in other forums ran excellently and cut like nothing I've ever seen.Worlds apart from the Craftsman I have been labouring with for 5 yrs. I will study all your posts and make a plan for my next trip there. Promise to document the job well and post the results.Someone said it best 'you can do these trees but if in doubt,back off '. I agree.