ropensaddle
Feel Lucky
I climbed semi pro in 82 and started full timey in 83 but never with a ditty bag, btw the photo reminds me of a goob I once knew:hmm3grin2orange:
Did my first for-hire take down in '87 (while still in the USMC) for an officer who knew I had some schooling, and had seen my gaffing up trees to set up antennas and run comm-wire.
Made a little money off and on till I got out, then did tree work for a few different companies as stop-gap employment after getting out. I lied to myself that I did not want to do this for the rest of my life, thought office jobs were it.
Fell into a groundie job with in 93-94 for a local branch of TG-CL and never looked back, I was running the crew by the summer, and the little division by winter.
Stayed there till the end of the decade, until I finally came to the conclusion that they were making up their own "science" to justify their business model. Then I went solo in 99. Learned a little here and there until I am at the point now where I realize I do not really know that much; and most people know even less.
I am at the point now where I realize I do not really know that much; and most people know even less.
I was for 20 years but the last 11 years I am Teaching it, Is this realy the same as someone that Climbs as a Job everyday??
I read it as how many of us are professional tree workers, whether it is logger, arbo or other it does not matter. Some of us teach school, some work in saw shops, I think most of us are pro's in that respect.
I do mean it to sound humble, because it is how I feel about the enormity of the task. It is also what motivates me to do more, even though I do not see a whole lot of profit in the endeavor. Most guys are happy to pick my brain and carry on, which is why I may tend to sound abrupt during some phone calls from members.
There are a few here who can attest to how much I will open up after even a small check arrives in the mail, though
We need an up to date Poll on this. Last one it was about 1 in 75 or more1 tree guy and 75 of something else.
I was for 20 years but the last 11 years I am Teaching it, Is this realy the same as someone that Climbs as a Job everyday??
They like to preach you need more education, you need more education, you need more education. Ok, fine, why do i now have to pay you to get this education that you and guys like you tell me i so desperately need?
If you still can do it.. if you know what you teach and are not just a somebody who learned from a book.. then I would say yes
First of all.. in teaching I would think you do get some hands on.. and secondly.. without teachers we would never bring this profession to a higher level.
But.. I know that I pay for our education, and it ain't cheap.. Frankly some of it is not more than common sense but covers the legal aspect of the fact that you had formal training..
Hee hee! you so funny! What got your undies in such a bunch?Jeez, can we get our lips off your cheeks for maybe just a minute??
I have invested a lot of time and money into putting my knowledge base togetherThis is my problem with "experienced" treemen these days. They like to preach you need more education, you need more education, you need more education. Ok, fine, why do i now have to pay you to get this education that you and guys like you tell me i so desperately need?
What exactly can you teach me that would be worth paying for? About all i've seen is if i need to order something from stp, you'd be the guy to call.
You guys and your "i'm not going to teach you anything till the check is in the mail" attitude is getting out of hand. My teachers never charged me for their time, they were happy to spend a little time teaching an enthusiastic youngster how to carry on in a job they loved.
I've never charged someone to get together or for advice ( it's so simple, i can't even send you an email with a question and expect an answer unless a check is on the way?)
How is this good for advancing knowledge. So you supposedly know something about trees that no other arborist knows, and now it's time to cash in?
I'm tired of going to lectures or workshops by arborists who aren't coming up with anything new and having to pay a couple hundred dollars. Why do these guys, why do you, think you have to walk away with a couple grand just to flap your lips? Is it the ego boost?
Now i have no problem paying someone for their time, or paying gas money, or whatever. But don't you think it's getting ridiculous when you won't even answer an email unless money is forthcoming? Pathetic, you and your ilk are an insult to those who actually love the work and are willing to share their knowledge without expecting a huge monetary gain.
So you just took from them and never gave anything back, or were you working for them and learning OJT? I assume so, since you are a young climber. I might not have anything to offer you, since you work for someone else. Maybe I could in a few years when you break off and start your own biz. When I am working with enthusiastic young climbers, it is usually the boss who calls me in to work with them to improve their productivity.
Ask it in the forum if you want free advice, if I any of us want to answer then we will. Why are you such a cheapskate as to ask someone to coach/mentor you for the love of it?
Why is it such a bad thing for a person who has spent decades improving a wide set of skills, experiance and knowledge, to ask for a fee to pass it on to another for-hire professional? I did not come to the conclusion that I have knowledge of value because I thought it up, but because people have told me that they have improved their operations from what I have said and written.
Now, since I put forth a reasoned and and reasonable argument for my position, why don't you tell us why you should not be taken for a pathetic, snot-nosed punk who has gotten a wee bit big for his britches since he has worked under a crane a few times?
So you will take a late-night call from a home-owner who is asking for the best way to trim their trees away from the house? Is there any difference between your scenario mine? I do not understand why I should be an altruistic mentor to everyone who asks if part of my business model is consulting to other companies.
As for giving to young climbers...I do that, not as often as I used to. I do not get approached as much, and I usually want to work in my trees or a pro bono job for a little old lady. Many of them shy off at working for free for some reason.
I do give you credit for not always telling us that you are Gods gift to the tree world, but I do not see where you come off being disrespectful to some one who is more knowledgeable and experienced then you.
It doesn't mean a whole lot.
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