Question about tree species.

[brent denny]

Hello, all. I live in upstate new york. I am looking to buy some trees from my local water and conservation dept. I have two questions. Would norway spruce or eastern white pine be faster growing? My soil conditions are probably average and the trees would be basically planted in an open field with full sunlight. Also, they have black walnut available. It is not native to my area but would it grow here? It would be planted in the same conditions. If not, I could get oaks or maple but I thought it would be neat to have something noone else does. As long as I am listing what they have, for the conifers they also have: Balsam fir, Douglas fir, colorado blue spruce, and white spruce. I know white pine, balsam, and white spruce are native here but none of the others are that I know of. Thanks for any help.

 

[treeman45246]

Why are you growing them? Aesthetics? Timber production? Just to have trees? Privacy? How much room do they have to grow? Is the site swampy, rocky or well-drained or some combination? Any wires overhead?

 

[brent denny]

I am growing the softwoods mainly as a wind break. The hardwoods are for aesthetics. I have nine acres so I can give them all the room they need. The site is well drained and somewhat rocky. It is basically an old hayfield with an apple orchard bordering it. There are some primary wires in the vicinity but none of the trees would be planted any closer than 60 or 70 ft away.

 

[treeman45246]

I'm certainly not the end-all source on great trees, but white pines tend to like those conditions and be fairly fast growing. I would mix things up a bit to give yourself some diversity and to protect yourself from some pest or disease wiping out an only species. Norway spruce also grow very fast, at least around here. Our heavy clay soils force them to put out a shallow root system so they tend to be subject to windthrow, especially in wetter areas in Ohio. White pines don't like the alkalinity of the soil in Cincinnati, but seem to do well elsewhere in the state.
I like oaks for the choice in hardwoods, but again, diversity would be great. If you want to try some 'different' species, you may try Ginkgo, Bald Cypress or Dawn Redwood. The latter two grow faster than most any desirable species and all three have survived the evolutionary test of time. I'd stay away from Ash, as a nice pest (EAB) is on its way to you from Ohio and Michigan. Elmore will surely have more to add to this thread...

 

[Elmore]

Diversify...Diversify

The treeman has a good handle on this. Diversify, unless you have a specific need or market for just one or a few species. I like the idea of Ginkgo and Bald Cypress interplanted as they are perhaps the most reliable and sturdy trees around. They hold up to storms quite well and once established are both very drought tolerant with few pest and disease problems. Dawn Redwood is good also but not as drought tolerant as the previous mentioned trees. I would place it in an area that is more moisture retentive. Maybe a low lying area that receives some run off during rains. I say don't rush into it. Take your time and perhaps place about 10 or more different species in your arboretum. A few hard maples would be nice. Plenty of Asian Maples that are tough and beautiful. Maybe some Japanese Larch (same moist conditions as for Dawn Redwood). Nyssa sylvatica is a good hard wood to place in either a rocky well drained or a moisture retentive area. Good fall color. Nutall and Overcup oaks are nice. I recommend staying away from Pin Oak. Sawtooth are said to be invasive, avoid it. Throw in some Kousa Dogwood and some Magnolias(both deciduous and evergreen). Trident Maples, Shantung Maples, Chinese Lacebark Elms, Zelcova, Pseudolarix amabilis, etc. etc.. Japanese Maples...hundreds of different cvs. Plant some relatively rare trees. If you don't fall in love with them you can sell them, when mature, for big bucks. I wouldn't plant too many White Pine but would incorporate different Spruce, Fir and other conifers. How about China Fir, Cunninghamia lanceolata. True Cedars and Sequoia sempevirens. Zone 7...right? If you just go out and plant a bunch of easily obtained White Pine or another species, I believe that one day you will end up wearing out a chainsaw or two and wasting a lot of your time.

 

[tnttreeman]

I'm not fond of the white pine to break the wind. They are a brittle species and can snap off easily. Three years ago I had a bad wind storm at my place. In less than 7 minutes, I lost 23 trees- all white pines. Most of them snapped off 1/2-2/3 way up the tree. Several of them were over 12" diameter where they broke and they were snapped like twigs. Even when doing removals, when you cut into the limbs there is no hinging. They snap immediately. Keep this in mind when purchasing.

 

[Elmore]

I'm not fond of the white pine to break the wind. They are a brittle species and can snap off easily. Three years ago I had a bad wind storm at my place. In less than 7 minutes, I lost 23 trees- all white pines. Most of them snapped off 1/2-2/3 way up the tree. Several of them were over 12" diameter where they broke and they were snapped like twigs. Even when doing removals, when you cut into the limbs there is no hinging. They snap immediately. Keep this in mind when purchasing.

Don't carry ice very well...too much leaf surface and as you point out, brittle.
Also affected by a host of pests and disease. In the right situation it is a beautiful tree but...http://www.ag.uiuc.edu/cespubs/hyg/html/200104i.html