root compaction and air spade

[darkstar]

we are always recieving calls from clients with root compaction issues ...ie recent construction where the back hoe just ran over the root ball over and over .... or the huge tandem dump ran over the root ball etc. .... the tree i posted in a church gravel parkibg lot has the same problems ... i would like to help some of these trees and iim wondering if an air spade is the correct tool to help .... was thinking if it can cut hard dirt it can cut roots .... any how my bottom line is [ working with root compaction issues where no roots ..... have been cut ..... i could air spade fertilize ... i would use a low nit. fert. w/ mycoorrhizal inoculants ... a biofert. and inject directly into the ground .... typically the trees i think have root compaction issues are dying slowly from the tips down ....i know when the roots are cut i should treat differently ..... what do you guys think about the air spade ? combined with bio fert. ?????????? dark

 

[Lumberjack]

I am considering an airspade, I see that Sherrill added them to the catalog, it will be a bit before I get one though, spent enough for now (or at least until I get a job that needs it)

 

[Kneejerk Bombas]

It's a good way to change the soil.
If you do a search you should find a thread or two with pictures of an effective air tool that is home made for about $30 that can be used with a rental compressor.
As for fertilizer, only as indicated by a soil test. Michorrizal products are not needed. If the soil is good they will come, if it is bad, they will not survive. Think of it like wood decay fungus, if you wanted to rot a board, you'd put it outside in a damp spot right? You wouldn't go buy wood decay fungus. Same with Michorrizal fungus, create ideal soil conditions by adding compost, fixing pH and nutrient levels, water during drought, create a nice mulch bed, and so on. The spores are floating all around, and they're native.

 

[Kneejerk Bombas]

Just to make my point, in some of the tests of michorrizal products, the two biggest problems are the commercial stuff is often inviable (dead) and native fungus keep showing up in higher numbers in the test pots than the commercial stuff. What does that tell you?

 

[treeseer]

Michorrizal products are not needed. If the soil is good they will come, if it is bad, they will not survive.

Mike I'm not here to beat PHC's drum, but I've SEEN pre-PHC Inc.research plots where trees were grown in mine spoil with use of spores only.

 

[murphy4trees]

I'd say that compost tea will prove to be the preferred treatment of the future, to be used of course with soil remediation and compost/mulch.

 

[Kneejerk Bombas]

Mike I'm not here to beat PHC's drum, but I've SEEN pre-PHC Inc.research plots where trees were grown in mine spoil with use of spores only.

How does that mean anything good about PHC's product? Mychorrial fungi don't make nutrients out of mine spoil, do they? That would be impressive.
I suspect the trees would have done equally well just on thier own.
Better yet, why didn't they add some free compost and see how those trees did? I'd guess those would have done even better.

 

[Stumper]

Mike, I think that there may be a bit more to the Myco subject. The only broadleaf trees native to my area are Fremont Cottonwoods, Gambels White Oak and Sand Plums.-and those only in drainages. When we started planting non-nativ etrees it didn't necessarily follow tat we brought the correct fungi along also. A few years ago there was an atempto reestablish some native prairie grasse out onthe plains where overgrazing had destroyed them and allowed other grasses to take over. The first several attempts failed until someone noted that the few spots that had succeeded had certain mycorrizae not present elsewhere. when they added the myco along with seeding ,Voila! Prairie reborn. After a hundred years of the "wrong" grasses the symbiotic myco had disappeared in most locales.

 

[murphy4trees]

Nice point Stumper,
Not much different than the internal human ecosystem... we need the beneficial micro-organisms to stay healthy...
this undestanding supports the use of compost tea too, don't ya think???

 

[Thor's Hammer]

I'd say that compost tea will prove to be the preferred treatment of the future, to be used of course with soil remediation and compost/mulch.

got a recipie for compost tea?

 

[treeseer]

How does that mean anything good about PHC's product? Mychorrial fungi don't make nutrients out of mine spoil, do they?

No, but the inoculated trees did make use out of what was there. The fungus used was Pisolithus tinctorius, which is the backbone of many of pHC's blends.

I suspect the trees would have done equally well just on thier own.

You know what Elvis said about Suspicious Minds? This was a controlled study; the controls, which were "left alone", died. thank You Stumper for watching my back here.

Back to darkstar's post, yes airtools cna cut the outside of roots; i've peeled the skin off of some. It's all in the use of =them.

 

[Ekka]

Interesting point, we've debated this college.

Even if you had 2 similar environments thousands of miles apart, similar rainfall, temperatures etc ... Lets look at Western Australia and South Australia in this example.

If you brought a species, indigenous to WA only, to SA with a heap of soil from WA also to grow it in would the species do OK? ... trials have showed no.

There's more to it than just bringing along soil, it's a whole eco system thingy going on, heck could even be like jetlag!

 

[Kneejerk Bombas]

Points taken from your obscure examples guys. My mind set is from an environment fairly rich in biodiversity. You rarely have to drive too far to see a forest of some type.

This was a controlled study; the controls, which were "left alone", died.

Who was in control? PHC perhaps?
I find it hard to understand how only Mycor could be the difference between life or death in mine spoils. My point being, it's hard to stay objective when your livelihood is at stake.

 

[treeseer]

Who was in control? PHC perhaps? , it's hard to stay objective when your livelihood is at stake.

Mike my original post said "Mike I'm not here to beat PHC's drum, but I've SEEN pre-PHC Inc.research plots where trees were grown in mine spoil with use of spores only."

This was done thru nc state u, years before the prof left there to start phc inc. sorry if that wasn't stated clearly enough

 

[lync]

Air spade

I've done quite a few the air also helps to blow some voids into the compacted soil you can see the turf jump 6-8 feet away from you. We use a 2ft x 2ft grid under the drip line. Fill it with a pelletized compost/vermiculite/mycor combo. Client has to add extra H20. Results some times in a few months.

Corey

 

[ORclimber]

..... what do you guys think about the air spade ? combined with bio fert. ?????????? dark

Fungus that isn't myccorhizal is good too . Since fungal excretions provide stickiness that clumps soil together forming good soil structure. Also, fungal hyphae growing through the soil opens up pore space for water, air, and critters. So...even fungus that isn't myccorhizal is beneficial to tree growth.

Thought that was worth spelling out, back to tree cutting :angel:.