Working with Customers

[Slvrmple72]

Hello, wanted to know if it was common for anyone else to work with customers on there trees. Homeowner wants a quote to get five large maples down with the fee based on knock down only. I can drop one easy but the others will all require lots of rigging with no bucket access. I like the idea,all the fun with none of the mess to clean up afterwards. I pointed out my concerns to him as far as safety goes. I prefer not to drop limbs on customers Talked to him about doing the work in stages to give him time to clear the area before dropping so many of the limbs to make it a dangerous trip hazard for him to navigate with his chainsaw. He wanted me to do the work alone but I pointed out the importance of a qualified groundworker and the liability I would not be willing to assume with him trying to do the job. I told him I would get back to him this coming week. I would say that about a 1/3 of my quote for a job is the cleanup. Let me know what you fellas think. Deal or no deal

 

[clearance]

I like to use customers to help me, makes them feel good to help, saves them money. I get them to pull off tops, fill up my saw or change saws when I'm in the tree. What you are talking about, no way.

 

[begleytree]

in these situations, we tell the customer that we can do as much or as little as they wish. if they are willing to pay for me to make a tremendous mess, so be it. in 4 out of the last 5 of these, I ended up charging extra and chipping the brush. more there than the HO expects in most cases.

under no circumstances will the HO be under me, nor will I be there without a groundy/ropeman on the job. ariel rescue and all, can't expect the HO to be trained to come up and get me, god forbid. all simple drop and leave lay stuff with no climbing, sure, I'll go solo for them.
-Ralph

 

[ScottTree]

I like to use customers to help me, makes them feel good to help, saves them money. I get them to pull off tops, fill up my saw or change saws when I'm in the tree. What you are talking about, no way.

I agree with clearance, i do not mind using a customer for very basic things. Also agree with begleytree, I would never have the HO under me doing the job of an experienced groundie. You simply can't teach them rope raps, proper limb running etc. So if that's what you mean by having him work with you, NO DEAL. I like your idea of doing it in stages. Don't think a HO can truly understand just how big the mess will be if you just drop everything at once and make one big pile. That's like un-spooling 200 yrds of fishing line tangling it all up handing it to him and saying " here untangle this." Now i have fell larger trees bucking it up for them, and letting them take care of the clean-up. Unless i know the homeowner personally i wouldn't put a tree on the ground without bucking it up to the point all the major resting weight is off. Just to make sure the tree doesn't role on him if he cut it up. Dropping limbs all at once on top of one another just makes a big tangled mess, as you know. If that's what he wants i'd strongly try and talk him out of that. IMO if they are large trees you are saving him heartache. I like the STAGES idea. I don't see anything wrong with trying to structure a deal that way. And of course BegleyTree is right in many cases if you make a mess they end up calling you back to clear it anyway.

Your not going to yell at me again are you Clearnace !!! ??? LOL

 

[ScottTree]

begley i miss my O26, it was stolen. :chainsawguy: One of my favorite saws !!

 

[Bermie]

I regularly leave debris for the HO do dispose of themselves or arrange to get taken away. It is part of my estimating to ask what they want done with the debris.
Some of them want to compost and will have a shredder to do it with, want the logs cut for firewood, no problem.
Most people I do work for have a gardening service that will happily take the debris away for a fee, they get a cut of the action and I don't have to deal with it.
If removal of debris is part of the job, I have four or five guys I can call who run a general trucking service, 5-6 yd dumpers, some with 45' 4 ton cranes on them. Cost is extra.

If a homeowner wants to work on the stuff themselves, they do it after I'm gone. I'll leave it stacked, brush in one pile, logs in another and they can knock themselves out later!
I will not work without a groundie who knows whats going on, homeowners are a liability when the stuff is flying, they don't have the situational awareness of those who know what the potential dangers are.

By all means work with them, but be sensible, as I am sure you are!

 

[Slvrmple72]

Thanks Fellas! Very helpful responses I will let you know how it goes. On a side note I quoted a job for my wifes sister and she balked at the price but accepted it with some hesitation. Then when we all went out to dinner tonight she tells me she has someone who will do it for the firewood. I kept my cool. The tree is a rotting dying infested POS that has kept the woodpeckers happy and it would explode when dropped. LOVE RAKING (CASH ) I told her that the liability would be on her to have someone uninsured operating a chainsaw on her property. I told her that trying to save a few hundred dollars could wind up costing her a few thousand with one little "OOPS". I got her thinking. I dont cut trees for firewood but for beer...hmmm

 

[beowulf343]

If a homeowner wants to work on the stuff themselves, they do it after I'm gone. I'll leave it stacked, brush in one pile, logs in another and they can knock themselves out later!
I will not work without a groundie who knows whats going on, homeowners are a liability when the stuff is flying, they don't have the situational awareness of those who know what the potential dangers are.

Same here-i will not let a homeowner touch any part of the tree till i am off their property. They can watch, but that's it. Some of you guys must work for some pretty smart homeowners-i wouldn't trust most of them to know which tank is for the gas and which is for the oil. Bermie said it very well-i know that my groundies know what's going on, the homeowners usually don't have a clue.

 

[treebogan]

The best thing you can do sir,is stay inside.

I agree with all!I'm even a bit hesitent when the home owner says "well I had a go myself but realised it was a professionals job".This arose after I was spiking up a cottonwood that a homeowner had cut all the limbs off,up to about thirty feet or so.I was flipping up the tree and came across a chainsaw bar sticking out of the trunk that had been cut through about halfway before it sat back!No front cut and no mention of it when we arrived on the job.Man,I was absolutly fuming.He put us all in danger as if that top had blown over when we were in the garden we would have had nowhere to run.
What a ****.

 

[Magnum783]

I will never work without a goudie but I do let the groundie dertermine if it is safe for the homeowner to be around. I don't have time to worry about a stupid homeowner so if the groundie says no go then that is what the home owner gets. Same applies for their dogs and cats. It is my guys and my safety at sake here no holds barred.
Jared

 

[ScottTree]

I agree with all!I'm even a bit hesitent when the home owner says "well I had a go myself but realised it was a professionals job".This arose after I was spiking up a cottonwood that a homeowner had cut all the limbs off,up to about thirty feet or so.I was flipping up the tree and came across a chainsaw bar sticking out of the trunk that had been cut through about halfway before it sat back!No front cut and no mention of it when we arrived on the job.Man,I was absolutly fuming.He put us all in danger as if that top had blown over when we were in the garden we would have had nowhere to run.
What a ****.

Now that's just wrong . Did you get to keep the bar

 

[treeseer]

I always am glad to involve the HO in tree care, but on removals it's risky. Why not sell the HO on pruning those 5 maples into assets instead? More money saved that way, more canopy in your community, more work later on.:love1:

If they really want em down and you really need the cash and they really want to help, just do it by the hour. If your profit depends on their efficiency that's only fair.

 

[treesquirrel]

I have no problem with a HO doing cleanup but only after I have bombed everything down. THEY DO NOT GET NEAR MY CHIPPER WHEN IT IS RUNNING OR MY WORK ZONE.

For all the HO who want to watch, I tell them where they can stand safely away from danger.

Most of the time the HO appreciates that I alert them to the damgers and thier confidence is reinforced that our work is being done professionaly and safely.

 

[Slvrmple72]

I got the bid! Thank you all for your input I can say with a great deal of certainty that your comments are what helped seal the deal. Treeseer, I managed to get him to keep three of the trees and prune them only. Two of them will be taken down because he is fearful of them falling onto the house. I quoted him an hourly rate for myself and my groundie and he understood and accepted my concerns for his safety as well as ours. I also let him know that even though he will be cleaning up the mess we will put it in piles near the work area for his benefit and safety ( I think that was Bermie's suggestion) He has a big family and close knit group of friends so I see this as an opportunity to garner more business by referal

 

[treeseer]

I managed to get him to keep three of the trees and prune them only. Two of them will be taken down because he is fearful of them falling onto the house. I quoted him an hourly rate for myself and my groundie and he understood and accepted

Hey we're batting .600, not bad! Good move on the hourly rate--that's a fair deal all around!

 

[green leaf]

Many years ago my father in law was doing a job and the home owner wanted to help, the first pile of brush he started to drag he tripped and broke his arm. No more home owner help from then on. They can watch and sign the check