Decision, decisions... 346XP vs. 5105/5100s

[tallguys]

So what you're really looking for is a Jonsered 2153; A Husqvarna 346XP dressed up in Dolmars American colors. All set then?

The problem here in Ontario is that Jonsered has even less presence than Husqvarna. I understand that they can be special ordered... and that usually means more money. The only Jonsereds I have actually seen were on display at the new Lowes in my area.

 

[THALL10326]

Especially looking for opinions from those who have used both. Now in what way is the 346 so much better? I have found here on AS that it revs up quicker and is 1/2 pound lighter, narrower too. It has an outboard clutch, even though this should be a negative from what I have read. Is that it then?

I've compared Dolmar and Stihl and for the most part they feel very similar to me. Now that the MS261 has bulked up somewhat it feels very much like my PS-510.

Anyway, I am trying to get at the "why" of what you guys who run the 346XP like about them.

Out in the woods the 261 will outcut them both and do it easily. Fill up all three up and go cut. They all cut about the same but empty saws don't cut at all. Alot more cuts per tank for the 261 thanks to the strato fuel sipping design. The outboard clutch is a negitive. Pita putting on chains and a real pita if you get pinched in a log and want to remove the powerhead from the bar. Pita means a pain in the azz btw. Inboard clutches have so many advantages over a outboard its not even a good argument. Yup I said it and those in the know know its on da money baby, (Sawtroll I shall await your reply, yup I feel like going a round with ya,hehehe)

 

[indiansprings]

Now Tommy play nice, you got Troll at a disadvantage, you see the brand you sell was up 16+%, up 22% compared to the industry average. Husky seemed to say something about being down about 12.5% according to the release I read in the last couple of weeks. The consumer voted at the register. In their release they did state the N/A market was shrinking, promotional cost were up, had serious distro issues early in the season, as well as mfg issues. Still playing musical chairs with upper management, but they did say they are committed to having product for their dealers next year, they rented 200k sq ft warehouse in NC, mainly for exporting product. When your in such a dominant position you should be kind and gentle to those that didn't gain market share. I know , I know you'll keep burning down their house until you get all the business, just don't be so stingy.lol Your brand wouldn't be what it is without good competition, it just keeps the R&D guys busy, when is the Stihl fuel injection technology hitting the shelves, about two years ahead of the competition, you say.lol All in fun, glad to see you sending people down the path of righteousness again.

 

[J.W Younger]

Out in the woods the 261 will outcut them both and do it easily. Fill up all three up and go cut. They all cut about the same but empty saws don't cut at all. Alot more cuts per tank for the 261 thanks to the strato fuel sipping design. The outboard clutch is a negitive. Pita putting on chains and a real pita if you get pinched in a log and want to remove the powerhead from the bar. Pita means a pain in the azz btw. Inboard clutches have so many advantages over a outboard its not even a good argument. Yup I said it and those in the know know its on da money baby, (Sawtroll I shall await your reply, yup I feel like going a round with ya,hehehe)

Oh my, this ain't gonna sit well.

 

[Man of $tihl]

Bumpopcorn:

 

[THALL10326]

Now Tommy play nice, you got Troll at a disadvantage, you see the brand you sell was up 16+%, up 22% compared to the industry average. Husky seemed to say something about being down about 12.5% according to the release I read in the last couple of weeks. The consumer voted at the register. In their release they did state the N/A market was shrinking, promotional cost were up, had serious distro issues early in the season, as well as mfg issues. Still playing musical chairs with upper management, but they did say they are committed to having product for their dealers next year, they rented 200k sq ft warehouse in NC, mainly for exporting product. When your in such a dominant position you should be kind and gentle to those that didn't gain market share. I know , I know you'll keep burning down their house until you get all the business, just don't be so stingy.lol Your brand wouldn't be what it is without good competition, it just keeps the R&D guys busy, when is the Stihl fuel injection technology hitting the shelves, about two years ahead of the competition, you say.lol All in fun, glad to see you sending people down the path of righteousness again.

Awwwwwwww good post, funny too. Ok, your correct, I shouldn't kick my buddy Troll when I got him buried deep in the mud, nope, I'll be a gent and merely stand on his head,LOLOLOL Yup we got code orange on the run, we're not chasing them, they are huffing and puffing trying to catch us, last time we saw them in our mirrow they we're at least still in view, not so anymore. We haven't seen em in three years now, oh well, its lonely at the top,hehe

That fuel injection cutoff saw is in Richmond Va going through trails as we speak, its in the USA already, hot dayummm I'm looking forward to hearing how it does. Getting rid of carbs on autos was probably the best thing that ever happened in the auto industry, I hope it holds true for the power equipment industry too. I was at a meeting the other day and they were telling us there will soon be tools you merely plug in and it will tell you all you need to know about whats wrong with the unit. Yup Stihl is upping the anny bigtime now. Ole Troll better get to selling more than balance, weight, handling, gyro effect and all that other whatcha ma call it stuff, its the computer age now, time to get out the stone age and get with the program, ok, ok, ok, I'll let him up for alittle bit,:hmm3grin2orange::hmm3grin2orange::hmm3grin2orange:

 

[THALL10326]

Oh my, this ain't gonna sit well.

I know nothing,:biggrin::biggrin::biggrin::biggrin:

 

[J.W Younger]

Won't let me rep you TH,must be an eletrolux plot....r sumthin.

 

[tallguys]

Out in the woods the 261 will outcut them both and do it easily. Fill up all three up and go cut. They all cut about the same but empty saws don't cut at all. Alot more cuts per tank for the 261 thanks to the strato...

Good point about empty saws. It appears you're a Stihl dealer so I'll ask you. Whats the difference is with these strato engines vs. the regular ones?

 

[mweba]

http://www.arboristsite.com/chainsaw/169470.htm

 

[SawTroll]

Out in the woods the 261 will outcut them both and do it easily. Fill up all three up and go cut. They all cut about the same but empty saws don't cut at all. Alot more cuts per tank for the 261 thanks to the strato fuel sipping design. .......

Well my old friend, one tank through the 346xp fits well with my "need" for smoke and drink brakes - so it is irrelevant in my case....:msp_smile:

 

[SawTroll]

...... The outboard clutch is a negitive. Pita putting on chains and a real pita if you get pinched in a log and want to remove the powerhead from the bar. Pita means a pain in the azz btw. Inboard clutches have so many advantages over a outboard its not even a good argument. Yup I said it and those in the know know its on da money baby, (Sawtroll I shall await your reply, yup I feel like going a round with ya,hehehe)

The only real advantages is a couple of minutes regarding changing sprocket rims, or taking the powerhead off a stuck bar. Regarding chains, it is just about what you are used to - the stepped bar studs that Stihl use on the 3003 mount is a larger issue than inboard vs. outboard.

The cost of the inboard is in the handling when limbing etc, that is a much more frequent situation.

 

[SawTroll]

Oh my, this ain't gonna sit well.

Why not - afterall he is a Stihl dealer, so he has to present the good sides of the Stihl option.....:biggrin:


What he totally forgot to comment on, was the topic of this thread, and the handling differences.....

 

[J.W Younger]

Whata crock
Tom has all 3 saws and sells chains and 290s and stuff along with whatever
and if you pay attention and don't have yer head up yer ass he tells it like it purty much is

 

[Red Elm]

Since I own and use both saws on nearly a daily basis, this thread made me wonder about REAL working weight differences. So, I fueled and filled up the oil tank and weighed both my 346xp NE, and one of my 5105s. Both wear 18" bars, with the 346 having a lighter weight bar on it and lighter chain. They were weighed on a certified scale and the 346 weighed 4/10th of a pound MORE. Not a big difference, but I believe most data shows the 346 lighter than the 5105, when talking powerhead only.

We are caught up in a Ford/Chevy, Cardinals/Mets kinda scenerio that no side will ever win. While it may be entertaining, it is a no win situation.

I like them both, they are both great saws, I just happen to prefer the 5105 for my application; felling 6-12" cull trees doing timber stand improvement. I cut mostly at or just below the waist. I do very little limbing. I am not very tall, 5'8", but very broad across the shoulders. The 5105 "feels" better to me. That doesn't take a thing away from the 346.

I prefer the 5105, but the 346 is a great saw. I think I'll sell mine, but the 5105's are staying.

Good luck Tallguys, hope this hasn't just made your decision harder.

Stick to your guns Troll.

 

[SawTroll]

Whata crock
Tom has all 3 saws and sells chains and 290s and stuff along with whatever
and if you pay attention and don't have yer head up yer ass he tells it like it purty much is

A few years back in time, he did that about what really is the topic here as well, and then he was in total agreement with me.......

Back then the 261 didn't exist, but of course he has to support the brand that he lives by selling when they finally have what they think are a comparable saw - he just "forgot" what this thread really is about, and that the 261 really is too bulky and heavy to be comparable!:hmm3grin2orange::hmm3grin2orange:

 

[SawTroll]

.... Ole Troll better get to selling more than balance, weight, handling, gyro effect and all that other whatcha ma call it stuff, its the computer age now, time to get out the stone age and get with the program, ok, ok, ok, I'll let him up for alittle bit,:hmm3grin2orange::hmm3grin2orange::hmm3grin2orange:

What did you really say in you earlier post about "outcutting", except the well known fact that a "strato" saw will be more fuel efficient, so you can cut longer before it needs a refill?opcorn:opcorn:

 

[JustinM]

Since I own and use both saws on nearly a daily basis, this thread made me wonder about REAL working weight differences. So, I fueled and filled up the oil tank and weighed both my 346xp NE, and one of my 5105s. Both wear 18" bars, with the 346 having a lighter weight bar on it and lighter chain. They were weighed on a certified scale and the 346 weighed 4/10th of a pound MORE. Not a big difference, but I believe most data shows the 346 lighter than the 5105, when talking powerhead only.

Interesting stuff! thanks for chiming in. One question though: is the bar on the dolmar an actual original dolmar bar? If so, the "18" as they call it, is actually only 17" long, so an inch shorter than a typical 18" bar & could account for some of the weight discrepancies.

We are caught up in a Ford/Chevy, Cardinals/Mets kinda scenerio that no side will ever win. While it may be entertaining, it is a no win situation.

Couldnt agree more.

The 5105 "feels" better to me. That doesn't take a thing away from the 346.

I tend to agree. I have not found a 50cc saw that "feels" better than the 5100/5105 in my hands, although I have not yet spent time with the 261 and have relatively limited time with the 346. I certainly could "live" with an 026 (and am sort of on the market for a new 50cc) but to me the Dolmar has always "felt" better in that regard.

 

[tallguys]

Since I own and use both saws on nearly a daily basis, this thread made me wonder about REAL working weight differences. So, I fueled and filled up the oil tank and weighed both my 346xp NE, and one of my 5105s. Both wear 18" bars, with the 346 having a lighter weight bar on it and lighter chain. They were weighed on a certified scale and the 346 weighed 4/10th of a pound MORE....

I am not very tall, 5'8", but very broad across the shoulders. The 5105 "feels" better to me. That doesn't take a thing away from the 346.

Good luck Tallguys, hope this hasn't just made your decision harder.

Thanks for that observation, it helps more than you know. Interesting that the 5105 weighed out less than the 346XP as almost everyone would have you believe otherwise. I agree with your comment about "feel" as my 510 just feels right in my hands and its the reason why I'm considering the 5105. I'm a fairly tall guy and wear a size 50 jacket so that may be the reason for it.

Many claim that the 346XP is a better limber because of its lighter weight hence better handling, then again I read where others claim a MS361 and larger is used for limbing so I fail to understand how my PS510 or possible future PS5105 would somehow be less suitable. Especially when your observation shows the 346XP is actually heavier, if even by a smidgen. Its also interesting to note that the new Stihl MS261 is only 8oz less than my PS510, which many consider as too heavy. Whatever.

Your observations help to shed new light on an otherwise sometimes "Chevy/Ford" type of discussion. Thanks again! :msp_thumbup:

 

[Red Elm]

Interesting stuff! thanks for chiming in. One question though: is the bar on the dolmar an actual original dolmar bar? If so, the "18" as they call it, is actually only 17" long, so an inch shorter than a typical 18" bar & could account for some of the weight discrepancies.

you are exactly right. The bar on the 346 is a cheapy thin thing though. I'll do it again with just fueled/oiled powerheads.

I do most of my cutting with the saw laid on its side, or nearly so, felling. If I was limbing all the time I might like the 346 better, but I think it is just too narrow to feel good to me. It also seems to me the 346 is faster through 2" stuff, but the Dolmar has more power on anything over 4-5" thick. I know Troll, that has to do with chain type/size too. I've never rigged my 346 with 3/8" to do an apples to apples comparison.