Dealer says 441 M-Tronics are junk

[John R]

Like most dealers, even the good ones are still worse than used car salesman, he's full of ####. Likely a bigger price margin with the older saws. Pure ignorance for the most part, people like that always have someone to blame for their own incompetents, must be Obama's fault too.

That part I can agree with. :hmm3grin2orange:

 

[Rounder]

YeeHaa, you know how to open a can of worms Nate! Good entertainment though.
Ever find an ignition module for the 44? I've got one for you, that I can send with Cody. Let me know.

Windy there today?

 

[HILLBILLYREDNEC]

This electronic carbs sounds like the Tucker auto company way a head of its time. The added adjustment device means when the carb fails from bad gas or some sort of internal failure,your stuck paying the high price for a dealer only carb. How much is the rebuild cost compared to a common carb

 

[brncreeper]

This electronic carbs sounds like the Tucker auto company way a head of its time. The added adjustment device means when the carb fails from bad gas or some sort of internal failure,your stuck paying the high price for a dealer only carb. How much is the rebuild cost compared to a common carb

Because the small size of todays circuit boards, the only trouble shooting you can do is "test and toss". Take known good electronic part and replace it with the suspected faulty one. If the problem goes away you buy the whole circuit board to replace the bad one.
Someone should develope an adapter manifold to mate an 044/440 carby.

 

[HILLBILLYREDNEC]

Barncreeper hit a really interesting theory,carb switch adapter. The electronics are all throw away it seems like now days:bang: The days of a good saw being cheap to repair are slowly becoming obsolete.

 

[lone wolf]

Barncreeper hit a really interesting theory,carb switch adapter. The electronics are all throw away it seems like now days:bang: The days of a good saw being cheap to repair are slowly becoming obsolete.

But yet they all bow down and worship this saw like it is a Nordic supermodel:hmm3grin2orange:And how long have they been out?Some poor people will buy that saw now because all the hype and maybe later find it to be a problem.Every time some new saw comes up they all over hype it and people buy them how many saws do you need to cut cookies anyway? I learned the hard way stick with what works for you not what they say to buy!I find the Stihls to be the best saws but I dont like the fact that they are making it more expensive to repair!You can bet the EPA has forced them to do this.I think that is why there is now a MS201T.Where is the improvement in that saw?

 

[spacemule]

Because the small size of todays circuit boards, the only trouble shooting you can do is "test and toss". Take known good electronic part and replace it with the suspected faulty one. If the problem goes away you buy the whole circuit board to replace the bad one.
Someone should develope an adapter manifold to mate an 044/440 carby.

I saw a claim that 95% of on board computers replaced in cars is unnecessary. Anything goes wrong, and people blame the computer. Not saying computers don't have problems, but they are a convenient scapegoat.

Here's a list of technology that was poo poo'ed when it came out:

Steam power to gasoline power
records to 8 track tapes to cassette tapes to cds to mp3
drum brakes to disc brakes
manual transmissions to automatics
carburators to fuel injection
horse and buggy to railroad to truck to air planes
vcr to dvd to blu ray


Every single one of these changes was met with opposition and skepticism. In fact, even though disc brakes are much simpler and easier to work on than drum brakes, when they were new mechanics charged extra to work on them. It's all about perception. Though technology changes, human nature does not.

 

[HILLBILLYREDNEC]

We as the human race are becoming so dependent on technology that we have lost are basic survival instincts. What happened to are older generations self reliant attitude to fix or do a modification to something that is broken. We let electronics think for us,we lose brain cells:msp_ohmy:

 

[spacemule]

We as the human race are becoming so dependent on technology that we have lost are basic survival instincts. What happened to are older generations self reliant attitude to fix or do a modification to something that is broken. We let electronics think for us,we lose brain cells:msp_ohmy:

You were just arguing that new technology is more complex and difficult to repair. Now you're saying electronics repairs itself--which is it?

 

[porsche965]

Got a hot air balloon handy?

Private jet count?:msp_wink:

 

[spacemule]

I would argue that if modifications are your concern, you have no leg to stand on. There are more manufacturing techniques and equipment available today than at any point in history. Computer generated cad designs makes virtual testing of designs and modification a snap before anything is actually built. Don't like pre-made products for sale? Build your own. To say that people are not self reliant is a cop out--more tools are available to be self reliant today than at any point in history.

 

[Metals406]

YeeHaa, you know how to open a can of worms Nate! Good entertainment though.
Ever find an ignition module for the 44? I've got one for you, that I can send with Cody. Let me know.

Windy there today?

Heck yeah I could use the module! Thanks Sam!

And yeah, windy like a big dog today.

 

[Rounder]

Heck yeah I could use the module! Thanks Sam!

And yeah, windy like a big dog today.

Yep, early out for me today. Just got done digging around the shop, I have no more...not sure what happened.....had 2. The local shop should have one for you, I'll grab one on Saturday for ya if you want.

 

[gink595]

Nate, I agree they are junk

 

[madhatte]

The electronics are all throw away it seems like now days.

There's a very good reason for that: VLSI drives production costs WAY down, at the expense of making things so small that they can't be repaired if they break. What's that doo-dad you're using to post on this here interweb? I bet it has a microprocessor in it somewheres, unless you're so old-school that you can whistle Hayes code into a pay telephone at 100 baud and keep all of your PPP routing straight. I don't suppose you can do that, hmm? Don't diss what you don't understand.

 

[Jacob J.]

And as far as I know, the legal obligation for a manufacaterer to provide spares for their equipment is max. 7 years.

Stihl used to tell us at the dealer meetings that they were doing a voluntary 10-year replacement manufacturing window. Husky goes even longer, up to 15 years on some models.

 

[Metals406]

Yep, early out for me today. Just got done digging around the shop, I have no more...not sure what happened.....had 2. The local shop should have one for you, I'll grab one on Saturday for ya if you want.

Never mind mang, if one ain't handy. . . I'll dig around the valley here.

Cody'll be back in Zoo town on Saturday. . . He'll be here by Wednesday night, or Thursday morning.

I really appreciate the offer though.

 

[RiverRat2]

That maybe your opinion, but 'never fail' is utopia in the industrial world. And warranty on electronic equipment is never longer than 2 years, at least in our area. A cell phone has an average life time of one to two years max, considering the speed of development in that area. And as far as I know, the legal obligation for a manufacaterer to provide spares for their equipment is max. 7 years. That may be long enough for a pro user, but as a firewood guy, I am not looking forward to throwing my saw in the dumpster in seven years time (I am not a pro logger), because a spare coil or carb is going to cost me the price of a new saw at best. In 7 years from now, M-Tronic will be probably looked upon as a dinosaur control device.

For ex. Siemens makes fortunes right now by no longer supplying parts for the Siemens S5 PLC sytems. I know many companies having to upgrade their machines to the newer S7 series, just to avoid major production downtime in case of failure. And they do fail, trust me.
Customised electronics puts you as a consumer in a vulnerable position. That is something to consider when you buy a high tech device.

yes dealing with this very problem,, not only PLC's but Electrical system protective relays as well,,,,,,,,,

I wonder what a new M-tronic board will cost????

 

[lone wolf]

yes dealing with this very problem,, not only PLC's but Electrical system protective relays as well,,,,,,,,,

I wonder what a new M-tronic board will cost????

They wont say I asked already!

 

[RiverRat2]

They wont say I asked already!

I'm not a betting man but I'd almost garuntee it would cost more than a ham sandwich!!!!!