question for crane owners

[abidingdreams]

I have recently had the pleasure of working on my first crane job. I hired the gentlemen who owned the crane for $95 an hour and I dismantled a 60' Elm tree in four hours. I have always been a fan of crane work for as long as I have been in the tree care industry. I was talking to the operator that day during lunch and I found out that he bought his crane for 140K used and that made me really doubt me ever owning one. So my question is how did you who own a crane do it? What was the price of your crane? What were the payments? How much does it cost you per job to run it and even how much per month? Does it pay for itself? Out of a 40 hour work week how many hours are you running it? Me personally I would want a crane before I purchased a bucket truck. Simply for the fact that if I cant reach the tree with the crane I more than likely cant reach it with a bucket. I could be completely wrong in my thinking so that's why I come to the experts. Thank you for your time in answering my question.

 

[BC WetCoast]

A bucket is more flexible than a crane. A crane can only be used for removals, whereas a bucket can be used for pruning, street trees, or shearing large hedges.

 

[Adamgaspo]

Cranes can be used for a lot more than just removals, the company I used to work for would use cranes for pruning, removals, cleaning up roofs, loading logs and just about anything else you could dream of. You would be surprised how versatile a crane can be.
The best part about a crane is that you can sub it out when you do not have work your self. Ie construction work roofing work etc etc etc. and other tree company's.
we would also use the crane to set the stump grinder in hard to reach areas.
I would say the number one rule about owing a crane is that the machine needs to be on some type of job every day to be profitable.

Adam
Crane ninja

 

[treeslayer]

you want both, a bucket AND a crane.:hmm3grin2orange:

 

[abidingdreams]

Cranes can be used for a lot more than just removals, the company I used to work for would use cranes for pruning, removals, cleaning up roofs, loading logs and just about anything else you could dream of. You would be surprised how versatile a crane can be.
The best part about a crane is that you can sub it out when you do not have work your self. Ie construction work roofing work etc etc etc. and other tree company's.
we would also use the crane to set the stump grinder in hard to reach areas.
I would say the number one rule about owing a crane is that the machine needs to be on some type of job every day to be profitable.

Adam
Crane ninja

I fully agree that cranes can be very versatile also I think I would like to own a crane before a boom. Not saying I would never like to have that option. My question is how much does it cost to run it? I have no experience operating one so that's probably one of the first obstacle to overcome apart from actually purchasing one. Roughly how much is maintenance, insurance, and all else that goes into running one?

 

[dbl612]

I fully agree that cranes can be very versatile also I think I would like to own a crane before a boom. Not saying I would never like to have that option. My question is how much does it cost to run it? I have no experience operating one so that's probably one of the first obstacle to overcome apart from actually purchasing one. Roughly how much is maintenance, insurance, and all else that goes into running one?

now that you realize all that goes int cost of ownership. go to that guys house in pocatello, idaho area and buy him a gift certificate in the store or restaurant of his choice, and beg him to never go up on his rates of 95/hr. you got a deal with disposable responsibilities and liabilities.

 

[ducaticorse]

I fully agree that cranes can be very versatile also I think I would like to own a crane before a boom. Not saying I would never like to have that option. My question is how much does it cost to run it? I have no experience operating one so that's probably one of the first obstacle to overcome apart from actually purchasing one. Roughly how much is maintenance, insurance, and all else that goes into running one?

Depends on the crane, the jobs, the owner, the operator the year, whether you flip it over or not.. Your question is like asking how much does it cost to own a car....

 

[RVALUE]

Don't forget that the $ 95 / hour includes another man.

You'll have to put a hand on your crane.

 

[abidingdreams]

Depends on the crane, the jobs, the owner, the operator the year, whether you flip it over or not.. Your question is like asking how much does it cost to own a car....

I don't think that my question implies that at all. I don't want to know how much its going to cost me I was wondering if I could get a average of cost for the people who already own a crane. What it cost them you know what I mean. In my mind I can see using a crane 30 hours in a 40 hour week. that comes out to roughly $3k a week and 12k a month just for rental cost and I honestly think that with all cost factored in it would not cost that much to own one. I could be wrong but I would be floored if I was. So if any owners could please share insight on how much it cost them to run a crane as well as all the other questions listed above that would be stupendous. Thank you again

 

[RVALUE]

It takes a long time USUALLY to get a clientele to keep that busy, in my opinion. Looks good on paper, but......

That is not to say that it isn't a viable venture.

Just that renting and collecting 30 hours a week, 50 weeks a year is a tall order.

 

[mikewhite85]

Why buy a crane if you can rent one for $95 an hour?

I rent a 40 ton for 175 an hour portal to portal, 4 hour minimum.

 

[2treeornot2tree]

I dont own a crane but a buddy does. You need to keep it working making money. You have boom inspections and semi annaual vehicle inspections. All the replacement parts like cables, sensors and what not are very expensive. Plus you need to know what your doing so you dont flip it over. Thens theres insurance. Crane insurance for tree work is expensive.

 

[BTL]

knuckle boom for sure

Gentleman,

We made the decision to purchase a knuckle boom over a bucket truck. The knuckle boom we have is currently 68 feet of reach to the side and roughly 78 feet high when straight up making it just as tall or taller then most reasonably priced buckets. The thought process is that if you are able to get a bucket to the tree obviously you can get the knuckle boom as well. So in terms of removals its pathetic. Now in regards to versatility the bucket for pruning obviously is a bit faster however any good climber can simply be put into the tree or hang from the hook nd sneak the boom in the same way you would a conventional bucket. The bottom boom acts almost as an elevator if you follow me. Furthermore the ability to make picks, load logs, and haul chips is much more beneficial for the money than a bucket. We payed less for our knuckle boom then a bucket from a local dealer and it is a kenworth t800 with 124000 miles. In other words pickup of the year 2013.

BTL

 

[ATH]

Why buy a crane if you can rent one for $95 an hour?

Don't forget that the $ 95 / hour includes another man.

Yep. As long as your guy works with your schedule and does a good job, I'd do that forever.

Good operator with benefits/SS/Workers Comp/etc... should be worth about $50 an hour so you are paying $45 per hour equipment rental.

Say you need the crane 20 hours per week, 40 weeks out of the year. That is 800 hours per year. $45x800 = $36000 per year. Payments on $140,000 (6 years, 6.5%) are going to be about $2500 per month or $30,000 per year. Can you maintain, store, and insure it for $6K per year?

 

[imagineero]

I hire cranes off two different guys, both sole trader owner operators and both ex tree guys who needed something to carry on with after they retired. One has a 20T and the other has a 25T. They both charge $150/hour base to base, but look after me on hours because I hire pretty regular and don't cause them too much grief. Tree work is hard on cranes, and a lot less predictable than any other type of crane work. Most crane lifts are done with chains, at a fixed lifting point, the weight of the lift is often written on the object and the object is generally small and well balanced. The crane OP can get his rigger to connect the load. Compare that with tree work where the weight is very much an unknown to most crane OPs, the load could easily shift, they have to trust you to rig it, and the attachment point may not always be the best.

I couldn't see myself buying a crane while i can get good experienced operators with a crane for that price. You an factor in most of the costs of running the machine like maintenance, insurance, fuel, wear on rigging gear etc... but then there's "other" which is frightening. One of my buddies decided to hire a guy to operate his crane this year so he could concentrate on his firewood. The guy somehow managed to trash the gearbox, which is a rare part and no longer available. $25,000 and 6 weeks of down time (losing $$$$$) later, his machine is back on the road. That's the sort of thing you can never factor in.

Shaun

 

[gorman]

This is a great breakdown.

Yep. As long as your guy works with your schedule and does a good job, I'd do that forever.

Good operator with benefits/SS/Workers Comp/etc... should be worth about $50 an hour so you are paying $45 per hour equipment rental.

Say you need the crane 20 hours per week, 40 weeks out of the year. That is 800 hours per year. $45x800 = $36000 per year. Payments on $140,000 (6 years, 6.5%) are going to be about $2500 per month or $30,000 per year. Can you maintain, store, and insure it for $6K per year?

 

[ducaticorse]

I don't think that my question implies that at all. I don't want to know how much its going to cost me I was wondering if I could get a average of cost for the people who already own a crane. What it cost them you know what I mean. In my mind I can see using a crane 30 hours in a 40 hour week. that comes out to roughly $3k a week and 12k a month just for rental cost and I honestly think that with all cost factored in it would not cost that much to own one. I could be wrong but I would be floored if I was. So if any owners could please share insight on how much it cost them to run a crane as well as all the other questions listed above that would be stupendous. Thank you again

I beg to differ with you, but that's exactly what it implies. A brand new grove 60T is going to be much ore expensive to maintain, insure and operate than a ten year old 28T link belt. I don't know if you misunderstood what I originally wrote, but it seemed pretty clear to me.

 

[capetrees]

The cost to own it is different than cost to run it. I bought a truck and if I don't use it, I still have to have it inspected, registered, insured and then a monthly payment depending on how big it is. To run it wil depend on how you use it. Long distances will burn more fuel, you'll need to pay a man to run it with a license (perhaps union rate) and the time it takes to travel to and from a site compared to what you could be doing otherwise and then there's the maintenance. Ever see what some of the parts cost?:msp_scared:

$95/hr is pretty good. I thought about buying a bobcat a couple years ago. The guy I borrow it from talked me out of doing so. He made me realize I could borrow his whenever I wanted and for the number of times I needed one, a monthly payment of any kind didn't make sense.

Keep renting. Walk away from it at the end of the day.

 

[TheJollyLogger]

I don't think that my question implies that at all. I don't want to know how much its going to cost me I was wondering if I could get a average of cost for the people who already own a crane. What it cost them you know what I mean. In my mind I can see using a crane 30 hours in a 40 hour week. that comes out to roughly $3k a week and 12k a month just for rental cost and I honestly think that with all cost factored in it would not cost that much to own one. I could be wrong but I would be floored if I was. So if any owners could please share insight on how much it cost them to run a crane as well as all the other questions listed above that would be stupendous. Thank you again

30 hrs a week (billable) sounds pretty ambitious to me, especially just starting out with one.

 

[ducaticorse]

The cost to own it is different than cost to run it. I bought a truck and if I don't use it, I still have to have it inspected, registered, insured and then a monthly payment depending on how big it is. To run it wil depend on how you use it. Long distances will burn more fuel, you'll need to pay a man to run it with a license (perhaps union rate) and the time it takes to travel to and from a site compared to what you could be doing otherwise and then there's the maintenance. Ever see what some of the parts cost?:msp_scared:

$95/hr is pretty good. I thought about buying a bobcat a couple years ago. The guy I borrow it from talked me out of doing so. He made me realize I could borrow his whenever I wanted and for the number of times I needed one, a monthly payment of any kind didn't make sense.

Keep renting. Walk away from it at the end of the day.

It's nice you're able to borrow a bobcat from time to time. I bought one, and have found myself using it in ways I've never thought of. Not kidding it probably gets used 3 or 4times a week at this point solely because it's there. But yeah, at 95 an hour?? Keep renting. I'm buying a 28t this year but only because I'm getting it from a friend at a ridiculous price. It will pay for itself in a cpl months.