084 - gettin it cranked without breaking a hand

[flht01]

Big brown just delivered my newest mistake (from eBay) yesterday and now I need some advice, who-da-thought-it.

I've been using an 066 on an alaskan mill for the past year and thought I'd step up to an 084. The 084 came in yesterday and I spent an hour or two looking it over and have a few questions. It was listed as running good so maybe I'm doing something wrong here but doubt it. It has a lot of compression, can't pull it over unless the comp release is engaged.

I put it in the choke position and made about 3 pulls before it decided to hit. Instead of firing a couple of rounds before it died (like my other saws do), it was like it kicked back taking the handle away from me. I re-engaged the comp release and rolled the switch to the hot start position and tried to pull it over. It would roll over until it hit the compression/fire position and then it was like it would lock up and kick back. I was finally able to get it started and run it long enough to make sure the main oiler was working (don't understand how the aux oiler is suppose to work yet) but it didn't run long enough to get warmed up and wouldn't stay running at an idle. I didn't want to try it much more, afraid of breaking parts (on me and the saw).

I first thought the comp release was releasing too soon, but I can leave the switch in the off position and pull it over without any problem. I'm thinking it's timing related, firing to quick.

I've got an IPL but if anyone has an electronic version of a shop manual or can recommend where to buy one I could sure use the info. Any help or suggestions would be appreciated.

 

[timberwolf]

1 don't go at it lightly, if it can sense your fear it will bite you.

2 a D handle can help

3 maybe the compression release is plugged. I found pulling the decomp out and drilling (about double the size)out the small passage in the side of it solved my same issue on my 066.

Sounds like you have some carb issues, maybe just tuning, maybe something plugged up?

 

[cbfarmall]

Flywheel has two keyways. If it is lined up to the wrong one, you can bet it will kick hard on you. Maybe this could be the reason why it was sold.

P.S. On my 084, I check the comp. release everytime I crank to make sure it is still in. Even then, I put an elastostart handle on.

Chris B.

 

[flht01]

1 don't go at it lightly, if it can sense your fear it will bite you.

2 a D handle can help

3 maybe the compression release is plugged. I found pulling the decomp out and drilling (about double the size)out the small passage in the side of it solved my same issue on my 066.

Sounds like you have some carb issues, maybe just tuning, maybe something plugged up?

It didn't quit on the first bite, I've got a big blood knot on my left wrist and the middle two fingers on my right hand are 2 inches longer than they were before I started this adventure.

It could be a carb tuning issue, also could have low speed blockage. I'll have to get past the cranking issues before I'll know for sure.

I think the comp release is working ok, I can crank it over (with the kill switch on) without much problem. Let me know if I'm wrong to assume otherwise.

Flywheel has two keyways. If it is lined up to the wrong one, you can bet it will kick hard on you. Maybe this could be the reason why it was sold.

P.S. On my 084, I check the comp. release everytime I crank to make sure it is still in. Even then, I put an elastostart handle on.

Chris B.

I'll check the flywheel tonight and see if it has a 3 post coil.

I have what's left of an elastostart handle, from the looks of it this has been an ongoing problem. I'll certainly be getting a new one when this problem is sorted out.

As far as the comp release, I don't think I could crank it without having it engaged. Maybe finding/fixing what's causing the kickback will tame it down some but this is one saw you don't want many tuning problems with.

Thanks for the advice.

 

[blis]

sounds like ignition problem to me since it backfires, id go with the keyway solution cbfarmall suggested..

 

[aggiewoodbutchr]

I hit the comp release every time it "hits" before I pull it again. Learned that the hard way- ouch. This saw is truly a beast and must be handled accordingly. You got to show it who's the boss.

I haven't heard about 2 keys on the flywheel and I know my 084 only has one. I've had it off no less than a dozen times.

It could be a timing issue but most likely it's carb/ tuning related. I'll let the experts sort this one out for you.

 

[046]

if saw was represented as running good, something is misrepresented.
a saw that is hard to start and will not stay running is not what I call running good.

you need to get back with seller right away.

The 084 came in yesterday and I spent an hour or two looking it over and have a few questions. It was listed as running good so maybe I'm doing something wrong here but doubt it. It has a lot of compression, can't pull it over unless the comp release is engaged.

.

 

[flht01]

if saw was represented as running good, something is misrepresented.
a saw that is hard to start and will not stay running is not what I call running good.

you need to get back with seller right away.

I have, still waiting for a response.

 

[Lakeside53]

I'm with the others - your ignition timing is likely to far advanced due to being put in the wrong key positon, and yes, every time you pull it over, check the decomp postion - I make that mistake now and then... but only once in any one day

Aggie - not all 084's have two positions - there was a time when they were changing from one coil type to another, and for a period they has both slots milled into the flywheel. The 064 also has the same two slots around that time.

 

[Sawmill_Bill]

084 hard starting

My 084 doesn't have a decomp valve, it has a plug. It is always hard to turn it over, but it was really hard when one of the clutch springs broke. Tore my arm off until I figured out that was the issue.

 

[Lakeside53]

Save a hand on a cold day... screw that decomp back in! If you don't have one, the same decomp is used on 075/76, TS510/760. I see them for $10 or so used.


I can't even do a decent decomp test on an 84 - too damn hard to pull over! Somewhere about 150 I run out of steam.

 

[flht01]

... This saw is truly a beast and must be handled accordingly. You got to show it who's the boss.

I swear I heard it growling at me when I talked about it's momma. It only cranked that one time just to get me to try again so it could get even.

Any tricks to getting the flywheel off without using stihl's puller?

 

[Lakeside53]

No. Use the correct puller. If not you'll break or crack something expensive...

 

[flht01]

No. Use the correct puller. If not you'll break or crack something expensive...

Will do.

Thanks

 

[blis]

No. Use the correct puller. If not you'll break or crack something expensive...

Or just use hammer and save that few bucks...

 

[flht01]

Or just use hammer and save that few bucks...

I'll feed it a little rope and back the flywheel's nut and washer off to verify the key's position first. If it's wrong, I either get the dealer to reposition the flywheel or machine a puller.

I know what happens when I get a hammer involved

 

[Lakeside53]

One trick - make scratch mark from the nut to the flywheel. When you retighten the nut, just take it back the orginal marks and you'll have close to the same torque you started with. This assumes of course that it was torqued correctly to start with!

 

[flht01]

One trick - make scratch mark from the nut to the flywheel. When you retighten the nut, just take it back the orginal marks and you'll have close to the same torque you started with. This assumes of course that it was torqued correctly to start with!

I'll do it. Do you put anything on the crank's taper or bolt it up dry?

I've got torque wrenches if somebody has that value close by. (I'm still online searching for an 084 service manual, so far all I've found is 088 and 880's.)

 

[Lakeside53]

I'll do it. Do you put anything on the crank's taper or bolt it up dry?

I've got torque wrenches if somebody has that value close by. (I'm still online searching for an 084 service manual, so far all I've found is 088 and 880's.)

The flywheel and crank stub MUST be thoroughly degreased and dry.

45NM, or 33 ft/lbs..

 

[RiverRat2]

GTG off???

Will do.

Thanks

I suppose this means our local GTG is off/postponed until the new saw starting technique is resolved??????

I may have a puller for that flywheel I will check this evening