I love my job, BUT...

[pioneerguy600]

85$/hour is quite a high labour rate if you ask me, but I have no experience with US rates. Quite surprised actually, while saw prices are definately much more attractive.

I know car repair shops over here do charge approx 40 euro/h as labour charge, which is approx. 55$/h, and that is considered on the high side.

Car Dealer shops around here charge $100-$120 an hour, and you can be sure that the bill will be in excess of $100. just to drive in the door and straight out again. I was real busy this year and my daughter`s car needed a small part installed in the transmission of her Saturn. I paid to have it done by the dealership, $45.70 for the part,$50.23 for shop supplies and 2.5 hrs labor, total with taxes in was $450.43. Since that repair another shift modulator went bad, I purchased it and installed it myself, took me less than an hour and no shop supplies were needed.
Pioneerguy600

 

[belgian]

Car Dealer shops around here charge $100-$120 an hour, and you can be sure that the bill will be in excess of $100. just to drive in the door and straight out again. I was real busy this year and my daughter`s car needed a small part installed in the transmission of her Saturn. I paid to have it done by the dealership, $45.70 for the part,$50.23 for shop supplies and 2.5 hrs labor, total with taxes in was $450.43. Since that repair another shift modulator went bad, I purchased it and installed it myself, took me less than an hour and no shop supplies were needed.
Pioneerguy600

I know BMW or Mercedes dealers have high rates like that. I brought in my wifes car (Opel-GM) a fews weeks ago to change the distribution belt and to fix a water leak somewhere. 8 h labour involved and a total bill of 330 euro (450 $), which is not too bad I guess. Regular maintenance though and brake issues are always carried out by yours truly...I know I am cheap...:agree2:

 

[Paul001]

85$/hour is quite a high labour rate if you ask me, but I have no experience with US rates. Quite surprised actually, while saw prices are definately much more attractive.

I know car repair shops over here do charge approx 40 euro/h as labour charge, which is approx. 55$/h, and that is considered on the high side.

Yes sir, I'm close to 50% higher than most every other shop in my area. Difference is, I get the work done correctly and on time. Commercial customers not only appreciate but expect it.

Additionally, we do alot of little things most never think about; Reface the bar, flush fuel/oil tanks, pull recoil and clutch cover and clean, check RPM's, etc. Those are standard and part of our diagnostic fee's and honestly it's done regardless if we are just changing a chain (no charge)...seperation, what makes us different than our competition.

We do a repair and something got missed? Screwed up? That customer isn't getting a labor bill and his saw is at the top of the list, period.

As for this case, as I said, the only thing that was done wrong...no phone call. It happens, find away to make the customer happy and understand why the bill was as high as it was. Even if that means taking them back into the shop and pulling the saw down to show them the issue. For the most part people are blown away with saw techs (they've all tried to work on their saws themselves) and how efficient they are.

As for my bench prices, I'm always happy to give customers who complain my competitions phone numbers of locations...they are my best salesmen

 

[Brmorgan]

Two sides to this issue. First with homeowners, they get a call on anything above $75. They are told up front that bench time is $85/hr and diagnostics are flat rate $45 (pressure/vac test). Those that I've had issue with in the past pay the $45 up front, period.

Commercial customers are another story. If a saw is going to exceed 1/3 the cost of replacement, they get a call.

You did right in this case, except for not making the call to the customer. Even when you called him to tell him the saw was ready, you missed another chance to give him the finial bill and soften the shock at the counter.

Lastly, I save all the old parts, they go in a ziplock baggy attached to the saw. When someone asks me why it was so much, I pull the parts and show them exactly why the fuel line was replaced, coil, etc. Honestly most haven't a clue what it is you are talking about, they just know X part was $35, Y part was $12, Z was $85...

Now THAT'S the type of thing I like to see from a mechanic. I've had auto mechanics yell at me and ask me if I'm calling them a liar when I ask to see supposedly worn-out parts that they've replaced. And when they get defensive like that, I tend to get a feeling that they were in fact trying to pull one over on me. Now I ask up-front for them to keep any old parts unless it's something I know was buggered at the outset. It isn't that I don't trust them (well, maybe it is a little bit) but I just want to see what I'm getting for $80+/hr.

 

[howellhandmade]

Now THAT'S the type of thing I like to see from a mechanic. I've had auto mechanics yell at me and ask me if I'm calling them a liar when I ask to see supposedly worn-out parts that they've replaced. And when they get defensive like that, I tend to get a feeling that they were in fact trying to pull one over on me. Now I ask up-front for them to keep any old parts unless it's something I know was buggered at the outset. It isn't that I don't trust them (well, maybe it is a little bit) but I just want to see what I'm getting for $80+/hr.

Absolutely nothing wrong with that request, keeping old parts for inspection should be SOP. There's more wrong with their not wishing to comply. What have they got to hide? Like Reagan said, trust . . . but verify.

Jack

 

[Paul001]

Now THAT'S the type of thing I like to see from a mechanic. I've had auto mechanics yell at me and ask me if I'm calling them a liar when I ask to see supposedly worn-out parts that they've replaced. And when they get defensive like that, I tend to get a feeling that they were in fact trying to pull one over on me. Now I ask up-front for them to keep any old parts unless it's something I know was buggered at the outset. It isn't that I don't trust them (well, maybe it is a little bit) but I just want to see what I'm getting for $80+/hr.

We've all got a little Missouri in us, "Show Me". However it's goes both ways. I can not tell you the number of people who act like they have a clue what it is I'm talking about, that don't. I've actually tossed in comments like "muffler bearing" just to see if they'd grab onto something that silly and they sit there nodding their heads.

I think it comes from the fear of being taken advantage of, "can't let the wife take the car in for service, they'll take advantage of her"!! BS, truth is in most cases your wife is likely to get the best deal, least when it comes to OPE, we are so damn glad to see something besides faces as ugly as ours she gets the shirt off our back...just so she'll come back another day.

If you don't know ask. Most of the time a pissed off customer is from not understanding.

On the other hand, want to get a good read on someone, ask a question you know the answer to. I love hearing "I don't know but lets go find out" verse some made up BS...the latter is likely to never see another dollar from my pocket.

It's a two way street, both sides need to CYA and be honest.

 

[Brmorgan]

We've all got a little Missouri in us, "Show Me". However it's goes both ways. I can not tell you the number of people who act like they have a clue what it is I'm talking about, that don't. I've actually tossed in comments like "muffler bearing" just to see if they'd grab onto something that silly and they sit there nodding their heads.

I think it comes from the fear of being taken advantage of, "can't let the wife take the car in for service, they'll take advantage of her"!! BS, truth is in most cases your wife is likely to get the best deal, least when it comes to OPE, we are so damn glad to see something besides faces as ugly as ours she gets the shirt off our back...just so she'll come back another day.

If you don't know ask. Most of the time a pissed off customer is from not understanding.

On the other hand, want to get a good read on someone, ask a question you know the answer to. I love hearing "I don't know but lets go find out" verse some made up BS...the latter is likely to never see another dollar from my pocket.

It's a two way street, both sides need to CYA and be honest.

Ain't that the truth. I used to do that at Future Shop with the computers. Their salespeople are on commission, and I used to be a computer tech at Staples and have a lot more general knowledge regarding them than most folks, so it really used to piss me off when I'd go to look at computers at FS and have to listen to their salespeople try to tell me whatever I wanted to hear (or so it seemed) just to sell me something. Sometimes it's more fun to just laugh on the inside while someone makes an idiot of themselves!

 

[discounthunter]

Most customers are stupid and a good chunk of em are fulla **** liars. Hit them up front with a diagnosis fee, run tests and tell em the estimate and apply that fee to the total if they wanna repair it. Thats the best way to do it. It covers your time and it lets the customer decide what they wanna do w/o surprises. Even still you get bonehead customers that need to be six feet deep talkin smack about the estimate. Well if ya dont like the estimate, by god dont get the work done! Whats the problem? :monkey:

you dont get a lot of repeat customers,i mean full of **** liars do you? i hope your just posting crap to get attention or a rise out of yourself,otherwise i feel sorry for your business and whoever depends on you for a paycheck.

 

[cmetalbend]

Here's my personal practice.

When a customer brings a saw to me, I tell them I will inspect,test, and get back with them what they are going to spend. I also tell them if they choose not to repair the unit, I KEEP it for time spent. Or they can pay my diagnoses fee and it's returned to them in whatever state it may be in.. I also give them an estimated value of it in good running condition, and ask them what value it is to them. Somthing your late grandfather gave them, that's been in the family for years has value and when you ask questions like that they tend to trust in your judgement . Somtimes not, but honesty is always the best way.

 

[THALL10326]

I know BMW or Mercedes dealers have high rates like that. I brought in my wifes car (Opel-GM) a fews weeks ago to change the distribution belt and to fix a water leak somewhere. 8 h labour involved and a total bill of 330 euro (450 $), which is not too bad I guess. Regular maintenance though and brake issues are always carried out by yours truly...I know I am cheap...:agree2:

Well you cheap low life you'll be happy to know my check out fee is free alot of the time. If a saw comes in and I pull the rope and know right away its cooked from the feel I'll pull the muffler and show the man the damage. I'll tell him most cylinder kits are over 200.00. They decide real quick whether to get it repaired. If they do fine, if not I put the muffler back on and hand them back the saw, whole process takes less than 5 minutes. Instead of charging for piddly stuff like that I go into sales mode and get in their wallet for a new saw,LOL

 

[BIGBORE577]

Well you cheap low life you'll be happy to know my check out fee is free alot of the time. If a saw comes in and I pull the rope and know right away its cooked from the feel I'll pull the muffler and show the man the damage. I'll tell him most cylinder kits are over 200.00. They decide real quick whether to get it repaired. If they do fine, if not I put the muffler back on and hand them back the saw, whole process takes less than 5 minutes. Instead of charging for piddly stuff like that I go into sales mode and get in their wallet for a new saw,LOL

Ah, heck. What would you know!! LOL!!

 

[belgian]

Well you cheap low life you'll be happy to know my check out fee is free alot of the time. If a saw comes in and I pull the rope and know right away its cooked from the feel I'll pull the muffler and show the man the damage. I'll tell him most cylinder kits are over 200.00. They decide real quick whether to get it repaired. If they do fine, if not I put the muffler back on and hand them back the saw, whole process takes less than 5 minutes. Instead of charging for piddly stuff like that I go into sales mode and get in their wallet for a new saw,LOL

How dare you of all people call me a cheap low life, you heathen....:hmm3grin2orange:

It may sound like I am cheap, but I think there's a difference between being cheap and being "cost aware" . I am a big fan of "good value for the money", and my wife says I spent to much money on my tools anyway ...I know she doesn't read here so I can admit she's right...:taped:

And if you have a budget to spend, spend it wisely.

Now your cooked saw example is a pretty straight forward diagnose, and a walk in the park for an experienced saw tech. It's much more difficult if the saw "doesn't run right".

I mentioned a husky 44 earlier that was giving me fits. I replaced the crank seal yesterday and it still didn't run right....I go whaaaaat....grrrrrrr. Finally, I found the tank vent being too restricted as well. If I had to charge 85$/h for this little saw repair, I probably would be shot by the customer, or get stuffed with it.

 

[Pierreg]

A thought........

Hey Johnny.Maybe you should get that crushed 044 on here and set it on the counter and when the customer asks questions and complains....say that's the last customer who complained about the bill.....BTW....you need to lower your rates for "the working man".Laughing with you not at you........

 

[spike60]

i understand that and respect your oppinioon very much. my whole logic tho was in an 041 i set a max limit of around $150, i hit right in that area and so made my judgment that i did a good thing. i updated the ignition, yes the points were fried and the old coil was as well, the electronic module was 1/2 the cost of a new set of points! not to mention the aluminum mounting bracket for the coil and such was also broken! Fuel lines were dry rotted, cracked and the filter was definitely trashed All of this was needed work (in my eyes), when i do a tune up the saw should be ready to hit the wood pile! that to me usually means the chain needs to be sharp as well. Thats just me, im enjoying seeing everyones different take on this, please keep them coming. thanks again.

I'm not even going to read the rest of this thread, because too many people want to pretend they are lawyers.

I'll say this though: A-What you did was TOTALLY in line with what you were asked to do. B-From what you said, the work you did was certainly necessary to get the saw running properly. C-The price you charged is very fair for the work you did. D-In this case, a call to the customer wasn't needed because what you did was just basic stuff and there was no reason for you to feel that the job was escalating beyond what you discussed with the customer. (It's not like you tore the saw down to do bearings and seals, or put a new piston in it.)

The problem here with this customer is not that unusual. Some people think that a piece of equipment can be repaired for the price of a sandwich or something. That's about the same price that I would have charged for the work myself. My experience is much like the examples from BloodOnTheIce's shop. That's what these repairs cost. Don't let this bother you.

Lastly, I'm also a Husky dealer, but I've got a thing for 041's myself. Got three of them, and they're my only Stihls. Cool saws!

 

[THALL10326]

How dare you of all people call me a cheap low life, you heathen....:hmm3grin2orange:

It may sound like I am cheap, but I think there's a difference between being cheap and being "cost aware" . I am a big fan of "good value for the money", and my wife says I spent to much money on my tools anyway ...I know she doesn't read here so I can admit she's right...:taped:

And if you have a budget to spend, spend it wisely.

Now your cooked saw example is a pretty straight forward diagnose, and a walk in the park for an experienced saw tech. It's much more difficult if the saw "doesn't run right".

I mentioned a husky 44 earlier that was giving me fits. I replaced the crank seal yesterday and it still didn't run right....I go whaaaaat....grrrrrrr. Finally, I found the tank vent being too restricted as well. If I had to charge 85$/h for this little saw repair, I probably would be shot by the customer, or get stuffed with it.

Well I only go by reading all your posts. Obvious to me your a cheap low life 100%,LOLOLOLOL

Belgian at a recent Stihl meeting this thing of repairs and costs came up and it was discussed. To my surprise they used photos I had taken in the shop and used them as examples of what a tech should do. Saw doesn't run right is usually caused by 3 things, compression, ignition or fuel. Simple basics and nothing more. Using those basics the problem can most times be nailed down in 10 minutes or less. Me, I always pull the rope and feel for compression and scoring. I pull the muffler and look to be sure. That takes maybe 2-3 minutes. Got good compression and cylinder looks good. Grab the spark tester and check for spark, another 1-2 minutes. Got fire go to the fuel system. Getting fuel grab the vac/pressure gauges. The whole process shouldn't take over a 15-20 minutes at most to find the cause of the saw not running right. The fix may take awhile but finding the problem shouldn't. I charge 50.00 a hour. I'm in the richest county in the USA. Many find 50.00 a hour outragous when they can take their new Caddilac to the garage at the tune of 75-85 a hour. Now if they can get their 50-60,000 dollar car repaired at 75-85 a hour they sure don't expect to pay that much a hour to get their 300-500.00 saw worked on. You I figure would expect 15.00-20.00 a hour tops,LOLOLOLOL

 

[belgian]

Well I only go by reading all your posts. Obvious to me your a cheap low life 100%,LOLOLOLOL

You I figure would expect 15.00-20.00 a hour tops,LOLOLOLOL

You ain't right, LOL. An experienced tech will go for 50 euro/h over here, nothing wrong with that, and totally justified. I don't work for free either.

My free time don't cost me anything, so I save 50€/h working on my saws, cars, tractor, household equipment... etc, and on top of it, I like doing it. I know you folks don't like people like me, hehe...

What we have here is the ultimate 'do it yourselfer' :greenchainsaw:

 

[pioneerguy600]

You ain't right, LOL. An experienced tech will go for 50 euro/h over here, nothing wrong with that, and totally justified. I don't work for free either.

My free time don't cost me anything, so I save 50€/h working on my saws, cars, tractor, household equipment... etc, and on top of it, I like doing it. I know you folks don't like people like me, hehe...

What we have here is the ultimate 'do it yourselfer' :greenchainsaw:

We must be Brothers from a different time zone.LOL. I know the dealers don`t actually like to see me if I take my vehicle or one of my families in for work, they take the vehicle in but try to get rid of me by suggesting I go down the street to get a coffee and come back in an hour or two. That never works with me, I know a lot of the mechanics and parts men at the dealerships so I just hang with them and pick up as much info on the newer vehicles as I can from them. They treat me as an equal as they know my capabilities, when the work is completed on the vehicle and they hand me the repair bill then they get questioned. I have had repair bills reduced by 25-50% by just asking questions and usually the service manager gets involved, we keep it civil and they know that I know what I am talking about or I would not be questioning the invoice. Most often the bill is reasonable and I pay without questioning but if I see any unreasonable charges then I don`t hesitate or fear questioning the charge.
Pioneerguy600

 

[belgian]

Hey Jerry,

I like the idea of teaming up and bring this ole 019T into Thall's shop for repair, have a nice beer at the counter, and swing some tricky questions Tom's way while he's obviously struggling to put it back together....LOLOL.

And when he's finished, we shall conclude that the bill is way too expensive and that he can keep it.....:hmm3grin2orange::hmm3grin2orange:

I know, I know, that sounds a bit cruel and unfair to ole Tommy, but to be honoust, just think about the fun we would have ... LOLOLOL


I think Tom will probably say then : I love my job, but...........You gotsa payyyyyyyyyy.....

 

[pioneerguy600]

Hey Jerry,

I like the idea of teaming up and bring this ole 019T into Thall's shop for repair, have a nice beer at the counter, and swing some tricky questions Tom's way while he's obviously struggling to put it back together....LOLOL.

And when he's finished, we shall conclude that the bill is way too expensive and that he can keep it.....:hmm3grin2orange::hmm3grin2orange:

I know, I know, that sounds a bit cruel and unfair to ole Tommy, but to be honoust, just think about the fun we would have ... LOLOLOL


I think Tom will probably say then : I love my job, but...........You gotsa payyyyyyyyyy.....

I think that would be a hoot for sure, I think that I have some Elvis 8track tapes around here somewhere and we could pick up a case of Pepsi when we got close to his shop, that might break the ice and get us inside the repair shop, then dump the 019T on him all of a sudden like, wonder what tune he`d be humming then.LOL
Pioneerguy600

 

[belgian]

I think that would be a hoot for sure, I think that I have some Elvis 8track tapes around here somewhere and we could pick up a case of Pepsi when we got close to his shop, that might break the ice and get us inside the repair shop, then dump the 019T on him all of a sudden like, wonder what tune he`d be humming then.LOL
Pioneerguy600

probably this one : :greenchainsaw:



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