Newbie intro and questions

[c5rulz]

Be sure to budget for chaps and steel toe boots if you don't have any yet. You'll need a spare chain and file kit off the bat and a wedge can help you get a bar un-pinched or prevent a pinch while bucking. Hearing protection or a full helmet is also a good idea, especially when you start felling.

Happy cutting and welcome!

:agree2:

Welcome

Get yourself some safety gear, and if you are going to start dropping trees have an experienced person help you and get you started safely. There is no such thing as a minor chainsaw accident. :msp_sad: A 550XP or MS261 is a lot more saw than you need, but you will love every minute of it.

 

[Philip Wheelock]

o here I am hoping for some advice...I dont want this to be a 500xp vs ms261 thread, but rather hoping on your opinions on the following:

• If you like one saw over the other, and have experience with them, what makes said saw your favorite?
• Do I need a pro saw?
• I am looking for a one saw stable - is a 50cc saw the best bet for me?
• What size bar?
• Any chain recommended?

Welcome to AS. A few thoughts:
• Buy new if possible; there's enough to learn about using a chainsaw without having to troubleshoot a used piece of equipment.
• Most would say that the 550xp and ms261 are the 50cc class leaders. Any difference IMO would be the level of service that the respective local dealers could provide. The Husky dealer should have the auto-tune diagnostic equipment and training. Between Stihl and Husky, I'd shop the dealers and the extended warranties offered to consumers.
• AS members are enthusiasts who appreciate pro-level equipment. For the amount and size wood that you expect to be cutting, you probably don't need a pro saw and a reputable mid-level saw with a good track record will do. General rule is 1 cord of wood per acre for sustainable harvesting, so once you get past the initial cleanup in the first several years, your ability to cut more wood may be constrained by the size of the wooded property you wish to keep. But you get what you pay for, and, in my experience, pro saws are worth the extra $$$ in terms of durability, reliability, quality of operation, and ease of maintenance.
• A pro-level 50cc saw will handle 24" dia. wood without a problem but will take more time than a 60cc saw, which may get a bit heavy when limbing if you're lifting a 14 lb. consumer-level power head. Many on AS would recommend a 60cc saw for a 1-saw plan. You'll inevitably run into a pinched bar, which means carrying an extra bar and chain if you have an inboard clutch. I can't speak to a pinched bar with an outboard clutch. Having another saw as a backup is much handier.
• When starting out, it may be best to go with the manufacturer's/dealer's recommended bar length and an anti-kickback chain. 16-18" for 50cc class and 18-20" for 60cc class, depending on who you're talking to.
• Then there's the cost of personal protection equipment, a wood splitter and a garden tractor/trailer. Turns out that even a pro saw is the least expensive part of your investment.

 

[Mike from Maine]

I'd say buy the ppe first. Then see how much you have left for a saw.

If you are comfortable with used there a plenty of deals to be had. I just picked up a garage queen 026 with a spare brand new stihl bar and chain for $47. Get yourself a craigslist app to alert you when whatever you are looking for is listed and you will find a deal.

 

[Mike-M]

So the debate here is new homeowner class vs used pro class. Used pro will give more bang for the buck of course, but may have a potential reliability issue. Id much rather go used. There are a lot of guys out there that rebuild saws and know what theyre doing. If you can find one of them (many are on here) Id say thats your best bet.

 

[kdaffy]

I'd say buy the ppe first. Then see how much you have left for a saw.

If you are comfortable with used there a plenty of deals to be had. I just picked up a garage queen 026 with a spare brand new stihl bar and chain for $47. Get yourself a craigslist app to alert you when whatever you are looking for is listed and you will find a deal.

Sorry what's PPE? *edit - figured it out - personal protection equipment.
I am serious about safety and have already purchased chaps, gloves, helmet and ear protection. also bought the garden tractor/trailer when i bought my house. saw is the last thing i need!

 

[kdaffy]

My opinion, Talk with the dealers in your area. If your gut says this is the dealer and saw you want get that saw. Good dealer support is something you really cant put a price on. Somebody has to service the saw at some point. Why not get a new saw with the warranty. Any of the top brands should do you just fine as long as they are taken care of.

Basically what I'm saying is get a new saw from a local dealer you feel confident with enjoy your new saw that is under warranty. Oh and don't forget to buy the 6 pack of synthetic oil to double your warranty.

I'm pretty sure I will go down this route. Talking to some dealers currently.

Although I appreciate the comments and support for buying used, toys like these, I like buying new, mine from the beginning to the end...i dont know why, I just like it.

 

[BigDaddyR]

I'm pretty sure I will go down this route. Talking to some dealers currently.

Although I appreciate the comments and support for buying used, toys like these, I like buying new, mine from the beginning to the end...i dont know why, I just like it.

Can't wait to see your first, "My saw 's!", post. Remember, it didn't happen without pictures:hmm3grin2orange:

Okay so where is the new saw now? opcorn:

 

[palbin]

Get a 346xp.

 

[kdaffy]

Can't wait to see your first, "My saw 's!", post. Remember, it didn't happen without pictures:hmm3grin2orange:

Okay so where is the new saw now? opcorn:

yes i know i know - working on it.

proof will be in the pictures.

 

[kdaffy]

Welcome to AS. A few thoughts:
• Buy new if possible; there's enough to learn about using a chainsaw without having to troubleshoot a used piece of equipment.
• Most would say that the 550xp and ms261 are the 50cc class leaders. Any difference IMO would be the level of service that the respective local dealers could provide. The Husky dealer should have the auto-tune diagnostic equipment and training. Between Stihl and Husky, I'd shop the dealers and the extended warranties offered to consumers.
• AS members are enthusiasts who appreciate pro-level equipment. For the amount and size wood that you expect to be cutting, you probably don't need a pro saw and a reputable mid-level saw with a good track record will do. General rule is 1 cord of wood per acre for sustainable harvesting, so once you get past the initial cleanup in the first several years, your ability to cut more wood may be constrained by the size of the wooded property you wish to keep. But you get what you pay for, and, in my experience, pro saws are worth the extra $$$ in terms of durability, reliability, quality of operation, and ease of maintenance.
• A pro-level 50cc saw will handle 24" dia. wood without a problem but will take more time than a 60cc saw, which may get a bit heavy when limbing if you're lifting a 14 lb. consumer-level power head. Many on AS would recommend a 60cc saw for a 1-saw plan. You'll inevitably run into a pinched bar, which means carrying an extra bar and chain if you have an inboard clutch. I can't speak to a pinched bar with an outboard clutch. Having another saw as a backup is much handier.
• When starting out, it may be best to go with the manufacturer's/dealer's recommended bar length and an anti-kickback chain. 16-18" for 50cc class and 18-20" for 60cc class, depending on who you're talking to.
• Then there's the cost of personal protection equipment, a wood splitter and a garden tractor/trailer. Turns out that even a pro saw is the least expensive part of your investment.

hi,
thanks for the welcome and info!

I have a question about the "sustainable harvesting" you refer to above. 1 cord/acre is a lot less than what I was expecting. Can you point me in the right direction to learn more about this? what exactly do you mean by "sustainable harvesting"? Planting a tree for every one you cut? something else? is there a how to guide here (search didnt bring anything up) or elsewhere I can look?

 

[nstueve]

For an all around saw that will do everything you run into I would suggest a 60-65cc saw. It won't be the smallest, lightest thing but if you run into bigger trees at least you can bury a 20in bar and double cut both sides if need be. 50cc would be the minimum I would get... The 550 husky you mentioned is a auto tune that needs a dealer thats set up for the electronics that runs the saw. If your dealers aren't set up look at a 346/359. I personally recommend a 6401/6421 Makita or 6400 dolmar. they are reliable, time tested, and proven performers. they can handle anything from a 18in-24in bar stock out of the box.

I'd also like to add that some saws come from factory with limitations and problems. Don't think that a new saw means "problem free." Some saws have limiter caps on the carb that make the saw run way to lean at idle. The result is a torched piston and cylinder. Others have mufflers that are so choked down you hardly get the power they are capable of. Others have cheap rubber fuel lines that rot out in a couple years causing a lean condition that torches a saw as well. Others are prone to failing oil seals over time... Guess what I'm saying is sometimes the best work horse is the one that has already been broken in and worked over by a professional. And unless you are getting an echo with a 5 year warranty; there is usually not much that can happen in 1-2 years time. Warranty's are more or less another piece of marketing to help sell a product. If you take care of your equipment and do the right things to keep them in shape you'll be find; used or new. That being said the biggest thing you can do for a saw is run synthetic 2cycle oil.

hi,
thanks for the welcome and info!

I have a question about the "sustainable harvesting" you refer to above. 1 cord/acre is a lot less than what I was expecting. Can you point me in the right direction to learn more about this? what exactly do you mean by "sustainable harvesting"? Planting a tree for every one you cut? something else? is there a how to guide here (search didn't bring anything up) or elsewhere I can look?

Sustainable harvesting means you can cut, split, and dry enough wood and still have sustainable growth to replace what you cut over a years time. Remember if you are in hard woods like oak and walnut you have to cut and split 1-2 years ahead to make sure you moisture content is low enough to burn without excessive moisture that causes creosote build up in your chimney. That being said we're not saying you have to buy more land. Look on your local craigslist to find trees that people want removed or other acreage owners that wouldn't mind a free tree removal. I have 5 acres of mostly wooded lot and 90% of my wood comes from other farms/acreages near me.

 

[Philip Wheelock]

I have a question about the "sustainable harvesting" you refer to above. 1 cord/acre is a lot less than what I was expecting. Can you point me in the right direction to learn more about this? what exactly do you mean by "sustainable harvesting"? Planting a tree for every one you cut? something else? is there a how to guide here (search didnt bring anything up) or elsewhere I can look?

I can't offer an exact definition, but, for me, "sustainable harvesting" means harvesting no more trees in a wood lot than the area can regrow on its own. Certain harvesting/thinning techniques will enhance the regrowth. A lot depends on the tree species, soil conditions, sun exposure and overall climate. I've read 2 cords per acre as a general rule; I got the 1 cord per acre from my local dealer, so I figured I'd quote the more conservative estimate.

You may have neighbors who'd like to have wood taken off their property. Main issue may be what to do with the limbs or whatever you cut but don't want to bring back to the house. There are contractors who operate skid steers with mulcher heads that grind the slash and small/medium stumps into chips. Awesome, wicked machines to watch. Solves the problem in a cost-effective and environmentally-friendly way without the risks of burning.

Just didn't want you to get all geared up without taking into account the amount of wood available to harvest.

 

[bikesandcars]

lots of good ideas here and saws. I went the 50cc Dolmar route (5105) and then developed CAD and it's downhill since.

There is no "1 all around saw"... there are some that you can do everything with, but there are always compromises

There are saws that are great for specific conditions, but don't do everything.

Here are my observations:

sub-40cc- light Top handles for in-tree and rear handles for light ground work... pull a 14 or 16" bar, great for light stuff... noticably lighter and not much slower through your average 8" branch. These are specialized for light conditions, your back will thank you.

40-50CC - an interesting class... after 40cc it usually pays to round up to 50cc because the weight is the same and the power is more.... usually but not always

50CC - The true all-around chainsaw class... top models will run a 20" 3/8 chain very well.. not as light as a sub-40 but noticably more powerful

60CC - The affordable range of the "heavy" saw class... great for firewood (down cutting) and will run a 24" bar OK...

70CC / 80CC - the expensive and powerful range of the "heavy" saw class... Great for CAD and loggers... similar weight to 60cc but much more power... really specialized on the heavy wood end (or for cutting quick with a 18" bar).

If you need 1 saw... I suggest a 50cc... but it will be an eternal compromise.

I think it's better to have 2 saws... a 40cc with a 16" bar for most light work and a 70cc-ish for firewood and larger wood if you have that on your property.

I like the 50cc saw class... wish I would have gone bigger.

I do NOT think it's better to use a 20" bar to save your back... it's actually heavier and more dangerous because it's easier to make a handling mistake if you aren't burying the bucking bar in the wood.. but that's just my opinion.

 

[PainAndMurphy]

quite true, but..

You don't need a pro saw for that kind of work. I heat exclusively with wood and I have no pro saws, only "homeowner" stuff. If I were to go back to just one saw I would go with an 18" bar, but 20" is good too. Makes the saw more nose heavy but no big deal. Chain for bars 18" and below is often LoPro which has a narrower kerf, so when you go to 20" it gives the saw a different feel. Get a strato engine so you don't have to breath quite so much crap.

A RedMax GZ4500 is an impressive saw with a two piece mag case. It is very light.

Something like a Husqvarna 455R would also be a good choice. Not the lightest but it has a strato engine and it's smooth and has decent power. My Dad has one and I've used it - it's a nice saw.

..ever since I switched to 'PRO' saws, I never wanna go back.. for the certain brand-names, particular engine-sizes and model-series that has been my preference for the past few years, I've more than learned to appreciate the vibration isolation on the 'more than a home-owner' chainsaw(s)..

I'm not saying that there aren't any mid-level saws which have a fantastic vibration-isolation, just that not always that particular supplier that you find best in your area - will have the no-compromise option in terms of power and comfort. I'd say - never compromise on both comfort and handling, other than just more performance for the buck..

IMHO - overall you should find a good balance between all features under a good warranty and customers service you can rely on for a 1st saw.

And keep the forum posted, I know most ppl here love giving advice, and there are more than a few fine advisers here

 

[Dusty Rhodes]

Won't comment much on the saw situation, you see whats in my list and I use both saws on a regular basis. If I could only have one saw though I would keep the 60CC saw as I get opportunity to cut some fair sized wood and I appreciate the bigger saw for that. I do not have much land either, so I cut very little of my firewood on my own property. If you keep your eyes and ears open you will find plenty of firewood opportunities on other peoples property. May have to travel here and there to get your wood, but I burn about 8 cord per year and I always easily find enough opportunities to get wood not too far from home. While I do not get the chance to always pick what species of wood I get to harvest I have been fortunate to have good hardwoods to choose from. Good luck with your purchase, learn to hand file your chains to keep your chain sharp no matter what saw you end up with. At the end of the day, a sharp chain on a moderately powered saw will cut a lot of firewood. Stay safe by wearing that PPE and use the brain God gave ya while processing that wood.

 

[Sayheymj]

455 Rancher

I'm an ex forest worker in my prior life years ago, and now a homeowner on 6 acres and cut my own firewood for all my heating.

I've had my husqvarna 455 with a 20" bar for many years now and it was all I needed until this last year when I bought a bigger saw (Husqvarna 365 28") to drop some big mature trees.

Honestly, I could have done the job with the 455 but it's just not as much fun. For what your doing, the 455 Rancher is perfect in my opionon and a great value. As stated in other posts, it's not going to be the choice of a faller or aborist, and I agree they have a different need that requires a different grade and size of a saw.

Good luck with what ever you choose....

 

[PainAndMurphy]

455 / 2152

I'm an ex forest worker in my prior life years ago, and now a homeowner on 6 acres and cut my own firewood for all my heating.

I've had my husqvarna 455 with a 20" bar for many years now and it was all I needed until this last year when I bought a bigger saw (Husqvarna 365 28") to drop some big mature trees.

Honestly, I could have done the job with the 455 but it's just not as much fun. For what your doing, the 455 Rancher is perfect in my opionon and a great value. As stated in other posts, it's not going to be the choice of a faller or aborist, and I agree they have a different need that requires a different grade and size of a saw.

Good luck with what ever you choose....

I just won an auction tonight..
The same seller had both saws (mentioned in title..)

I read that two are really great when it comes to value, and the only thing that keeps me from getting both - is obviously budget PLUS the fact that I did win the one that ended 1st

I do have CAD , but I have to tell myself to calm down and get only what I need most..
This last investment is on the verge of luxury , but after all I'm gonna put a couple of 'puppies' from my own small (budget wise.. :/ ) collection .. . AND I'm on a quest to find the best midsized multipurpose chainsaw but on the more lightweight side and with the best vibration damping that can be found Not starting an argument here -- it's MY own quest to find out myself

I guess that soon I'm about to see how the 2152 does overall, though I can already admit that I love the vibe-isolation of the MS240 / MS260 family , I just felt like finding an opportunity for a newer used saw for a reasonable fee.. It just happened that the 445 and the 2152 were there in front of me "ending soon" with very low price from the same good seller

 

[Chris-PA]

..ever since I switched to 'PRO' saws, I never wanna go back.. for the certain brand-names, particular engine-sizes and model-series that has been my preference for the past few years, I've more than learned to appreciate the vibration isolation on the 'more than a home-owner' chainsaw(s)..

I'm not saying that there aren't any mid-level saws which have a fantastic vibration-isolation, just that not always that particular supplier that you find best in your area - will have the no-compromise option in terms of power and comfort. I'd say - never compromise on both comfort and handling, other than just more performance for the buck..

IMHO - overall you should find a good balance between all features under a good warranty and customers service you can rely on for a 1st saw.

And keep the forum posted, I know most ppl here love giving advice, and there are more than a few fine advisers here

Life is always about compromise, and the biggest one is often money. Sure I'd love to have a brand new 550XP, but there's no way for me to justify the purchase. If I bought one the next day when I woke up I would not be able to do a single thing with it I cannot do now. Instead I have a bunch of used lower end saws, most carefully chosen by researching the design, looking at IPLs and similar saws and parts being sold on eBay. Except for a tiny one I bought on a lark they've all got good A/V and all work very well. I've maintained or modified every one and know all their details. I can pick up any one, gas it and go cut wood with the expectation of having it start and run all day.

For a guy planning to do what the OP describes a 455R would serve well for a lifetime if properly cared for. My Dad has one and I've run it, it's a wonderful saw but more than I need to spend. Spending even more for a pro saw for that duty is a purely a luxury purchase having no other benefit whatsoever - it's just to satisfy a desire.

 

[PainAndMurphy]

all true. no argument here

Life is always about compromise, and the biggest one is often money. Sure I'd love to have a brand new 550XP, but there's no way for me to justify the purchase. If I bought one the next day when I woke up I would not be able to do a single thing with it I cannot do now. Instead I have a bunch of used lower end saws, most carefully chosen by researching the design, looking at IPLs and similar saws and parts being sold on eBay. Except for a tiny one I bought on a lark they've all got good A/V and all work very well. I've maintained or modified every one and know all their details. I can pick up any one, gas it and go cut wood with the expectation of having it start and run all day.

For a guy planning to do what the OP describes a 455R would serve well for a lifetime if properly cared for. My Dad has one and I've run it, it's a wonderful saw but more than I need to spend. Spending even more for a pro saw for that duty is a purely a luxury purchase having no other benefit whatsoever - it's just to satisfy a desire.

I never said a PRO saw is a must have. I happen to know my way around 2nd hand market, and fixing chainsaws on my own, so I choose the more popular mid-sized saws to do most of the work that I have where I'm at. That way I know I can always replace anything - easily - comparing to other less successful design.

By the way - ever since the smoother and heavier-duty spring A/V mounts were 'adopted' in broader variety of chainsaws - anyone can get his/her hands on a really good, highly efficient, smooth operation and comfortable chainsaw. this PLUS getting it from the nearest most decent dealer you can find, while the chainsaw is popular enough - is another way to go.. IMO.