torque vs chainspeed

[thomas1]

What gives you the ability to increase load while maintaining chain speed?

More power...

And since the chain speed is the same, how does this magical addition of power occur?

Power is work divided by time. Even if chain speed stays the same, the amount of work can be changed by altering the force applied to the saw

Increased load, same chain speed. What changed?

 

[Chris-PA]

Power is work divided by time. Even if chain speed stays the same, the amount of work can be changed by altering the force applied to the saw

Yup - longer bar, more force applied, etc.

 

[Mastermind]

Increased load, same chain speed. What changed?

Black magic.

 

[lone wolf]

Black magic.

Yup your crackin up

 

[Mastermind]

We can kick this ******** around from now on and never get any further ahead than we were 5 years ago.

Give it a phuckin rest.

 

[HuskStihl]

We can kick this ******** around from now on and never get any further ahead than we were 5 years ago.

Give it a phuckin rest.

And we will continue to do so until ported saws come with dyno graphs. Then we will say "I really like a saw that makes 80% of its max power at 9000 rpm, makes max power at 11k, and still has 80% at 13k." Or something like that.

 

[HuskStihl]

Increased load, same chain speed. What changed?

Chip depth, up to a raker limited maximum

 

[wcorey]

And since the chain speed is the same, how does this magical addition of power occur?

Getting the saw monkey'ed on, of course...

What gives you the ability to increase load while maintaining chain speed?

You failed to mention previously that the saw couldn't change...

 

[Mastermind]

And we will continue to do so until ported saws come with dyno graphs. Then we will say "I really like a saw that makes 80% of its max power at 9000 rpm, makes max power at 11k, and still has 80% at 13k." Or something like that.

 

[Gypo Logger]

They all have torque and chain speed. Max chain speed of any given saw is based on gearing and cc and most importantly the chain.
There's not much point in having torque or chain speed if the chain is so dull that it may as well be on backwards.
John

 

[Mastermind]

OK.......now everyone can pontificate about that for awhile.

I'll be moving the deck chairs around on the Titanic.

 

[old-cat]

OK.......now everyone can pontificate about that for awhile.

I'll be moving the deck chairs around on the Titanic.

I think one of your cows is trying to get liberated

 

[wcorey]

We can kick this ******** around from now on and never get any further ahead than we were 5 years ago.

Give it a phuckin rest.

A lot of this is based on peoples perception of the issue rather than the actual performance of the saws. Discussions like this can change that in a positive way... until the next new crew (or s**t stirrer's) jump on board anyway...lol...
It is and will continue to be an ongoing thing, up to each of us whether or not to participate, it will surely be a loss when you in particular decide to stop...

 

[thomas1]

OK.......now everyone can pontificate about that for awhile.

I'll be moving the deck chairs around on the Titanic.

I think you and Wiggz and Scott have a pretty good handle on what makes a good, usable work saw.

 

[Mastermind]

Well Bill......

The whole mess just gives me gas at this point.

I've spent a huge amount of time and energy testing different stuff. I am not just talking out of my ass here.......

 

[wcorey]

Dyno graphs can be more telling when the torque curve is included, particularly when trying to find small gains from small changes.

Not a saw, just an example for context...

 

[sawfun]

Well from my little experience, torque being more important than speed comes into play when 50" bars are used and it is essential when 60 + inch bars are used. Thus the gear drive saws shine in this arena. I have run a 60" bar with high chain speeds and had the chain start to pull loose from the bar, pretty scary as there is no time to act. Especially considering 11 + foot of chain whipping around, it aint no 346 I can tell you that.

Now speed is more important to me personally when saws like the 200t or 346 are used. Those saws are primarily designed for limbing 3 - 4 inch branches. Of course they will do larger and I have used them on 16" diameter trees myself. However that was not their intended purpose. Sure we use the 346 as a firewood saw, though it was designed purely as a European style limbing saw, thats why it falls over with a rounded bottom.

The debate of torque vs speed is probably best in the 50cc - 90cc arena. It depends on the size and type of wood. The operator preference or style of use and likely more variables. But I do not want more torque than speed in my 200t, and I want way more torque than speed in my big 100cc + Macs & 090 Stihls. You want both, get a ported 088 or 3120. Just this poor fools opinion though.

 

[wcorey]

Well Bill......

The whole mess just gives me gas at this point.

I've spent a huge amount of time and energy testing different stuff. I am not just talking out of my ass here.......

Just to clarify, I'm not questioning your opinion on saws, only about the value of discussion of this subject..

 

[Mastermind]

Just to clarify, I'm not questioning your opinion on saws, only about the value of discussion of this subject..

How is it a valuable discussion?

Ten different people will tell us what they "think" and I'll just get gas.

 

[Chris-PA]

This is like asking, when considering the size of a house, "what is more important, length or width?" Except it's even more nonsensical, as to some extant you can convert torque and speed by changing gearing.