Who should cut your tree?

[HELSEL]

Who would you rather cut your tree? Someone fresh out of school with all the icas,ars,and what ever else they can call them selves.Or would you rather hire someone who has done it for 30 years with zero loss? With no schooling.


Rick

 

[HELSEL]

Someone had to learn it to teach it.

Rick

 

[BRCCArborist]

It would depend on what you mean by "cut your tree". If it was a pruning job I feel a student such as myself is in a good position to give quality work since we are on top of the new advancements in the science aspect of tree care. For a technical rigging job or takedown however, probably a seasoned veteran.

 

[jimmyq]

exactly, depends on what you want. a very experienced "tree trimmer" who may or may not know what the current best managemtnet practices are or a somewhat experienced newbie that has good book knowledge and limited practical knowledge. best choice, mix of both, an experienced, up to date, educated arborist.

I know of a thread on another forum that discusses the "been doing it forever" sales pitch.

 

[Ekka]

Really depends on the circumstances of what the job entails.

If it were a formative pruning job on a young tree I'd go the student. If it were a spikeless climb to remove deadwood or a limb I'd probably still go student.

If it were a complex rigging job and a take down go for the experience.

It's tough to answer a question like this one way or another without the given scenario ... but sometimes the answer will be neither just get a cheap hack!

 

[Rob Murphy]

Training and exp

Go for someone who has both....

 

[ross_scott]

I agree with Ekka a student will do for the basic stuff but the more complex stuff I would go for an experienced tree feller or arborist, a classic example of experience is the guy who is teaching me about forestry work he has 17 years experience in forest work and does do some private work pruning and felling(he also assists the local power company on weekends when they have excess work load) in built up areas and he can get a tree to drop exactly where he wants it to go these are the kinds of people I would let loose on my trees I prefer experienced and safe contractors over cowboys who have a she'll be right attitude

 

[treeseer]

'Cut your tree" usually means removal; here the criteria are insurance and references and price. If you want to know what, where why when or IF to cut, then you need more tree understanding.

Mechanics or biology; different specialties.

Hey BRCC what do you know, you're in a Cave! jsut kidding; tell your prof hey!

 

[rfwoodvt]

How about this....

Consider these phrases...

"Educated Idiot"

"....only has an 8th grade education"

Of course that is the question isn't it. As posed the question to my spouse and she aptly stated that "You cannot teach common sense, you either have it, aquire it from experience or you'll never get it."

The School of Hard Knocks is a great classroom and cutting edge field knowledge is something that cannot be taught in the class room.

On the other hand classroom theory is the beginning of learning to think...some only know theory and fail to apply to reality, others use it as a launching point for discovery and experimentation.

Another cliche--"A man of experience will never be at the mercy of a man with a theory."

So, I'm a man from the school of hard knocks but am smart enough to know that it is wise to seek academic learning and credentials.

For the most part, someone with 30 years, no losses and no additional formal training/education is not necessarily going to be good for your trees. How many old timers like this are still using spikes for pruning, filling cavities, painting prunings and flush cutting. And, have no idea what current research is.

So, what you want done will determine whether you want a "tree cutter" or an "arborist" Tree cutters can get away with technique and tools cause the tree is being removed.

If the tree stays then get an arborist (preferabley with all teh alphabet soup and 30 years !

 

[Husky288XP]

I am an odd student because I have been climbing and practicing tree care since about age 15. I also attained my ISA cert. and Pest. Applicators license. In the classroom I see a great deal of students that don't even know how to notch a tree, or distingiush a Scarlet Oak from a Pin Oak. Personally for Urban Forestry I think it is best to get out in the field and make your mark. Schooling here is a joke most of the classes I have taken are useless. I had a Wood Products class were we had to ID certain tree species from a block of wood under a microscope, when will I ever use this skill. Or a Statistics class that talks about experimental design and hypothesis testing. College is a bunch of Bull Sh!t you go through to get a nice desk job after your one of experience at a major tree service like Davey.

I thought that college would give a better understanding of arboriculture, wrong. I actually think I am ******* dumber for being here. Last one my Dendrology class ( Tree ID), we look at more small woody shrubs than trees. We look at European Buckthorn, Black-Haw, Honey Suckles, Privet, Maple leaf Viburnum, and slack on major shade trees like Oak, maple, etc. Most kids cannot tell the difference between a Red Maple and a Sugar Maple, and they'll probably be your boss one day. Isn't that a kick in the balls?

 

[John Paul Sanborn]

I'm with the side that say's it cannot be either-or.

A true practitioner will be a student of his trade, not some one who has been doing the same thing from the begining.

As for

Last one my Dendrology class ( Tree ID), we look at more small woody shrubs than trees. We look at European Buckthorn, Black-Haw,

well, they are woody plants too. If you cannot tell the buckthorn from the fragrent sumac, how do you do any invasive thinning compitantly? Much less bid a whole landscape trimm w/o looking like an idiot. I lost a job several years back for calling a "purple plumb" a "sand cherry". (now I look much smarter by calling them all Prunus )

For anyone working on my property, I want compitance and knowledge.

For lot clearing and ROW I would not hesitate to hire someone like Clearance.

For tree and shrub maintinance I would want Tom, Justin or Guy.

Though I would seriousely consider someone like Shane who has been in the busness for only a few years after school.

 

[Husky288XP]

Thats not the point, yes it is helpful to know Rhus aromatica or Rhamnus cathartica, but the students aren't learning the basics of SHADE TREES. If I hire a Tree Care co. I usually want work done on my trees not my Viburnum acerifolium.

If you wanna talk botanical terms JPS its on......

 

[John Paul Sanborn]

If I bid a "tree job" I allways add on to the itemized bid a few small trees and shrubs; Malus sp., Acer palmatum 'Bloodgood' (the most likely cv. in this area) Hand pruning overgrown Taxus and Juniperus.

Many times the big old 'Pfitzerana' have been shorn so often, and have pH problems being next to cement foundations that they need lots of help. Hand prune to retain some auxin production and organic ferts such as fish sauce to help the root system. Even Miracid if that is all they can do (most people have it in the garage anyways)

Maybe you walk by the Euonymus fortunei, and see the scale infestation tha tis killing it.

They could ask you for information on getting their Vitis labrusca var. concord to yeild better.

Trees, shrubs and vines...

I know a little herbacious too, though Dan can talk circles around me on that. It does not hurt to be able to talk to the client about how to handle othe parts of their landscape too.

Can you ID chinch bug or dollar spot in turf? It usually helps me.

 

[Ekka]

JPS I must admit it is very handy to know about those little shrubs and stuff.

Over here I know heaps about the little suckers and often give free advice and the customers just lap it up.

But when we were doing tree ID, there was a general feeling of disappointment when we were ID'ing species which only grew to 30' high. Then again, there's so many of those around in suburbia that it's handy to know them.

 

[Husky288XP]

Common Chinch bug, Blissus leucopterus leucopterus, attacks ryes, fescues, Kent. blue, etc. They cause yellow then often dead patches in grass because they block the conduction vessels of the grass.

I had an Entomology class too their JPS.

 

[treeseer]

Husky many colleges are slow to tune their curriculum to Arboriculture. I wasted a good bit of time and $ there too. It's up to us, and urban foresters, and company supervisors, to tell the profs and deans what students need.

I'm with you both; an understanding of the whole landscape helps sell and perform good tree care.

 

[HELSEL]

What I was talking about was a Red Oak between two houses with wires running on the other two sides.This tree is over 4 feet on the stump.Close to 100 feet high.The tree has to be removed because it died of oak wilt. Oak wilt is spreading fast in northern Michigan. I think all your post were great.


Thanx

Rick Helsel

 

[TREETX]

The first one will do a good job. The 2nd will know what he can get away with.

 

[BlackSmith]

Who would you rather cut your tree? Someone fresh out of school with all the icas,ars,and what ever else they can call them selves.Or would you rather hire someone who has done it for 30 years with zero loss? With no schooling.


Rick

30 years experience one time or 1 years experience 30 times..?

 

[HELSEL]

30 years experience one time or 1 years experience 30 times..?

We have done tree removal and trimming for 30 years. This is my full time job.So Mr.BlackSmith my question to you is would you rather have a pipefitter with 30 yrs exp or one fresh out of school? Being that you are a pipefitter!!This should be easy for you.


Rick Helsel