Friction hitches. Which one to use for different situations

[Carter Simmons]

Have you guys ever given thought to the unicender?

 

[Overwatch]

Mine is definitely a "Made in France" express sling. I even went to the length of checking with the place i bought it from. Lots of made in China stuff floating around but for climbing gear its a big no way for me!

Good call, if I wanted Chinese stuff I'd have gone to Harbor Fright. Not worthy of life support.

This is somewhat disconcerting because of the possibility that some basic components (I'm thinking of webbing on saddles, for instance) might be manufactured in third world countries and shipped to Europe or the US for assembly into more complex items.

Where I bought this from is an otherwise excellent company, but there was no mention of it having been Made in China.

 

[Matt81]

Good call, if I wanted Chinese stuff I'd have gone to Harbor Fright. Not worthy of life support.

This is somewhat disconcerting because of the possibility that some basic components (I'm thinking of webbing on saddles, for instance) might be manufactured in third world countries and shipped to Europe or the US for assembly into more complex items.

Where I bought this from is an otherwise excellent company, but there was no mention of it having been Made in China.

You have hit the nail on the head in my opinion!

I have been talking to fellow tree workers, family, friends and any one who will stand still long enough to listen about this very thing for years. Any item no matter how simple it is in construction is only as strong as it's weakest part. No point having 95% of parts of a product designed for heavy duty repetitive use when the other 5% being cheap and unreliable causes the product to break. Would you climb on a DMM hitch climber pulley every day if you knew that the pulley sides and pulley were made by DMM but the bearing for the pulley was outsourced to China? As you said a saddle. It is an integrally vital part of any climbers kit. Something like the Ergovation being able to have harness parts swapped and replaced, what if certain parts are comprised of outsourced fabrics or materials or labour such as doing vital load bearing stitching or attaching press studs? Even worse, eye to eyes used in the hitch climber setup or a lanyard adjuster. What if the sewing or splicing is outsourced to China on a brand name cord manufacturer and the end user is not told?

The Chinese are the masters at ripping off a quality product and copying it and then manufacturing the copy at a fantastic price. Differences between original and copy emerge after using! Stihl or Husky clone saws anyone?
My beef is that the quality of the materials they use is generally rubbish. For example Australian iron ore is widely regarded as very high quality. We have been making very good steel and steel products here for many years. Now we sell all our best ore to China and then buy back steel at cheaper prices than we could make it ourselves. Problem is anyone who has come into contact with it in heavy construction will tell you it varies hugely in quality, and that the range of quality goes from complete rubbish to OK. A local rugby stadium not far from me had a new northern grandstand constructed from Chinese sourced steel and it almost completely collapsed not all that long after being constructed. One of my cousins who works in metallurgy, at the same lab my dad did until he retired recently, was one of the ones sent to assess what the heck happened. Blame was being thrown at the welders and construction company then to the engineers for under speccing the structure etc etc... Turns out that it was the quality of the steel. It was of an uneven quality inside the steel and just not very good. The welds were fine and had penetrated properly but the steel was so weak it simply ripped out around the welds.

They might be able to copy a Petzl or Kong carabiner very well based on looks. Not so sure on the metal being used to make the darn thing however. How many of the Chinese biners do you think are stress tested to at least 50% of break load like many leading brands do to all production biners? Many times they just buy the stickers or labels or stamps needed for UIAA rating or EN or ANSI or whatever rating is needed for it to be sold in a certain country. If they don't get it they will put it on there anyway and to hell with safety. There was a big stink made a few years back with Chinese bicycle helmets being sold here that had the AS/NZS sticker showing it was safe for use as a head protection device on a bicycle. Independent testing showed it was a piece of unsafe junk. Turns out the Chinese manufacturer had simply bought the stickers and put them on the helmets without ANY testing being done on them whatsoever!

I can unfortunately see a day when we won't even have the choice to be able to steer clear of Chinese products like we do now, and most definitely not be able to avoid some Chinese components in the products we buy. How many things do we buy now that the origin of a certain part or fabric material is not easily know to us? I hope i am not going to be right but at the very least we are aware of what is happening and not distracted.

 

[Carter Simmons]

So what your saying is to double check to make sure it's an American product or something like that?

 

[Matt81]

So what your saying is to double check to make sure it's an American product or something like that?

Double check that it is not made in China from outsourced overseas materials. Know where a product is made and where the materials came from and you will no doubt have more confidence in it's quality.
We were talking about how in a global trade and manufacturing environment that products can turn up made where you least expect and unfortunately increasingly from China. Also that it is a real concern to be sure that all the parts that make up a product are made by a reputable company and made in a country you would expect and be comfortable with.

It is becoming very hard to know 100% that the product you are buying, that is stopping you from falling out of the tree, is going to be made by the parent company and in the country you expect. A lot of manufacturing is outsourced to "third world" countries to save on production costs and labour costs. Would you be comfortable climbing on a harness (one of the examples i gave in above post) such as the ergovation if some of the parts that comprise the harness are made in China? Or even if critical load bearing stitching is outsourced to Chinese labour? What makes it even harder is if it is not made know to the buyer! I for one want my harnesses completely made in USA from USA sourced materials and labour. Or made in Europe or Australia. Same goes for ropes, biners, slings, puleys etc etc. Not china!

 

[Carter Simmons]

Do you have any ideas what I should buy to start off with?

 

[Matt81]

Do you have any ideas what I should buy to start off with?

What sort of climbing are you looking to do? What style of climbing then suits what you will be doing? SRT, DRT or Ddrt? Harness choice can depend on the type of climbing as some are more suited to SRT and others more to Ddrt.
Also depends on what you have been show so far. If you are just starting out and have already been shown the basics in one style it makes sense to probably continue and develop what you have been taught so far.

 

[Carter Simmons]

DdRT is what I have been taught in

 

[Griff93]

Here's something good for you to look at http://www.sherrilltree.com/Learning-Center/Knots

I'd buy a decent comfortable harness, a good economical climbing rope(arborplex), several triple action carabiners, and stuff for a lanyard of your choice. Climb on a blakes or tautline for a while then start branching out. You always want to know these anyway in case you have a gear problem and need to get down without having anything but a rope.

 

[Carter Simmons]

Another good thing to know would to be able to descend on only a carabiner and your harness. It works just as well as a figure 8 but the carabiner heats up quickly so watch the speed you come down at

 

[Griff93]

With DdRT you can actually descend with no carabiner's and just a rope using a blakes. Obviously you still need to be wearing a harness. Are you using a screw gate carabiner like a figure 8?

 

[Carter Simmons]

When I come down on just a carabiner I use a screw gate

 

[Griff93]

How are you using it? Munter hitch?

 

[Carter Simmons]

I'll send a picture

 

[Matt81]

Another good thing to know would to be able to descend on only a carabiner and your harness. It works just as well as a figure 8 but the carabiner heats up quickly so watch the speed you come down at

Munter hitch right?

 

[oldboy]

I use a grigri. Not the most masterful way to go about it, but it gets the job done on the diameter climbing rope I choose to use. ^^^ Yup that's a munter, looks like the beaner gate is open.

 

[Carter Simmons]

It won't let me post a picture

 

[Matt81]

It won't let me post a picture

Is the one i pictured the one you were talking about? That's a munter hitch. I posted the picture to help cus i thought you were having problems getting a pic.

To get a picture in your post, what works for me is after i have resized the picture to what i want and saved it, i select the picture file on my pc with a left click and then right click on it and select copy, then click in the post box under the text i have just written and hold the control key and hit "v" to paste the picture. For some reason it won't let me right click and hit paste in the post box as it is greyed out, but the keyboard control + V works every time.

 

[Carter Simmons]

I'm using an iPadiPad

 

[Carter Simmons]

Glitch