i know it isnt a MS461... but the technology is now on the market.... maybe on the 461 for sure on the 661
TS 500i STIHL Cutquik® Cut-off Machine - YouTube
No, no the vibes are those things that you start to really feel after about the 4th 10+ hour day of holding onto the thing, then do that for weeks and months and then years and pretty soon you won't be asking "what vibes?", your hands, wrists and forearms will explain the definition of "vibes" to your brain quite clearly.
If you don't run a saw very much or are a lot tougher than others then carry on, its a legend of a saw.
Sam
Reality is that they probably won't be coming out with my dream saw until after my boys are old enough to run one. I will be watching them enjoy what I have been waiting for from the view of my wheel chair:msp_smile:.
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I really don't grasp what the big whoop is about the 461, the 441 has been out for years, it has been out with the Mtronic package for some time now ................. maybe one person has had problems with it ....... maybe, not sure if we ever heard back about that situation, and it is everything and a bag of chips, in modded form so much the better, and its cheaper than a 460 or 461.
I'll get a 461 for CAD reasons, but not because I actually think it will blow the socks off of the 441 Mtronic in performance or production, I sure am not holding my breath for one.
Like I have said before the 441 Mtronic is simply too nice of a saw for many chainsaw users to grasp, I really think Stihl is smart in offering a lower tech, "still has one foot in the 2-3 decades old technology" concept of the lengendary 460 because it is such a great seller, I think based on the mindset of a lot of those that use saws that won't or are too scared to run something different or new or more efficient. The biggest genius will be if Stihl has enough EPA credits to not have to offer it in a Strato form, but something like the 361, that way the Stihl salesman can tell the "oldtimer", "Yeah, its not one of them new fangled Strato saws." .................... SOLD!!!!!!!
That alone will sell countless millions more of them, LOL.
Then, if they will keep the old style rubber mounts on the "new" 461, that will sell even more, as here on Arboristsite, I have had to read over the years of countless users that can't seem to figure out where the bar is on a steel spring'd 441, its like they mount the bar on the side of the 441, then start the saw and whoosh, the bar disappears, they can't figure out where the tip is and something about they can't feel the bar or the "cut", NO $NIT!!!!! Can you imagine being a Stihl engineer and offering some totally smooth AV system and letting some yahoo run it and he says, " I can't feel the Bar or the Cut." and the Stihl Engineer, thinks to himself, "Great, I've hit a home run here, we'll sell millions, I'll get a promotion." Then the test group asks for the rubber mounted 460 back so that they can feel the vibes, LOL.
If you think about it, the marketing or thinking behind the 461 might be similar to say the proven Harley motorcycle profits, offer technology that is decades old and millions and millions of ignorant consumers will buy it because their dad or grandpa used one, efficiency or comfort be dammed. I applaud, Stihl for this, as it will allow them to keep profitable and the overall saw lineup and proven service at a top level rate, and this I do care about greatly.
Sam
If Stihl release a 461 strato without the M-Tronic attached then they are pretty well wasting their time as the 441C will tan it's butt. ......
If Stihl release a 461 strato without the M-Tronic attached then they are pretty well wasting their time as the 441C will tan it's butt.
As many would know I owned a strato MS261 which I sold then bought a 241C M-Tronic which has a capacity of around 7.6cc less (around 15% less capacity). The difference in performance is negligible between the two with a MASSIVE edge in throttle response to the 241C. I think it would be safe to assume that a 70cc M-Tronic saw will pump a strato 76.5cc saw as that is only around a 9% capacity difference for the M-Tronic to cover. That isn't even taking into account fuel economy or broader power curve/usability.
I'm no Stihl fanboy but I tell you what, I'm all over this M-Tronic (and X-Torq) technology like a fat kid on a cupcake. It makes a bigger difference to a saw's performance than the naysayers give it credit for. Imagine laying into a 42.6cc saw and hearing it just load up and keep going instead of bogging down which is what you'd expect it to do. In fact I find it amusing just to push it harder in the cut to see how much more torque it can produce
Now if Stihl can just get a 70cc+ M-Tronic saw that balances like a Husky...
Ok so seriously the 241 and 261 are that close in performance??? I'm still trying to figure out which saw to go with in the 40-50cc range and figure I might as well sit things out for a while until the new Huskys are release and Stihl figures out what their doing with their small saw lineup.
Yeah they are. I was even running a 20" Tsumura on my MS261 (stock) with 3/8" semi chisel and I know for sure the little 241C wouldn't do that but anything 18" or under with .325" and I'd take the 241C anyday. A few guys that have bought one have even chosen the 3/8"LP option and been very happy. The biggest issue I had with the 261 was sluggish throttle response and the fact that until I pulled the H limiter and richened it up it was an absolute slug. The 241C is a little Ferrari out the box.
I've seen the video and it looks impressive, just didn't know they would be that close. I didn't realize you are running .325 though, I thought it was 3/8LP.
Yeah they are. I was even running a 20" Tsumura on my MS261 (stock) with 3/8" semi chisel and I know for sure the little 241C wouldn't do that but anything 18" or under with .325" and I'd take the 241C anyday. A few guys that have bought one have even chosen the 3/8"LP option and been very happy. The biggest issue I had with the 261 was sluggish throttle response and the fact that until I pulled the H limiter and richened it up it was an absolute slug. The 241C is a little Ferrari out the box.
A sluggish throttle response is a major letdown on any saw, that is one of the reasons I mostly choose the Huskys, except for the German made MS361, even though the Huskys mostly cost at least 50% more than the comparable Stihls here....
I agree Niko. It's all good to talk about strato and torque etc but throttle response is one reason I favour the Huskys and Dolmars in larger saws as they tend to get up and down quicker whereas Stihl's larger non M-Tronic are more like a tractor (as a rule). I mean I kept my basic "homeowner" Husky 353 in favour of my MS261 despite it having an outboard clutch, older design, and a poorer filter (amongst other things). In smaller saws throttle response is more important than torque. As the saw gets larger this becomes the opposite although I still favour the Husky and Dolmar's faster throttle response over the MS660's etc.
I mostly agree, but not about Dolmars having a good throttle response, quite the opposite with my 5100S, despite I richened the "L" quite a bit - it just doesn't want to rev up anywhere close to my NE346xp....
It wasn't a big surprice to me, but it may be to some others - and the 346 also was faster in the cut than the 5100S (that is rated at more power) with .325x7, .325x8 and 3/8x7, with new Oregon LP chain, filed once, in 7" and 11" birch (16" bars). The differences wasn't large though, but the 346xp with .325x7 was fastest in both wood sizes. No surprice there, at least not to me - but the specs disagee! :msp_smile:
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