Triple or double axle dump trailer

[kcurbanloggers]

Hey all. Quick question for you. I am in the market for a 16ft gooseneck dump trailer with around 20k gvwr. We load these machines with mini skids, so the deck over models with tandem duals are not a good option for us. It has to be a low pro model. Most of those trailers have 3 7k axles but there are a few companies that make them with dual 10k axles. Everything I have read on line says that tandem duals are better than triples, but what about single dual axles? The single dual set ups are way more expensive -- Diamond C sells a dual axle gooseneck with 10k singles for close to 27k, whereas suretrac sells a triple axle for 17k. Both units appear similar in quality and build. What are your thoughts on these two configurations? I would not be super excited about constantly replacing tires, but you can replace a lot of tires for 10k... How much to you realistically give up in terms of maneuverability with a triple axle? Any experience you can share is appreciated.

 

[Jhenderson]

More axles = more $$$ for maintenance ( brakes, bearings , tires, springs) + a triple axle is awful in tight spots and scrubs hard in turns. Try backing a loaded one up in anything but a straight line.
I’ve got a PJ GN dump with 8K axles. Did my first brake job this summer after 10 years of regular use. 8K brakes are 12x3-1/2 with oil bath hubs. . 7K axles have 12x2 brakes. It’s not hard to figure out why mine lasted like they did. I’ve still got 3 original tires too. They’re 17.5 instead of 16 inch wheels. 17.5 tires wear like iron and the ones on my trailer are regroovable. I was ready to trade up to a new trailer with 10K dexters but the price increase from Oct 2020 ( couldn’t get one built, covid) to April 2021 was ridiculous, so I sandblasted and painted as well as the brake job. That cost me less than the price increase alone.

 

[Sandhill Crane]

I have a 16' Ultimate Dump, bumper pull. GVWR is 15,400 with 7k axles.
I use it for firewood deliveries, and my son has used it for renting equipment for some home projects.
Lots of tire scrub in not even that tight of spot. I've left tire marks on several driveways, and grooved a few decretive white stone, and gravel ones. I've wondered more than once if the tire would come off the rim on a couple concrete driveways.
I considered 8k axles because of the heavier tires/brakes. However, the tire upgrade was just a heavier China tire, and I had read to stay away from oil bath hubs due to leaky seals. I figured backing in tight spots would not help the seals, and I don't want to get oil on customers driveways. 8k axles/tires/brakes were a $2k option. Gooseneck was about $1,800 at the time. However if your not in tight spots, oil bath hubs would probably not be a problem.
Low Pro models: Mine is 82" wide inside the high sided box. Very tight to tie stuff down. Mini skid might not be too bad. I do however love the hydraulic tailgate for loading, and especially unloading equipment. And the mesh cover is on a hoop, quick and easy, I use it every time, and that's the point.
I recently saw "Dirt Monkey's" YouTube on a flex neck gooseneck trailer at a trailer trade show. He mentioned a video coming up on the Ultimate Dump.
I wanted 16' and high sides. I was going to order a Sure Track and the dealer couldn't give me a price due to (Covid) slowdowns, steel pricing and transportation cost increases six months out. I ordered the Ultimate Dump, no options, and it came fully loaded. The hydraulic jack was something I did not need, but was standard on the trailer. I love it now. I would have liked the telescopic hoist, not an option because of jack location. However, the jack being at the back of the tongue/front of box, means the tongue area is wide open, no tailgate interference. I think Diamond C might be better designed with channel frame vs box tube frame, and telescopic hoist option. Have not had a problem with scissor hoist however.
My trailer is a year old. Paint is powder coat. I've kept the chips touched up, but have one spot on inside of tailgate that began to peal. I sprayed it with WD 40.
I wish I had ordered the gooseneck version as there is 850 pounds tongue weight empty. I've never backed a gooseneck, run a tonneau cover, and the optional cost consideration overrode that choice at the time. I just have to be mindful of where the load is. I have weighed two cord loads, with combined gvw of 20,500. It's a good trailer for my use. Quite noisy sometimes, as it has fold down sides, which I've yet to drop down.
Edit: Another axle consideration. I found what I could on YouTube. Some guys running under cdl bought trailers optioned up. Blew brakes, and during the repair found the axle option didn't happen, just wheel and tires. Bought 8k brake parts and they didn't fit, 7k did.
Also these guys found on other trailers they had with 8k axles, that parts were hard to get, and very expensive. 7k parts are available most anywhere. Obviously that will change eventually, but you might want to order and stock them if your running a trailer for business.

 

[Jhenderson]

The thought that oil bath axles are prone to leaking is ludicrous. Ever even seen an oil bath barrier type seal? What would backing in a tight spot have to do with axle seals. How many heavy truck axles have you ever seen with leaking axle seals? Everything over a 1/2 ton pickup has oil bath rear bearings. If they were prone to leaking you’d be leaving oil under the truck you tow your trailer with.
As for heavier axles costing more? Yup. Worth every dime. Chinese tires? Yup, just like on your trailer. Never mind the name on the sidewall, read the country of origin. Sailun tires are the highest rated heavy trailer tires on the market right now. If you read the trailer forums you’d see people getting rid of their Michelin trailer tires for Sailun because they’ve been shedding their tread in less than a year and damaging the trailer in the process.
You’ll be lucky to get 1/3 the miles out of your brakes that I did.How do I know? I started out in 1992 with a 10K dump trailer. Then went to a 14K. Finally for the last 11 years I’ve run my present 18, 500lb GN dump. Axle parts cost more but you buy fewer of them. Business 101.

 

[kcurbanloggers]

The thought that oil bath axles are prone to leaking is ludicrous. Ever even seen an oil bath barrier type seal? What would backing in a tight spot have to do with axle seals. How many heavy truck axles have you ever seen with leaking axle seals? Everything over a 1/2 ton pickup has oil bath rear bearings. If they were prone to leaking you’d be leaving oil under the truck you tow your trailer with.
As for heavier axles costing more? Yup. Worth every dime. Chinese tires? Yup, just like on your trailer. Never mind the name on the sidewall, read the country of origin. Sailun tires are the highest rated heavy trailer tires on the market right now. If you read the trailer forums you’d see people getting rid of their Michelin trailer tires for Sailun because they’ve been shedding their tread in less than a year and damaging the trailer in the process.
You’ll be lucky to get 1/3 the miles out of your brakes that I did. How do I know? I started out in 1992 with a 10K dump trailer. Then went to a 14K. Finally for the last 11 years I’ve run my present 18, 500lb GN dump. Axle parts cost more but you buy fewer of them. Business 101

How has your experience been with the PJ? I read somewhere that PJ has a lot of poor welds, but who knows. They are definitely priced more competitively than Diamond C, which is the only other manufacturer that will sell the 20k GVWR double axle. We use these trailers hard and need them to stand up to some tough abuse. It sounds like if at all possible, a twin axle would be a better way to go.

 

[Ryan'smilling]

How has your experience been with the PJ? I read somewhere that PJ has a lot of poor welds, but who knows. They are definitely priced more competitively than Diamond C, which is the only other manufacturer that will sell the 20k GVWR double axle. We use these trailers hard and need them to stand up to some tough abuse. It sounds like if at all possible, a twin axle would be a better way to go.

I owned a PJ equipment trailer and I'll never repeat that mistake. I think it was five years old when I bought it and the powder coat was coming off in sheets by the time I was selling it two years later. Couldn't believe how rusty that thing was. The ABU trailer I replaced it with is almost twenty years older and looks way way better.

 

[Jhenderson]

The op asked about welds, not paint. Did any of your welds fail? They no longer powder coat, but primer is an option when it should be standard. My powder coat peeled as well. That’s why I sandblasted. I’ve had no welds fail but mine was built 11 years ago and things change so I can’t swear to quality. You probably should go to a dealer and look closely. I have looked at Diamond C and their quality is second to none. So is their price. When I as looking they were about $5-6K more than PJ.

 

[Ian178]

Have you thought about just buying a dump truck? You have to get a cdl, but 20 to 30k goes pretty far on a truck. Just saying.

 

[JustPlainJeff]

I can't comment on dual vs. triple axle trailers, as I've only had dual axle. But you couldn't give me a P J any longer. Had a few of them, as mentioned, ****** welds, splatter everywhere etc.....I've got Diamond C now, and for me it's been the best trailer brand I've owned.

 

[kcurbanloggers]

Have you thought about just buying a dump truck? You have to get a cdl, but 20 to 30k goes pretty far on a truck. Just saying.

I have a cdl. A dump truck would be great but we load these things with a mini skid. Full size skids are way too hard on lawns and I seriously doubt I could find a dump truck that was low enough to load with these machines.

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[kcurbanloggers]

I can't comment on dual vs. triple axle trailers, as I've only had dual axle. But you couldn't give me a P J any longer. Had a few of them, as mentioned, ****** welds, splatter everywhere etc.....I've got Diamond C now, and for me it's been the best trailer brand I've owned.

I wish we could do a diamond c but they are an an extra 10k. Even if it is way better, its difficult to justify the expense. I'm not looking to spend near 30k for a 16ft dump when I bought a 12ft unit from sure Trac for 7k that has been excellent. It took five years of some nasty abuse before More than 3x the price for 25% more capacity just doesn't fit the budget for us.

I may be avoiding the pj and just having to go with the 3 axle. We're also pulling it with a little less truck than we should... From what I understand 3 axles are more forgiving if the truck is on the lighter side.


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[JustPlainJeff]

I wish we could do a diamond c but they are an an extra 10k. Even if it is way better, its difficult to justify the expense.


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I completely get this. I paid too much (in comparison to other brands) for my newest trailer too. I paid more than for other brands, but I didn't have to pay for the two or three prices increases that have recently come about, because I ordered mine prior to those going into effect.

 

[Sandhill Crane]

If I was to do it over again I'd go with a gooseneck.
My 16' high sided, bumper pull, dump has 800 pounds of tongue weight and 100 pounds of lift on the steer axle when empty.

 

[pdqdl]

I don't have a dump trailer, but I do have a triple axle trailer (flatbed) with 7k axles. I have yet to have problems with skidding the tires in tight turns, but is certainly more prominent than on a dual axle. I thought when I bought it that it would be a problem, but it hasn't really bothered me. Of course, it is also longer than a 16' dump trailer, so the trailer just doesn't go into as tight an area as a shorter trailer might.

It is also a pintle hitch, instead of goose-neck. From my perspective, I wouldn't want a goose-neck trailer. They pretty much turn your truck into a tractor, as you can no longer use the bed of your truck for as much material. It helps that I am towing the trailer with small dump-bed Fords, rather than an undersized pickup truck. A pintle hitch trailer also has a much shorter turning radius when backing, although some folks have more trouble driving them backwards than the goose-neck variety. They don't track as well behind the truck, and they are more sensitive to load balance considerations.

I'm pretty certain that using a small dump truck with a pintle hitch dump bed will afford you a great deal more storage & transport room.

 

[Jhenderson]

Commenting on subjects you have no real knowledge of seems to be a habit of yours. Your ignorance of modern GN hitches is obvious.

 

[pdqdl]

Says the guy that admits he has no triple axle trailers. Who probably never owned a pintle hitch, either, except on his chipper. Ever wonder why most of them use a pintle hitch?

"modern" goosenecks? They've been around forever.

 

[Jhenderson]

What does a triple axle have to do with your lack of knowledge about GN hitches?
GN hitches haven’t been permanent for decades. It takes less than one minute to remove or turn over the ball and tie downs to return your truck bed to a flat surface.
I used to be able to ignore your stupidity but since the morons who bought this site made you a moderator that’s become impossible. I suggest you find a way to get your posts hidden from those of us have tired of your pedantic, yet uninformed posts lest you expose yourself for what you are.

 

[Ryan'smilling]

What does a triple axle have to do with your lack of knowledge about GN hitches?
GN hitches haven’t been permanent for decades. It takes less than one minute to remove or turn over the ball and tie downs to return your truck bed to a flat surface.
I used to be able to ignore your stupidity but since the morons who bought this site made you a moderator that’s become impossible. I suggest you find a way to get your posts hidden from those of us have tired of your pedantic, yet uninformed posts lest you expose yourself for what you are.

Reading between the lines here, I think our good man meant that when towing a gooseneck, you can't fully use the bed of the truck, and there's really no way around that. You can carry sheets of Plywood or other large items in the bed if you're pulling a bumper pull trailer. Can't do that with a gooseneck. Don't get me wrong, I'll stick with gooseneck trailers myself when I can because of the comfort going down the road, but there are pros and cons to each option.

 

[pdqdl]

Thank you.
Kindly grind your axe elsewhere JH.

How 'bout you show me a picture of your truck carrying a load of firewood in the bed while you are towing your GN trailer. HMMM?

 

[Jhenderson]

Why would I carry firewood in the bed when I’m grossing 29K? If I did choose to do so how much space would I loose to a 5 inch round tube ? Just to refresh your limited knowledge, the actual gn itself is higher than the bed so it doesn’t interfere with anything below the rails. So much for “ You cannot use the bed of your truck for as much material”.
Ps. I started out using a lunette over 30 years ago. It didn’t take long for me to figure out there were much better options for towing heavy on road. I guess some of us learn faster than others.