Aspen Fuel?

[Bob Wright]

I just would like something that burns clean.

A big ole electric motor on that bar will be as clean as you can get ...Bob

 

[betterbuilt]

A big ole electric motor on that bar will be as clean as you can get ...Bob

I can imagine it might be hard to get a three phase generator to the log. There's no power where most of my logs are. I'm thinking a lawnmower engine is my best bet.

 

[kirkeg]

NO.
There are two domestic sources for good fuel for our O.P.E. First is the most known, TruFuel. It's very good.stuff, but yhe per gallon price ($20-$25) may be cost prohibitive. The second is SEF (small engine fuel) made by VP racing fuels. SEF can be purchased in larger quantities, up to 54 gallon drums. I personally have no experience with SEF but VP has a good reputation in the racing communities.

I spend a few days a month milling with a CSM for an average of 4 hours. I go through around 3 gallons of fuel. My real problem with the stuff we are using is that it doesn't burn to clean and I end up breathing it all day. That said, I've heard that Aspen2t burns cleaner. I wouldn't know because its not available in the US.

I guess the price per gallon thing isn't my problem. I just would like something that burns clean. Does the Trufuel or the SEF burn clean?

Hey joe912 - What is O.P.E.? I wonder the same thing as betterbuilt above. Do these fuels burn as clean as the Aspen fuels?

 

[kirkeg]

Well the first email to return i'm assuming is from Aspen Canada but the reply came from Cesco Marketing Inc.?

here is the reply:

Hello:
Aspen fuel is not presently available in the USA.
It cannot be shipped via parcel post as it is gasoline and
of course is classed as dangerous goods.
In Canada we are only selling it in British Columbia so far.
Mike

I asked when it may be available but there was no reply to that...

obviously standard parcel/post is not going to ship fuels but thought id ask for any possible alternatives i may not be aware of...

 

[kirkeg]

If you managed to find aspen you would need to also find aspen two stroke oil so that you could richen the mix.

I've experimented with adding 16oz to 32oz of Coleman Camp Fuel to each gallon of 100LL.

The trouble with such mixing is that Coleman fuel seems to vary from 55 octane to 70 octane depending on the batch, and on depending on who you ask.

Mikefunaro - the oil in aspen 2 is simply high quality full synthetic 2 stroke oil. Probably biodegradeable - perhaps like stihl ultra?

Eccentric - so coleman fuel (white gas) can be run in chainsaws? wow i did'nt think of that. pretty cool. I know white gas is highly refined to burn clean for stove application. I wonder if you could run it straight (w/ 2 stroke oil of course)? How clean burning is it in a saw? Would the variable octane rating make much difference?

 

[joe912]

Hey joe912 - What is O.P.E.? I wonder the same thing as betterbuilt above. Do these fuels burn as clean as the Aspen fuels?

O.P.E. = outdoor power equipment

I am currently using TruFuel50 and I'm quite happy with it. It's not noxious at all. Doesn't smell like roses and strawberries, but I don't find it offensive either.

As I said before, I have no experience with VP SEF94, but I would like to because of the availability of larger quantities. But getting it shipped to Alaska with the hazmat fees may be an issue. :censored::censored: and :censored:

 

[kirkeg]

O.P.E. = outdoor power equipment

I am currently using TruFuel50 and I'm quite happy with it. It's not noxious at all. Doesn't smell like roses and strawberries, but I don't find it offensive either.

As I said before, I have no experience with VP SEF94, but I would like to because of the availability of larger quantities. But getting it shipped to Alaska with the hazmat fees may be an issue. :censored::censored: and :censored:

joe912 - I will have to check out these fuel alternatives myself (trufuel50 and VP sef94). Thanks

Eccentric -
As far as the coleman fuel goes, well, I've done some searching here and the Octane rating seems to be the only issue w/ it. I hear it burns clean, there are no additives, and it's 50% alkylates.

So what could i add to coleman fuel (besides pump gas and AV fuel) to get the octane rating up higher? Would off the shelf octane boost work?

 

[Zombiechopper]

Well the first email to return i'm assuming is from Aspen Canada but the reply came from Cesco Marketing Inc.?

here is the reply:

Hello:
Aspen fuel is not presently available in the USA.
It cannot be shipped via parcel post as it is gasoline and
of course is classed as dangerous goods.
In Canada we are only selling it in British Columbia so far.
Mike

I asked when it may be available but there was no reply to that...

obviously standard parcel/post is not going to ship fuels but thought id ask for any possible alternatives i may not be aware of...

I bought some in Alberta two months ago

 

[Eccentric]

Mikefunaro - the oil in aspen 2 is simply high quality full synthetic 2 stroke oil. Probably biodegradeable - perhaps like stihl ultra?

Eccentric - so coleman fuel (white gas) can be run in chainsaws? wow i did'nt think of that. pretty cool. I know white gas is highly refined to burn clean for stove application. I wonder if you could run it straight (w/ 2 stroke oil of course)? How clean burning is it in a saw? Would the variable octane rating make much difference?

Guys have ran Coleman Camp Fuel straight (mixed with oil of course) in RC cars, boats, and helicoptors powered by variants of the Zenoah 23 and 26cc industrial engines for years without issue. They mostly do it for the lack of ethanol, and for the fact that it doesn't stink and they can store their cars/helis/boats indoors without pissing off the wife...:hmm3grin2orange:

joe912 - I will have to check out these fuel alternatives myself (trufuel50 and VP sef94). Thanks

Eccentric -
As far as the coleman fuel goes, well, I've done some searching here and the Octane rating seems to be the only issue w/ it. I hear it burns clean, there are no additives, and it's 50% alkylates.

So what could i add to coleman fuel (besides pump gas and AV fuel) to get the octane rating up higher? Would off the shelf octane boost work?

I can't see why off the shelf octane booster wouldn't work. Blenzol makes one that is combined with castor oil if I remember right. Gotta check their website again as it's been a while. That product might be the ticket.

 

[nvrs]

I have a couple of quarts of the 40-Fuel. RandyMac gave them to me to try. Haven't ran it yet. Wish it cost half the price.............. as then I'd be more likely to run it all the time. I don't go through that much 2-stroke gas anymore since I stopped riding dirt bikes much.

Is this the "40-fuel" your referring to?

if so, they have it at walmart... i saw 2 varieties the other day when i was in there... they had 40-fuel and 50-fuel... both were on clearance for $3.50 per qt...

 

[Eccentric]

Is this the "40-fuel" your referring to?

if so, they have it at walmart... i saw 2 varieties the other day when i was in there... they had 40-fuel and 50-fuel... both were on clearance for $3.50 per qt...

That's the stuff. Holy Crap that's cheap!!! Better get my buttocks to Wallyworld and see if any is left. I didnt' think they'd sell it in Ca..............but you're obviously near me. Grab some and try it. I'm going to grab a case or two to throw on the shelf if possible. Thanks for the heads up!

 

[kirkeg]

Is this the "40-fuel" your referring to?

if so, they have it at walmart... i saw 2 varieties the other day when i was in there... they had 40-fuel and 50-fuel... both were on clearance for $3.50 per qt...

Is that an akylate fuel? Or is it just premixed pump gas w/ stabilizer in it?

 

[kirkeg]

Well - no reply from AA oil in the UK. Nor has there been a reply from Mike Acres. I'm not going to hold my breath....

I might try the white gas + octane boost. Anyone know how much boost to add or how to tell the octane level of a fuel?

:monkey: kirkeg NO BURN UP SAW!

 

[1steve]

So what could i add to coleman fuel (besides pump gas and AV fuel) to get the octane rating up higher? Would off the shelf octane boost work?[/QUOTE]

As far as off the shelf octane boosters most have methanol and t-butyl alcohol so your adding what you dont want to start with.

 

[Eccentric]

Is that an akylate fuel? Or is it just premixed pump gas w/ stabilizer in it?

It's 92 octane ethanol-free gasoline with synthetic 2-stroke oil and fuel stabilizer. The big appeal is that it's the only convenient/local way to get ethanol-free gas here. Today I cleaned off the clearance shelf at Wally-World. Payed $2.50/can for 15 cans...

Buying 100LL avgas is getting to be more dificult, at least in my area. They've moved the 'perimeter' outside the station that sells avgas at the airport. Gotta get 'on the grounds' before getting to the station now. Homeland Security stuff...

Well - no reply from AA oil in the UK. Nor has there been a reply from Mike Acres. I'm not going to hold my breath....

I might try the white gas + octane boost. Anyone know how much boost to add or how to tell the octane level of a fuel?

:monkey: kirkeg NO BURN UP SAW!

I think your best bet would be to buy avgas (if available for you) or race gas (make sure it's not oxygenated street-legal fuel, or you're just buying expensive ethanol-gas), and then bring the ocane level down with camp fuel. Since camp fuel is already around $10/gallon, you'd most likely be out more money if you octane-boosted camp fuel instead of 'octane-lowering' avgas or race gas.

You'd have to look at the specs/cost of your localy available octane booster products (to figure how much it'd cost to raise a gallon of 55 octane fuel to your target level) to see for certain how much it'd cost to go that route. Plus there's the undersireable aspect of adding alcohol (contained in the octane-booster) to fuel that you're trying to keep alcohol-free (as stated above).

If you find out what octane level you'll be starting with (such as 100 for avgas, or 105, 112, etc for race gas) then we can figure out how much camp fuel you'll need.

With 100LL avgas you only need 16oz of camp fuel per gallon of gas to end up with 144oz of 94 octane fuel. Divide 144 by the ratio of premix you want to come up with the needed 2-stroke oil. For 50/1 you'd need 2.9oz of oil. Double the numbers to end up with a bit over 2-1/4 gallons of total mix.

With 112 octane race gas you'd need to add approximately 1/3 gallon (43oz) of camp fuel to one gallon of race gas to get 171oz of 93 octane fuel. You'd then need to mix in 3.4oz of oil for 50/1 mix. Double the numbers for almost 2-3/4 gallons of total mix.


Find out what's the cheapest, lowest-octane non-oxygenated (no ethanol) gas you can get in your area (probably avgas, but you might be forced to run race gas). Let me know what you find, and I can figure out how much camp fuel you'll need to mix in to hit a target octane level. If you can get non-oxygenated "ag gas" then you're a lucky soul, and you need not buy any camp fuel...

 

[SawTroll]

...... Makes it a real pain if you wanted to switch back and forth from pump gas

That is not advicable anyway - alkylate fuel really shouldn't be used in engines that has been run some on mixed pump fuel earlier, as it will loosed up residue from that mix, and that may cause problems.

Basically, either you use it all the time, or not at all!

I have broken that "rule" with no ill effects though........

 

[BlueRidgeMark]

Buying 100LL avgas is getting to be more dificult, at least in my area. They've moved the 'perimeter' outside the station that sells avgas at the airport. Gotta get 'on the grounds' before getting to the station now. Homeland Security stuff...

Well, that and the fact that it's illegal to use av gas in anything other than an airplane. Count on it getting MUCH harder to get av gas. Plan for something else, now.




There really IS an easy solution to all of this, though.


Buy premium at your local gas station, use a good quality oil, and stop worrying about it.

For every person out there scrambling around trying to find some way to run the perfect fuel in their saws, there are a thousand just using the locally available premium gas and good oil, and having NO trouble at all.

 

[Eccentric]

Your Mileage May Vary....

Well, that and the fact that it's illegal to use av gas in anything other than an airplane. Count on it getting MUCH harder to get av gas. Plan for something else, now.




There really IS an easy solution to all of this, though.


Buy premium at your local gas station, use a good quality oil, and stop worrying about it.

For every person out there scrambling around trying to find some way to run the perfect fuel in their saws, there are a thousand just using the locally available premium gas and good oil, and having NO trouble at all.

Not here it isn't. It IS illegal to use avgas in an on-highway vehicle (for tax and emissions control reasons) however. I am "planning for something else" however. Trying to get ag gas localy at a decent price (I have a rancher friend who orders thousands of gallons of ag fuel at a stretch). I've got a stash of 40Fuel that's staying on the shelf for now. Working on the local VP guy about getting SEF94 for less than its weight in gold. Have race gas available localy if every other option dries up...

I'm glad running ethanol oxygenated fuel works for you and the other 999 people that offset me. Buying "premium" doesn't mitigate the issues with ethanol either BTW. Neither does adding a bit of stabilizer, or other magic formula (as I've seen shilled at auto parts stores, and the HD). I've seen too much equiment damaged IN MY AREA from "fresh" ethanol-oxygenated gasoline for me to "stop worrying about it".

The damage to equipment that I've personaly seen is NOT limited to softened fuel lines and ruined diaphragms. I don't run enough 2-stroke fuel in a year for me to sweat the cost difference between ethanol-oxygenated pump gas and my "perfect fuel". Also, for me the expense and scarcety of pistons and cylinders for my 'vintage' saws outweighs the cost differential as well. That IS my solution to all of this...

If YOU want to run E10, E15, E20, or E85 (or you make moonshine behind the shed and fuel yer saws with it), then knock yourself out. Want to be the voice reason here.............convincing folks that theres' no harm in E10, E15, or whatever.............then go find one of the many "ethanol-gas?" debate threads here to spread your wisdom in. This is a pump gas alternative thread. Leave us to "scramble to run the perfect fuel in our saws", and "stop worrying about it"...

Do you have ethanol-free pump gas in Va? Not trying to be a smartass........................just wondering if that's where our "issue" lies. Here in Ca we have NO choice but to run ethanol-oxygenated gas if we buy localy at the pump...

 

[L.R.]

All my saws are run exclusively on Aspen - it keeps what it promise, very user friendly!

I use it as well in all (two) of mine. I don't think I've walked into a chainsaw store in the last few years that didn't sell Aspen.

I agree, it does seem to burn cleaner, we have run some mopeds on it as well. I think it's worth the extra cash.

 

[SawTroll]

I use it as well in all (two) of mine. I don't think I've walked into a chainsaw store in the last few years that didn't sell Aspen.

I agree, it does seem to burn cleaner, we have run some mopeds on it as well. I think it's worth the extra cash.

The only dealers that doesn't stock it around here are the pure Stihl ones - but they finally have their own variant, called "Moto-mix". The problem with that one is that it smells really bad when burning - but it works just as well, with the same carb settings. I bought one 5l can to try it, and will not buy more! The dealer that sold it to me must have found out as well, as by now he stocks Aspen only, and has started to sell Huskys as well as Stihls!

He also is the last surviving good Stihl dealer around here, the others don't service saws.......