Bye Bye 540xp

[Farmer Johns Cousin]

I just want to say one thing concerning ethanol. It is a very good fuel when used correctly. Ethanol fuel has been widely embraced in drag racing circles as a great and 'economical' fuel for making horsepower. E-10 pump gas is actually 105 octane. I use it in my race car, atv's and all my power equipment with great success.

All the problems people have related to ethanol has more to do with how they store the fuel and equipment and less to do with the fuel itself. Store your fuel and equipment someplace Climate Controlled {I.E. not in the tool shed over on the wet side of the property or in the box trailer that gets to be 130* fahrenheit inside on average sunny days} and all your fuel problems will disappear..

 

[Chris-PA]

I just want to say one thing concerning ethanol. It is a very good fuel when used correctly. Ethanol fuel has been widely embraced in drag racing circle as a great and 'economical' fuel for making horsepower. E-10 pump gas is actually 105 octane. I use it in my race car, atv's and all my power equipment with great success.

All the problems people have related to ethanol has more to do with how they store the fuel and equipment and less to do with the fuel itself. Store your fuel and equipment someplace Climate Controlled {I.E. not in the tool shed over on the wet side of the property or in the box trailer that get to be 130* fahrenheit inside} and all your fuel problems will disappear..

The only problems I have with ethanol in fuel are:

1. It's primarily a scam to funnel public money to well connected big ag, as it takes more fossil fuel energy to make than it returns.

2. E10 vapor locks much more easily than either straight gasoline or straight ethanol.

Neither of these issues are addressed by storing it in a climate controlled place, especially since I don't have one other than the house.

 

[Farmer Johns Cousin]

The only problems I have with ethanol in fuel are:

1. It's primarily a scam to funnel public money to well connected big ag, as it takes more fossil fuel energy to make than it returns.

2. E10 vapor locks much more easily than either straight gasoline or straight ethanol.

Neither of these issues are addressed by storing it in a climate controlled place, especially since I don't have one other than the house.

Your first statement is not entirely the whole story. The ethanol is used to boost octane. The MTBE that was being used prior to ethanol to boost octane levels was showing up in the water table just like the lead that was used even prior to that....

 

[NWCoaster]

The only problems I have with ethanol in fuel are:

1. It's primarily a scam to funnel public money to well connected big ag, as it takes more fossil fuel energy to make than it returns.

2. E10 vapor locks much more easily than either straight gasoline or straight ethanol.

Neither of these issues are addressed by storing it in a climate controlled place, especially since I don't have one other than the house.

Not sure about the tinfoil hat theories, but ethanol is an oxegenate when used in gasoline blending and is high octane. There are components used in gasoline that have a WAY higher vapor pressure than ethanol.... its not even close , especially in winter blends. Point3, it just needs to be in an airtight container that does not breath with the daily cycles of temperature. Never had any problem with ethanol it you know what can cause potential problems.
As a side note pertaining to the origional post.... I personally would never own a saw that had issues restarting once warm..... totally unacceptable to me, I don't care what brand it is.

 

[GeorgiaVol]

Since I was informed of the possible detrimental effects of ethanol fuels in 2 cycle engines, I have switch to ethanol free gasoline for all of my 2 cycle equipment. It is not hard to find a station that sells it around here. Ever since I have changed over, I have had zero fuel issues with my equipment in regards to fuel lines or bad gas. Before I switched, I changed fuel lines in my trimmer every 2 Or 3 years, had to change carbs in my auger, threw out 2 other trimmers that refused to start, and had to rebuild 2 saw's fuel systems. So at least in the hot and humid south, ethanol is pretty bad for 2 cycle equipment in my experience.

 

[Farmer Johns Cousin]

Not sure about the tinfoil hat theories, but ethanol is an oxegenate when used in gasoline blending and is high octane. There are components used in gasoline that have a WAY higher vapor pressure than ethanol.... its not even close , especially in winter blends. Point3, it just needs to be in an airtight container that does not breath with the daily cycles of temperature. Never had any problem with ethanol it you know what can cause potential problems.
As a side note pertaining to the origional post.... I personally would never own a saw that had issues restarting once warm..... totally unacceptable to me, I don't care what brand it is.

I will say that I purchased a fully modded 550xp from wicked work saws in Tennessee back in march. And so far it has be en flawless and little sucker really rips. I've enjoyed it so much this passed summer that just today I purchased a 562xp. So I am firmly into the autotune camp for better or worse with you guys too. So I guess time will tell....

 

[Chris-PA]

Your first statement is not entirely the whole story. The ethanol is used to boost octane. The MTBE that was being used prior to ethanol to boost octane levels was showing up in the water table just like the lead that was used even prior to that....

Not sure about the tinfoil hat theories, but ethanol is an oxegenate when used in gasoline blending and is high octane. There are components used in gasoline that have a WAY higher vapor pressure than ethanol.... its not even close , especially in winter blends. Point3, it just needs to be in an airtight container that does not breath with the daily cycles of temperature. Never had any problem with ethanol it you know what can cause potential problems.

Oxygenates and octane boosters are really two different things. Oxygenates were introduced on the dumb idea that cars that were improperly tuned were too rich, and adding an oxygenate would lean them out. Of course most cars had an O2 sensor and feedback system, so it just made them use more fuel, and if they happened to already be too lean it made them leaner, leading to misfires and more unburned fuel HC emissions.

Also 2-stroke chainsaws don't need higher octane.

I actually have used nothing but E10 from the local station for years and have had no running issues but vapor lock, which has become a real PITA every summer.

"Volatility and distillation
Ethanol forms azeotropes with hydrocarbons of gasoline, which impacts volatility. In particular, the vapor pressure and distillation characteristics of ethanol/gasoline blends are non-linear. Blending vapor pressures for alcohols are significantly higher than their nominal vapor pressures. Vapor pressure of neat ethanol is low at only 16 kPa (Owen and Coley 1995). When ethanol is added into gasoline, vapor pressure increases with blending ratios of 5-10%, but then gradually declines (Figures). With ethanol content of some 30-50%, vapor pressure is at the same level as for gasoline without oxygenates (Environment Australia 2002, Furey 1985).


Vapor pressure of blends can be adjusted by using base fuel with low vapor pressure. If strict fuel specifications are to be met, this rules out the possibility of so-called splash-blending of ethanol. In some regions, higher vapor pressures are allowed for gasoline-ethanol blends, if they contain ethanol (Read more of volatility limits).


One notable point regarding the vapor pressure of ethanol blend is its tendency to increase more quickly than that of gasoline with increasing temperature."

From: http://www.iea-amf.org/content/fuel_information/fuel_info_home/ethanol/e10/ethanol_properties

 

[NWCoaster]

Oxygenates and octane boosters are really two different things. Oxygenates were introduced on the dumb idea that cars that were improperly tuned were too rich, and adding an oxygenate would lean them out. Of course most cars had an O2 sensor and feedback system, so it just made them use more fuel, and if they happened to already be too lean it made them leaner, leading to misfires and more unburned fuel HC emissions.

Also 2-stroke chainsaws don't need higher octane.

I actually have used nothing but E10 from the local station for years and have had no running issues but vapor lock, which has become a real PITA every summer.

"Volatility and distillation
Ethanol forms azeotropes with hydrocarbons of gasoline, which impacts volatility. In particular, the vapor pressure and distillation characteristics of ethanol/gasoline blends are non-linear. Blending vapor pressures for alcohols are significantly higher than their nominal vapor pressures. Vapor pressure of neat ethanol is low at only 16 kPa (Owen and Coley 1995). When ethanol is added into gasoline, vapor pressure increases with blending ratios of 5-10%, but then gradually declines (Figures). With ethanol content of some 30-50%, vapor pressure is at the same level as for gasoline without oxygenates (Environment Australia 2002, Furey 1985).


Vapor pressure of blends can be adjusted by using base fuel with low vapor pressure. If strict fuel specifications are to be met, this rules out the possibility of so-called splash-blending of ethanol. In some regions, higher vapor pressures are allowed for gasoline-ethanol blends, if they contain ethanol (Read more of volatility limits).


One notable point regarding the vapor pressure of ethanol blend is its tendency to increase more quickly than that of gasoline with increasing temperature."

From: http://www.iea-amf.org/content/fuel_information/fuel_info_home/ethanol/e10/ethanol_properties

Crapola.... you didn't have to go all TECHNICAL on me..... jeeze.....Lol.

 

[Chris-PA]

Crapola.... you didn't have to go all TECHNICAL on me..... jeeze.....Lol.

LOL, I just regurgitated that junk from over on the 562xp Hot Start thread where it got beat into the ground: http://www.arboristsite.com/community/threads/562xp-hot-start.298269/page-5#post-5902970

 

[Khntr85]

So what ever happened to the damn 562????