Ever change prices mid-job?

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I changed a price on a tree bid one time.

It was a huge dead elm tree, hanging over house. I was asked to quote only to get it to the ground safely. When I actually showed up to do the job, I discovered that my bucket truck was not tall enough to complete the job.

I contacted the customer, informing him that I had screwed up on the bid and could not complete the job without hiring a crane to get me higher in the air. I told them he didn't owe me anything for my attempt and that I would walk away from the job unpaid for the work that I had completed.

I offered to finish the job if I got to add the cost of a crane rental. He agreed, remarking that that put my price up in the same ballpark as other quotes he had received.

Job was finished, we got paid, customer was retained.
 
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I changed a price on a tree bid one time.

It was a huge dead elm tree, hanging over house. I was asked to quote only to get it to the ground safely. When I actually showed up to do the job, I discovered that my bucket truck was not tall enough to complete the job.

I contacted the customer, informing him that I had screwed up on the bid and could not complete the job without hiring a crane to get me higher in the air. I told them he didn't owe me anything for my attempt and that I would walk away from the job unpaid for the work that I had completed.

I offered to finish the job if I got to add the cost of a crane rental. He agreed, remarking that that put my price up in the same ballpark as other quotes he had received.

Job was finished, we got paid, customer was retained.

Sounds completely reasonable.
 
Changed a price down this past spring. Big pine, major damage from a wind storm and hanging over a house. Thought I would need to climb and drop everything by line. The day I got there the wind was blowing pretty hard making a climb a bit hairy but in my favor, away from the house so I decided to drop the tree instead. Cut the price in half.
 
I changed a price on a tree bid one time.

It was a huge dead elm tree, hanging over house. I was asked to quote only to get it to the ground safely. When I actually showed up to do the job, I discovered that my bucket truck was not tall enough to complete the job.

I contacted the customer, informing him that I had screwed up on the bid and could not complete the job without hiring a crane to get me higher in the air. I told them he didn't owe me anything for my attempt and that I would walk away from the job unpaid for the work that I had completed.

I offered to finish the job if I got to add the cost of a crane rental. He agreed, remarking that that put my price up in the same ballpark as other quotes he had received.

Job was finished, we got paid, customer was retained.

How did all the other guys that bid on it, know how big your bucket truck is?
Ha! :poke::hmm3grin2orange:
Jeff :)
 
We did a lot of work in a neighborhood last year and a young Chinese girl came over and got me to give her a bid on a red oak right at the corner of her house. Nice tree. Wrong place. A lot of motioning with very little English and her parents? rattling away in Chinese in the background. We were booked a month out and this looked like a communications nightmare so I told her I'd give her a dirt cheap estimate and she could contact one of the "beat any price" Craigslist scumbags that seem to follow me around and she may be able to get it done cheap. Lots of head nodding so I thought the problem was solved.
Wrong. Got a call a month ago. Same tree. You cut down. How much. So I gave her an estimate and we set a date for Tuesday. She called four more times. How much to cut half the tree. Thinking that she just wanted the lead over the house removed I told her half my original bid. We show up Tuesday morning and a Chinese man comes out of the house, grabs a 10 ft. aluminum pole, walks to the tree and says in broken English; "you cut here".
So the half tree they wanted cut was 48' of a 60' oak. The part they wanted to keep was the 12' trunk. We made no headway trying to explain anything so they called the Chinese homeowner who spoke a little better English. I told my partner to talk to her and he spent the next 15 minutes trying to explain proper tree work to two people who only knew "you cut tree" and a third who didn't care or didn't understand. After 15 minutes I could see he was about to blow so I wrote a note that said "get us out of her now and I'll buy you breakfast at Waffle House" Best move of the day. He told the homeowner we were no longer interested in touching the tree and shook the hands of the young Chinese couple who thought that meant we were going to start cutting their tree. We got in the truck and they followed us half a block down the street yelling. No go. You cut little. You cut little.
Live and learn-maybe,
Phil
 
We did a lot of work in a neighborhood last year and a young Chinese girl came over and got me to give her a bid on a red oak right at the corner of her house. Nice tree. Wrong place. A lot of motioning with very little English and her parents? rattling away in Chinese in the background. We were booked a month out and this looked like a communications nightmare so I told her I'd give her a dirt cheap estimate and she could contact one of the "beat any price" Craigslist scumbags that seem to follow me around and she may be able to get it done cheap. Lots of head nodding so I thought the problem was solved.
Wrong. Got a call a month ago. Same tree. You cut down. How much. So I gave her an estimate and we set a date for Tuesday. She called four more times. How much to cut half the tree. Thinking that she just wanted the lead over the house removed I told her half my original bid. We show up Tuesday morning and a Chinese man comes out of the house, grabs a 10 ft. aluminum pole, walks to the tree and says in broken English; "you cut here".
So the half tree they wanted cut was 48' of a 60' oak. The part they wanted to keep was the 12' trunk. We made no headway trying to explain anything so they called the Chinese homeowner who spoke a little better English. I told my partner to talk to her and he spent the next 15 minutes trying to explain proper tree work to two people who only knew "you cut tree" and a third who didn't care or didn't understand. After 15 minutes I could see he was about to blow so I wrote a note that said "get us out of her now and I'll buy you breakfast at Waffle House" Best move of the day. He told the homeowner we were no longer interested in touching the tree and shook the hands of the young Chinese couple who thought that meant we were going to start cutting their tree. We got in the truck and they followed us half a block down the street yelling. No go. You cut little. You cut little.
Live and learn-maybe,
Phil

:)

been there and done that... :cheers:
 
I changed a price on a tree bid one time.

It was a huge dead elm tree, hanging over house. I was asked to quote only to get it to the ground safely. When I actually showed up to do the job, I discovered that my bucket truck was not tall enough to complete the job.


You discovered your bucket wasnt tall enough????? LOL!!!

How in the hell can some one "all of a sudden" Discover their buckets not tall enough?....c`mon!

I could understand if they put up a fence, pool, garage or something since you bid it....but buckets not tall enough?? rent a 90ft lift cheaper than a crane!!



LXT.................
 
You discovered your bucket wasnt tall enough????? LOL!!!

How in the hell can some one "all of a sudden" Discover their buckets not tall enough?....c`mon!

I could understand if they put up a fence, pool, garage or something since you bid it....but buckets not tall enough?? rent a 90ft lift cheaper than a crane!!



LXT.................

It's actually quite easy.

If you have ever used a bucket truck very much, don't even try to tell me that you haven't over estimated where it will reach and discovered that you were wrong.

Haven't you ever bid to remove a tree, only to discover something that you had overlooked that made you change your plan of removal?

Come on! Be honest here!

In this particular case, I had no problem going high enough, but I had insufficient reach to go out to where I needed to make the cuts to miss the house. after I started to remove the tree, I discovered that it was too dead and rotten to cut and rope down any of the pieces over the house, and I couldn't reach where I needed to be to cut and toss the pieces. Rigging ANYTHING would likely have lead to a catastrophic failure of the tree crashing into the house. It was really a fragile tree, yet all the small branches were still attached, and the limbs reached way out over the house.

Sooo...I rented a 14 ton crane with 65' reach (my bucket truck had a 55' working height. I didn't really gain much reach or height with the additional 15 feet of the Crane, since my bucket was rear mounted and the crane was mounted behind the cab. What I DID gain, was the ability to rig to my "bucket", and then swing the load away from the house and lower it.

As I recall, I bid $900 to lower the tree initially, and it cost me $400 to rent the crane. The crane was especially handy when it came to finishing the lower part of the tree. The next closest bid was $1350, so the customer was still going with the lowest price!

Obviously, a 90 foot lift would have done the job, but it certainly would not have been as cheap to rent, nor would it have been able to lower thousand pound chunks of wood later on in the removal.

Did that explain it all?
 
It's actually quite easy.

If you have ever used a bucket truck very much, don't even try to tell me that you haven't over estimated where it will reach and discovered that you were wrong.

Haven't you ever bid to remove a tree, only to discover something that you had overlooked that made you change your plan of removal?

Come on! Be honest here!

In this particular case, I had no problem going high enough, but I had insufficient reach to go out to where I needed to make the cuts to miss the house. after I started to remove the tree, I discovered that it was too dead and rotten to cut and rope down any of the pieces over the house, and I couldn't reach where I needed to be to cut and toss the pieces. Rigging ANYTHING would likely have lead to a catastrophic failure of the tree crashing into the house. It was really a fragile tree, yet all the small branches were still attached, and the limbs reached way out over the house.

Sooo...I rented a 14 ton crane with 65' reach (my bucket truck had a 55' working height. I didn't really gain much reach or height with the additional 15 feet of the Crane, since my bucket was rear mounted and the crane was mounted behind the cab. What I DID gain, was the ability to rig to my "bucket", and then swing the load away from the house and lower it.

As I recall, I bid $900 to lower the tree initially, and it cost me $400 to rent the crane. The crane was especially handy when it came to finishing the lower part of the tree. The next closest bid was $1350, so the customer was still going with the lowest price!

Obviously, a 90 foot lift would have done the job, but it certainly would not have been as cheap to rent, nor would it have been able to lower thousand pound chunks of wood later on in the removal.

Did that explain it all?

That's what I would say, lol!
Jeff :)
 
It's actually quite easy.

If you have ever used a bucket truck very much, don't even try to tell me that you haven't over estimated where it will reach and discovered that you were wrong.

Haven't you ever bid to remove a tree, only to discover something that you had overlooked that made you change your plan of removal?

Come on! Be honest here!

In this particular case, I had no problem going high enough, but I had insufficient reach to go out to where I needed to make the cuts to miss the house. after I started to remove the tree, I discovered that it was too dead and rotten to cut and rope down any of the pieces over the house, and I couldn't reach where I needed to be to cut and toss the pieces. Rigging ANYTHING would likely have lead to a catastrophic failure of the tree crashing into the house. It was really a fragile tree, yet all the small branches were still attached, and the limbs reached way out over the house.

Sooo...I rented a 14 ton crane with 65' reach (my bucket truck had a 55' working height. I didn't really gain much reach or height with the additional 15 feet of the Crane, since my bucket was rear mounted and the crane was mounted behind the cab. What I DID gain, was the ability to rig to my "bucket", and then swing the load away from the house and lower it.

As I recall, I bid $900 to lower the tree initially, and it cost me $400 to rent the crane. The crane was especially handy when it came to finishing the lower part of the tree. The next closest bid was $1350, so the customer was still going with the lowest price!

Obviously, a 90 foot lift would have done the job, but it certainly would not have been as cheap to rent, nor would it have been able to lower thousand pound chunks of wood later on in the removal.

Did that explain it all?

No offense, pdql, you been at this running a biz thing for longer than I so I'm just curious to your thought process on this one. When you first described this I thought your actions made sense and that I might sometime do the same in your case but I was thinking much bigger numbers. If you'd only be out 400 bucks in the end why wouldn't you save face and credibility and just eat it? My professionalism is worth far more than 400 dollars.
 
No offense, pdql, you been at this running a biz thing for longer than I so I'm just curious to your thought process on this one. When you first described this I thought your actions made sense and that I might sometime do the same in your case but I was thinking much bigger numbers. If you'd only be out 400 bucks in the end why wouldn't you save face and credibility and just eat it? My professionalism is worth far more than 400 dollars.

For my part, I think context is everything and adjusting the price is not necessarily a sacrifice of professionalism.

Let's say 99% of the time, no you should not change the price mid-job. The other 1% still exists and is legitimate. This is business, and business is business.
 
adjusting the price is not necessarily a sacrifice of professionalism.

I'd have to disagree with you there, GM. When I get hired for a job they call me because I do this for a living and I know what I'm doing. They agree to pay me a set amount to do what they cannot. Admitting that I messed up the bid is admitting that I am lacking in the skills required to do my job. I'm not saying it can't be done tactfully, and that one should never do it but I think my magic number would be far greater than 4 hundred bucks.

If nothing else it will make you a better bidder if you eat it a few times. I did a mulching job last year where the entire cost of the job went towards mulch because we under estimated the amount of material needed. That gave me cause to refine my bidding process on mulch jobs. Now, when bidding I give the customer a contract on my labor and trucking fees, the materials cost is a rough "estimate" of what it will take to do the job right and the HO reimburses me the cost of materials.
 
I'd have to disagree with you there, GM. When I get hired for a job they call me because I do this for a living and I know what I'm doing. They agree to pay me a set amount to do what they cannot. Admitting that I messed up the bid is admitting that I am lacking in the skills required to do my job. I'm not saying it can't be done tactfully, and that one should never do it but I think my magic number would be far greater than 4 hundred bucks.

If nothing else it will make you a better bidder if you eat it a few times. I did a mulching job last year where the entire cost of the job went towards mulch because we under estimated the amount of material needed. That gave me cause to refine my bidding process on mulch jobs. Now, when bidding I give the customer a contract on my labor and trucking fees, the materials cost is a rough "estimate" of what it will take to do the job right and the HO reimburses me the cost of materials.

I understand and I agree 99%.

I was only saying that the 1% exists, and there are times when $400 is real money.
 
No offense, pdql, you been at this running a biz thing for longer than I so I'm just curious to your thought process on this one. When you first described this I thought your actions made sense and that I might sometime do the same in your case but I was thinking much bigger numbers. If you'd only be out 400 bucks in the end why wouldn't you save face and credibility and just eat it? My professionalism is worth far more than 400 dollars.


1. This was back in 1997, so $400 was a lot more money then. It was the first year I had that bucket truck, so I was a bit of a newbie with a bucket truck.

2. Even with the additional payment for the crane, the job was seriously underbid. Even after adding some money to the price to compensate for the crane, I considered that I was "eating it". I worked on that tree for an entire day and a half before I had it on the ground. The first day was discovery of my mistake, and the second day was spent working out of that incredibly slow crane (with a man-bucket mounted on the end) cutting down the tree.

The access to the tree was very difficult, and we were barely able to get the larger crane truck down the skinny alley and into the rough terrain of the tiny backyard. My crane operator was my brother-in-law, and the rest of the tree took all day to complete, since he was not a skilled operator, and it took a lot of extra time to lower the wood into a safe area. Bottom line: I lost money big-time on my mistake, but I suppose I gained some important experience.

3. I had done previous work for this customer, and he was always a cheapskate, seeking the very bottom dollar and expecting the most out of it. He bought and rehabilitated houses for a living, and seldom sent me any work that was very profitable.

Unless it was a job that he absolutely couldn't do himself, there was no future work for me in it. We understood each other completely, and there was no credibility to be saved. He knew that I was capable of doing of the more advanced tree work and and that I was trying to honor my quote, and he also knew that I had materially underbid my competition.

In this particular case, I made a mistake, I admitted it, and I offered my customer an opportunity to profit from my mistake: I had 1/2 the tree on the ground before I discovered that I simply couldn't finish the job safely. He might have taken another tree services quote at a reduced price at that point, but he stuck with me anyway.

Why? I believe that he had complete confidence that I would do the job well, whereas the other tree services were an unknown quantity.

He called me just last summer, for what he described as a simple brush cleanup that he did not have time to do himself.

HO! HO! HO!

It turns out that there was an enormous yellow jacket nest in the middle of the work area. After I had farmed through the area and discovered the nest, he denied even knowing that the yellow jackets were there, despite having already cleaned the brush almost the rest of the property. Fortunately, I had chosen to mow it in the summer heat with my air-conditioned Bobcat A300 and our brush mower deck. No stings, no problem! I even took the time to dig out the nest with the corner of the mower deck. That really stirred them up!

If I had been there in an open cab, exposed to the yellow jackets, it would have been a a sure trip to the hospital if someone was even a little allergic. Before I got off the job, he wanted me to do some additional brush clearing at no additional price.

Like I said, he was a cheapskate, but we understood each other. He pays the bill I ask for, and I must watch carefully for all hidden danger and expenses.
 
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For my part, I think context is everything and adjusting the price is not necessarily a sacrifice of professionalism.

Let's say 99% of the time, no you should not change the price mid-job. The other 1% still exists and is legitimate. This is business, and business is business.

Well, when I give a price, that's the price! I would never make the customer pay for my ignorance!
Jeff CTSP
 
Well, when I give a price, that's the price! I would never make the customer pay for my ignorance!
Jeff CTSP

I respect that. That's the way you do business and I like a guy who keeps business, business.

Keep in mind, though, my viewpoint is only about 1% off of yours, so I think we can agree to a 99% agreement. And that's not too bad.
 
1. This was back in 1997, so $400 was a lot more money then. It was the first year I had that bucket truck, so I was a bit of a newbie with a bucket truck.

2. Even with the additional payment for the crane, the job was seriously underbid. Even after adding some money to the price to compensate for the crane, I considered that I was "eating it". I worked on that tree for an entire day and a half before I had it on the ground. the first day was discovery of my mistake, and the second day was spent working out of that incredibly slow crane (with a man-bucket mounted on the end) cutting down the tree.

the access to the tree was incredibly difficult, and we were barely able to get the larger crane truck down the skinny alley and into the rough terrain of the tiny backyard. My crane operator was my brother-in-law, and the rest of the tree took all day to complete, since he was not a skilled operator, and it took a lot of extra time to lower the wood into a safe area. Bottom line: I lost money big-time on my mistake, but I suppose I gained some important experience.

3. I had done previous work for this customer, and he was always a cheapskate, seeking the very bottom dollar and expecting the most out of it. He bought and rehabilitated houses for a living, and seldom sent me any work that was very profitable.

Unless it was a job that he absolutely couldn't do himself, there was no future work for me in it. We understood each other completely, and there was no credibility to be saved. He knew that I was capable of the doing of the more advanced tree work and and that I was trying to honor my quote, and he also knew that I had materially underbid my competition.

In this particular case, I made a mistake, I admitted it, and I offered my customer an opportunity to profit from my mistake: I had 1/2 the tree on the ground before I discovered that I simply couldn't finish the job safely. He might have taken another tree services quote at a reduced price at that point, but he stuck with me anyway.

Why? I believe that he had complete confidence that I would do the job well, whereas the other tree services were an unknown quantity.

The last time he called me for a job was just last summer, for what he described as a relatively simple brush cleanup that he did not have time to do.

HO! HO! HO!

It turns out that there was an enormous yellow jacket nest in the middle of the brushy area. After I had farmed through the area and discovered the nest, he denied even knowing that the yellow jackets were there, despite having cleaned all the brush almost everywhere else in the yard. Fortunately, I had chosen to mow it in the summer heat with my air-conditioned Bobcat A300 and our brush mower deck. No stings, no problem. I even took the time to dig out the nest with the corner of the mower deck.

If I had been there in an open cab, exposed to the yellow jackets, it would have been a a sure trip to the hospital if someone was even a little allergic. Before I got off the job, he wanted me to do some additional brush clearing at no additional price.

Like I said, he was a cheapskate, but we understood each other. He pays the bill I ask for, and I must watch carefully for all hidden danger and expenses.


Man, you got excuses for every situation. You are sounding like a guy I used to know. Lame!
Jeff:dizzy:
 
I respect that. That's the way you do business and I like a guy who keeps business, business.

Keep in mind, though, my viewpoint is only about 1% off of yours, so I think we can agree to a 99% agreement. And that's not too bad.

Your viewpoint is relative to your experience. My viewpoint is relative to my experience. :)
Jeff
 
Man, you got excuses for every situation. You are sounding like a guy I used to know. Lame!
Jeff:dizzy:

No excuses have been offered. I admitted my mistake from the very beginning. I was asked for my reasoning. I gave it.

Dave's definition of "excuse": A reason that is offered by some miscreant so as to escape blame for their actions.

Like I said, I accepted the blame, so I don't need to worry about excuses.
 

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