F-450 - should I get Diesel or Gas???

[rattler555]

Hello Group. I am looking at purchasing a F-450 1-ton dump for a start-up business. I found a few online and would like any opinions on gas versus Diesel. The truck I like is a 97 F-450 7.3 turbo diesel with 92k on it with a 12ft bed. I am not too familiar with Diesel engines and am concerned about high repair costs. From what i have read - diesel engines run longer and are built stronger than gas. Is there anything to look for when assessing the truck? Also, Diesel get better gas mileage that gas correct? Thanks!

 

[lxt]

Hello Group. I am looking at purchasing a F-450 1-ton dump for a start-up business. I found a few online and would like any opinions on gas versus Diesel. The truck I like is a 97 F-450 7.3 turbo diesel with 92k on it with a 12ft bed. I am not too familiar with Diesel engines and am concerned about high repair costs. From what i have read - diesel engines run longer and are built stronger than gas. Is there anything to look for when assessing the truck? Also, Diesel get better gas mileage that gas correct? Thanks!

Diesel, especially with the fords, they are so heavy to begin with that you wont regret the extra torque & power!.....however it depends on the miles you put on a year when comparing the fuel side of things (gas vs diesel)


LXT...........

 

[lego1970]

Diesels generally last longer due to a few different reasons.

1. Lubricity of the fuel allows longer lasting piston rings and cylinder wear.
2. The block has to withstand higher compression so in the areas that are not under greater strain get the added benefit of being overly strong.
3. While the piston speed is generaly the same as a gas engine, the rpms of the crank and valve train are much slower therefore less wear on those componants.

The engines main faults normaly lie in the turbo charger, fuel injectors and head gasket, deck issues. Those are some of the more common failures in a diesel engine. Diesel prices have been higher then gasoline for about 8 years now and I don't see it flipping the other way. There is a high demand for diesel fuel and even though it takes less refining then gasoline, there is less diesel grade fuel per barrel of oil compared to gasonline. The other downside is fuel gelling in the winter. With a little additives, and plugging the block heater in at night, you shouldn't have any problems.

Some of the highlights of a diesel besides longevity, is oil changes normaly can go longer because the filtration systems are better and because the oil keeps particulates suspended better, instead of clumping up in nooks and crannys in the engine. You get more useable torque at lower rpms and normaly better fuel milage.

I don't know anything in particuliar about the Ford 7.3 diesel, but the above is generally the highs and lows of most diesel engines. Good luck.

 

[pdqdl]

'97? I would reconsider. There are some drawbacks to the ford diesels. Unless they have changed their engines, the diesels run great, reliable for a while, then...you will regret owning one!

The engines have a special computer driven fuel injection system that costs about $1500 PER CYLINDER for parts alone, and that does not include the highly technical labor required to fix it. Once these engines get about 10 years old, the cost of an engine repair makes it not worth owning anymore. The ford diesel WILL NOT OUTLAST a gas engine, not because there is anything mechanically wrong, just that what must wear out is more expensive than a new engine, which is more than the used truck will be worth.

They don't have a conventional fuel injection pump, and No! You can't work on it yourself. At all. Except maybe to change fuel filters. And Yes! The dealer knows these things and will break it off on you when the truck finally needs a repair.

If you plan on buying new, and owning it for only 5 or 6 years and then dumping it on some unsuspecting fool, the diesels are fine. Otherwise, buy the gas, own something you can own for 15 years. Furthermore, as more people get burned by this engine, it will become well known that you should not buy a used Ford Diesel, so I suspect that the resale value will be low.

I know I have no intention of owning another one. Mine is a 1995, and it cost me over 4 grand to get one cylinder fixed last year. The gas engines work just fine for me, and I used to prefer the diesels, back when they had injection pumps on them.

 

[yodayoda]

I work at a Ford/Dodge dealer, The 7.3 Diesel was a good engine, stay away from the 2003 and newer 6.0 Diesel, way to many problems

 

[treeclimber101]

They are good with the V10 too diesel engines are my preference only because I usually keep them forever , the only drawback is the winter they require more love than a gas engine ..The other fellow who said too stay away from the 6 liter couldn't be more right they are junk and problamatic the 7.3 is an old engine with many yrs. of service under its belt

 

[rattler555]

mileage when you had problems?

'97? I would reconsider. There are some drawbacks to the ford diesels. Unless they have changed their engines, the diesels run great, reliable for a while, then...you will regret owning one!

The engines have a special computer driven fuel injection system that costs about $1500 PER CYLINDER for parts alone, and that does not include the highly technical labor required to fix it. Once these engines get about 10 years old, the cost of an engine repair makes it not worth owning anymore. The ford diesel WILL NOT OUTLAST a gas engine, not because there is anything mechanically wrong, just that what must wear out is more expensive than a new engine, which is more than the used truck will be worth.

They don't have a conventional fuel injection pump, and No! You can't work on it yourself. At all. Except maybe to change fuel filters. And Yes! The dealer knows these things and will break it off on you when the truck finally needs a repair.

If you plan on buying new, and owning it for only 5 or 6 years and then dumping it on some unsuspecting fool, the diesels are fine. Otherwise, buy the gas, own something you can own for 15 years. Furthermore, as more people get burned by this engine, it will become well known that you should not buy a used Ford Diesel, so I suspect that the resale value will be low.

I know I have no intention of owning another one. Mine is a 1995, and it cost me over 4 grand to get one cylinder fixed last year. The gas engines work just fine for me, and I used to prefer the diesels, back when they had injection pumps on them.

PD, how many miles were on your 95' when you had to put work into the cylinder? Thanks for your insight.

 

[pdqdl]

Roughly 110,000 miles. I didn't make a note of that at the time.

 

[Toddppm]

there is less diesel grade fuel per barrel of oil compared to gasonline. .

How does that work? I've never heard that before, don't they use the same petro for all gas/diesel and just refine it more for gas?


I'll second the stay away from the Ford 6.0's, had to get rid of 2 of them and lost my a:censored: Wasn't only the motors I had multiple problems with though.....I'd say stay away from Ford all together but I know the diehards will say it's a fluke or something. All I know is they did not stand up for their product and it cost me a chitload of money to get rid of that junk.

 

[lego1970]

I'm not 100% sure how it works and I could be wrong, but I believe the crude oil comes in and then gets seperated thru some type of distilation column. Tar comes off the bottom, and butane comes off the top, kerosene, diesel, gasoline, etc, etc fall in the middle somewhere. Of coarse it has to go thru other processes to become those types of fuels, but I think that's how it starts out. I think it gets seperated thru the different specific gravity before it turns into each type of fuel. At least that's how I always understood it, but I've been wrong plenty of times so I very well could be wrong again.

I believe PDQDL has a chemistry background so maybe he can chime in and explain it better, assuming I'm on the right track to begin with.

 

[Bearcreek]

I have a friend who has an F 450 with the Powerstroke diesel that gets 9 mpg on a good day. Another friend has a F550 with the V10 gas and he occasionally gets as much as 16 mpg highway. Im not sure that thats typical but I would not say that the Powerstroke always gets better mileage than the V10. On the other hand, another friend had a Ford E350 van with a Powerstroke that regularly got 24-27 mpg, much better than the 12-16 mpg that still another friend got with their E350 with the V10. Seems like almost luck of the draw sometimes.

 

[Dalmatian90]

What lego says.

They can shift a bit to make more gasoline or more diesel/kerosene/no. 2 , but there's only so much raw stuff in each barrel suitable for gasoline v. diesel.

Oil also varies from area to area.

West Texas Intermediate is what you hear prices quoted for in the U.S. It's low in sulfur and yields more gasoline per barrel then most oil.

Brent North Sea crude yields more diesel & no. 2 home heating oil then WTI.

Part of the reason Europe has more diesels is their petroleum makes more diesel, ours makes more gasoline.

During the winter some refineries will switch from U.S. oil to North Sea oil in order to make more No. 2 heating oil from each barrel they refine.

 

[Toddppm]

Cool, Very interesting.

 

[48"BAR PINCHER]

I have lots of friends with 7.3 that have well over 200K and never had engine issues. I personally had 2 F550's with 6.0 diesels. The engines and the trucks were junk. I bought them both new and I'm glad I did because I would have been out of business if I had to pay for all the repairs. Sold both with around 30K miles on them.

 

[treesquirrel]

I really cannot imagine why ford would make a non-diesel f450.

 

[Bearcreek]

The initial cost is lower and, like I said above, in some cases they get better fuel mileage. Don't get me wrong, i'm a diehard diesel guy, but I know what i've seen and heard and can't deny it. The best way to go IMO is swap a Cummins into a F450 or F550.

 

[mckeetree]

The best way to go IMO is swap a Cummins into a F450 or F550.

Yeah right. I'm sure you have done a lot of that.

 

[Bearcreek]

Not me personally, not yet anyway's. I have couple friends that have done that swap and its not all that hard as engine swaps go, especially on an older truck.

 

[gr8scott72]

Not me personally, not yet anyway's. I have couple friends that have done that swap and its not all that hard as engine swaps go, especially on an older truck.

As long as you got about $10k just burning a hole in your pocket and tons of time to throw at it too.

 

[Lawnmowerboy48]

For larger trucks diesel is the only way to go. How much are you looking to pay for the used truck? Are you looking to buy it out right or taking a loan out etc? In either case the best bet is too buy new, your will save yourself a lot of headaches.