Few Stihl Dealers Have Seal Puller Tool - WTF?

[atpchas]

I saw this puller but without having one in hand it is hard to judge the size of the hook and whether it would fit in the confined space allotted. Anybody ever use one of these successfully on an 026/260 flywheel seal?

I found the Lisle tool to be pretty much useless on the FW seals. The hook was far too large to fit under the seal. When I removed enough material to get a fit, there was no longer enough strength in the material to pull the seal. I've also never managed to shape a screwdriver to fit and still be strong enough not to break. Drywall screws with plier puller or slide hammer puller is my method of choice.

 

[SteveSr]

I found the Lisle tool to be pretty much useless on the FW seals. The hook was far too large to fit under the seal. When I removed enough material to get a fit, there was no longer enough strength in the material to pull the seal. I've also never managed to shape a screwdriver to fit and still be strong enough not to break. Drywall screws with plier puller or slide hammer puller is my method of choice.

Thanks for the confirmation. I was afraid of that.

 

[cedarshark]

I found the Lisle tool to be pretty much useless on the FW seals. The hook was far too large to fit under the seal. When I removed enough material to get a fit, there was no longer enough strength in the material to pull the seal. I've also never managed to shape a screwdriver to fit and still be strong enough not to break. Drywall screws with plier puller or slide hammer puller is my method of choice.

+1 on the Lisle puller....jaws are too big. I have even had the the Stihl puller completely pull the inside lip on the fw seal. Sometimes they are stubborn. I use a heat gun on the case w/ care.

 

[SteveSr]

I finally broke down and bought the Stihl puller after trying a half dozen homemade ones. Nothing works better IMHO. Now I have to save up for a couple yrs to get the case splitter.

Well, add me to the club of puller owners... Just ordered a set. The stuff that I tend to reincarnate is in the 10-30 year old range which is good for getting worn out seals. Saving one saw or weedeater pays for the tool. It is also good to change out "unique" seals that may become NLA before the tool is dead. This way the seals are good for another 20 years by which time I probably won't care!

So when pulling FW seals is it best to put the puller jaws between the metal seal edge and the rubber or between the crank and the rubber... or does it matter? Do penetrating oils like PB blaster help at all?

 

[Garth elder]

I served an apprenticeship at a stihl dealer never used a seal puller just flicked them out with a screwdriver been working on stihls for over 30 years why would you choose a tool which isn't actually necessary? Just tap one side fully in then flick it of with the side that has just popped out in your direction

 

[cedarshark]

Well, add me to the club of puller owners... Just ordered a set. The stuff that I tend to reincarnate is in the 10-30 year old range which is good for getting worn out seals. Saving one saw or weedeater pays for the tool. It is also good to change out "unique" seals that may become NLA before the tool is dead. This way the seals are good for another 20 years by which time I probably won't care!

So when pulling FW seals is it best to put the puller jaws between the metal seal edge and the rubber or between the crank and the rubber... or does it matter? Do penetrating oils like PB blaster help at all?

The jaws will push in next to the crankshaft under the rubber. You will then spread the jaws with the thumbscrew to spread the jaws out to catch the metal lip on the outside of the seal. Turn the center screw and the bolt will pull the puller up and bring the seal with it. Dont be surprised if it takes more that 1 try on small stubborn seals.

 

[SteveSr]

I served an apprenticeship at a stihl dealer never used a seal puller just flicked them out with a screwdriver been working on stihls for over 30 years why would you choose a tool which isn't actually necessary? Just tap one side fully in then flick it of with the side that has just popped out in your direction

Have you ever tried this and found it to work on the smaller pro saws like the 026/260 where the seal is recessed 3mm into the bore to make room for the flywheel?

 

[pioneerguy600]

Have you ever tried this and found it to work on the smaller pro saws like the 026/260 where the seal is recessed 3mm into the bore to make room for the flywheel?

Every time and that has been a lot of seals, you fellas make it seem its a hard thing to do but I can have them both out before any experienced mechanic can even set the Stihl seal puller up with the correct set of jaws.

 

[HarleyT]

Every time and that has been a lot of seals, you fellas make it seem its a hard thing to do but I can have them both out before any experienced mechanic can even set the Stihl seal puller up with the correct set of jaws.

What about the "Gold" ones????
Those guys can pop out a seal by looking at it hard!!!!

 

[SteveSr]

Every time and that has been a lot of seals, you fellas make it seem its a hard thing to do but I can have them both out before any experienced mechanic can even set the Stihl seal puller up with the correct set of jaws.

I think a good video is in order here. I bet some folks would even buy you a beer (or maybe a case!) for educating the rest of us poor laggards who can't figure this out!

 

[pioneerguy600]

What about the "Gold" ones????
Those guys can pop out a seal by looking at it hard!!!!

I know, I have to listen to their bragging all the time....LOL
How bout me, just a piddlin platinum tech.

 

[pioneerguy600]

I think a good video is in order here. I bet some folks would even buy you a beer (or maybe a case!) for educating the rest of us poor laggards who can't figure this out!

I am without a video camera and even if I had one I wouldn`t know how to load one to You Tube. Technically challenged I tell ya, too old to learn all the new web tech stuffs but I can measure. Which seal is smaller, the one on an 026 flywheel side I hear all the bitchin about or the one on the flywheel side of the 044 and MS 440 saws?

 

[SteveSr]

I am without a video camera and even if I had one I wouldn`t know how to load one to You Tube. Technically challenged I tell ya, too old to learn all the new web tech stuffs

Got any kids (or grandkids) old enough to be technically enabled?

Which seal is smaller, the one on an 026 flywheel side I hear all the bitchin about or the one on the flywheel side of the 044 and MS 440 saws?

From My IPLs -
044 - 13x19x4mm
026 - 12x20x5mm
The 026 is probably worse as it has more contact area (friction) with the bore on the crankcase (20x5mm). It is also recessed about 2-3mm which increases the difficulty. I don't know if the 044 is also recessed and if so, how much.

 

[pioneerguy600]

Got any kids (or grandkids) old enough to be technically enabled?


From My IPLs -
044 - 13x19x4mm
026 - 12x20x5mm
The 026 is probably worse as it has more contact area (friction) with the bore on the crankcase (20x5mm). It is also recessed about 2-3mm which increases the difficulty. I don't know if the 044 is also recessed and if so, how much.

No sir, all on my own so no vids from me but I have spent 57 years working as a wrench, maybe that makes it a little easier for me to deal with these tiny seals. One or two taps on a punch or slot screwdriver will tip the old seal and start/break it free in the bore, insert the screwdriver blade that has been ground down thin with the hooked shape end down through the rubber part of the seal so the tip is positioned to pop out the high side of the seal and push down on the screwdriver handle, the seal pops right out. I have heard a lot of ******** about how hard this is to do so here is another little tip I have never before posted. Find a big washer, one with a 3/4" hole and around 1/8" thick, drop it down over the crankshaft stub before inserting the screwdriver through the rubber seal lip, this will give you something to pry on so the magnesium seal bore does not get damaged. Old dogs have lots of tricks.

 

[cedarshark]

Do you use the opposite side of the washer to apply upward force on the side of the seal you have the screwdriver under?

 

[HarleyT]

No sir, all on my own so no vids from me but I have spent 57 years working as a wrench, maybe that makes it a little easier for me to deal with these tiny seals. One or two taps on a punch or slot screwdriver will tip the old seal and start/break it free in the bore, insert the screwdriver blade that has been ground down thin with the hooked shape end down through the rubber part of the seal so the tip is positioned to pop out the high side of the seal and push down on the screwdriver handle, the seal pops right out. I have heard a lot of ******** about how hard this is to do so here is another little tip I have never before posted. Find a big washer, one with a 3/4" hole and around 1/8" thick, drop it down over the crankshaft stub before inserting the screwdriver through the rubber seal lip, this will give you something to pry on so the magnesium seal bore does not get damaged. Old dogs have lots of tricks.

I didn't know they had invented chainsaws yet 57 years ago!!!!

 

[Garth elder]

No sir, all on my own so no vids from me but I have spent 57 years working as a wrench, maybe that makes it a little easier for me to deal with these tiny seals. One or two taps on a punch or slot screwdriver will tip the old seal and start/break it free in the bore, insert the screwdriver blade that has been ground down thin with the hooked shape end down through the rubber part of the seal so the tip is positioned to pop out the high side of the seal and push down on the screwdriver handle, the seal pops right out. I have heard a lot of ******** about how hard this is to do so here is another little tip I have never before posted. Find a big washer, one with a 3/4" hole and around 1/8" thick, drop it down over the crankshaft stub before inserting the screwdriver through the rubber seal lip, this will give you something to pry on so the magnesium seal bore does not get damaged. Old dogs have lots of tricks.

TBH on my own saw if seals were needed I'd likely do bearings at the same time there's likely a reason for a failed seal weather bearing movement or something damaging it from outside either way it likely best to do the entire job at the same time if seals leaking who knows what the engine may have ingested

 

[Garth elder]

Have you ever tried this and found it to work on the smaller pro saws like the 026/260 where the seal is recessed 3mm into the bore to make room for the flywheel?

As I said I worked in a stihl shop if seals were needed I'd be more inclined to open up the engine and at the very least check all internals leaking seals often just a symptom and unless the cause is known and fixed its likely to be a temporary fix I'd not let a saw go out the door unless I knew my repair would last

 

[Garth elder]

As I said I worked in a stihl shop if seals were needed I'd be more inclined to open up the engine and at the very least check all internals leaking seals often just a symptom and unless the cause is known and fixed its likely to be a temporary fix I'd not let a saw go out the door unless I knew my repair would last

What the owner said and what we often discovered were often very different things had to cover all possibilities with the older 064 models especially leaking seal usually meant the owner had leaned out the mixture to get more revs and true they really rev leaned out but they also used to wreck crankcases even saw one cracked around the main bearings causing leaking seals of course but not repairable by seals alone

 

[SteveSr]

Well, I got the puller and successfully replaced the seals in saw #1. That flywheel side seal was uber tight! Even with heat and soaking in PB blaster I had to really crank down on the puller to get the seal moving. The PTO side was a cake walk in comparison.

I also found that it would be good to get the correct installation drifts, at least for the FW side. Sockets don't work well here as you should be pressing on the metal part of the seal and NOT on the overhanging rubber in the center. I used a 14mm socket and had to press so hard it actually cut a thin strip of the overhanging rubber. I should have tested the fit of the socket/drift before installing. The correct drift has a recess for this reason. They are also fairly inexpensive, at least, compared to the puller itself.

I also confirmed the reason that Stihl is now recommending sealant be used on the seal/bore interface. I used sealant on the FW side since the bore might be rough. I did NOT use it on the PTO side. When I was done I did a pressure test and noticed a barely noticeable change in pressure over 5-10 minutes. I went searching for the leak and found a very small bubble coming from the seal/bore interface on the FW side (sealed) every few seconds. I then turned the saw over and did the same thing on the PTO side (non-sealed) and saw LOTS of little bubbles at the seal/bearing race. I am assuming that this leak will eventually seal itself. It definitely passes Stihl's leak test requirements.