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About two weeks ago Cal Fire began a long planned Rx burn btw Aptos and Watsonville CA. The burn was to be 20-30 acres. The burn was nearly done when the wind came. Nobody noticed this trigger point so there was no shift in tactics or strategy. IIRC the final acreage was 130 or so. Evacuations were ordered, aircraft were ordered, and the public was outraged. Cal Fire was blamed.

Then the storm hit and drowned the county. Power went out in many places, trees down all over the county. The public was outraged. PG&E was blamed.
 
About two weeks ago Cal Fire began a long planned Rx burn btw Aptos and Watsonville CA. The burn was to be 20-30 acres. The burn was nearly done when the wind came. Nobody noticed this trigger point so there was no shift in tactics or strategy. IIRC the final acreage was 130 or so. Evacuations were ordered, aircraft were ordered, and the public was outraged. Cal Fire was blamed.

Then the storm hit and drowned the county. Power went out in many places, trees down all over the county. The public was outraged. PG&E was blamed.

Blame game about everything :))


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That wind at the 3:30 mark in the video would make me think again about the plan, and the wind speed one would consider acceptable.

100% controlled, 100% in prescription and 100% professionally monitored and assisted with

That’s a Good thing right there !!


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Did you help with that burn?

I really hope to see a lot more of this, our forests will thank us, heck, most of nature will thank us.

I did not, but I know several that were involved and thier work history and accomplishments

It wasn’t a let’s burn some **** and make a YouTube video event

And for sure it’s a good thing if done responsibly, that area has seen a lot of tragedy with fire and all it takes is a bad outcome ( perceived or real) or bad press and it’s a huge setback and a loss of faith

I live in Sonoma county and after our devastating fires in 2017 and 2019 people are jumpy and anxious and any sign of smoke gets called in
I log my casual outdoor fire pit “warming” fires with our dispatch center as the FD kept responding out on smoke investigations and Wildland fire call-outs to my place. None since


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I did not, but I know several that were involved and thier work history and accomplishments

It wasn’t a let’s burn some **** and make a YouTube video event

And for sure it’s a good thing if done responsibly, that area has seen a lot of tragedy with fire and all it takes is a bad outcome ( perceived or real) or bad press and it’s a huge setback and a loss of faith

I live in Sonoma county and after our devastating fires in 2017 and 2019 people are jumpy and anxious and any sign of smoke gets called in
I log my casual outdoor fire pit “warming” fires with our dispatch center as the FD kept responding out on smoke investigations and Wildland fire call-outs to my place. None since


Sent from my iPhone using see

You seem to be defending the effort, or reacting to something? Maybe I misunderstand your tone?

I have nothing but respect for the people involved and support controlled burns by all forest owners 100%. Pyros comment was making light of the discussion a few pages back about how hard it is to get volunteers to help with forest work. Somehow though, if fire is involved, it is easier to get help, which might just be because it is so rare. I know that if I invite the neighborhood over for a bonfire it seems they all show up every time, and bring their friends, people like "good fire".

We gave up trying to burn slash piles on one big thinning project. People on the freeway kept calling it in. Dispatch knew we were burning, lands knew, heck even the tribe knew and they were 30 miles away. The BC would come out every time, we'd chat about whatever and then he'd head back. Few hours later or the next day we'd see him again. I don't know that he had to respond every time, but he did, so whatever.

It was downright insanity when people were calling 911 because they saw smoke and there was 4" of heavy wet snow on the ground. He told me that time it was a neighbor who called it in when they saw smoke on way home from town. I talked to the neighbor and she was all defensive "We had that fire that got so close so we are all real scared of fire."

Freaking fire was in late summer fifteen years earlier and caused by lightening. It left a scar in the minds of everyone on that side of the mountain. I found out that almost all the calls were from people who lived nearby and would see the smoke on their way home from town.

So any projects in that area we just chip or grind, it is less hassle. Agencies were all fine, they kept saying they were sorry to bother us. We never burned in even remotely marginal conditions. Always in wet or snowy weather, piles were dry and burned out by evening, light wind at most.

We head ten miles down the same mountains and burn all day no problem. FD in that area says we don't have to tell them, but state rules say we do, so I call it in every time.
 
You seem to be defending the effort, or reacting to something? Maybe I misunderstand your tone?

I have nothing but respect for the people involved and support controlled burns by all forest owners 100%. Pyros comment was making light of the discussion a few pages back about how hard it is to get volunteers to help with forest work. Somehow though, if fire is involved, it is easier to get help, which might just be because it is so rare. I know that if I invite the neighborhood over for a bonfire it seems they all show up every time, and bring their friends, people like "good fire".

We gave up trying to burn slash piles on one big thinning project. People on the freeway kept calling it in. Dispatch knew we were burning, lands knew, heck even the tribe knew and they were 30 miles away. The BC would come out every time, we'd chat about whatever and then he'd head back. Few hours later or the next day we'd see him again. I don't know that he had to respond every time, but he did, so whatever.

It was downright insanity when people were calling 911 because they saw smoke and there was 4" of heavy wet snow on the ground. He told me that time it was a neighbor who called it in when they saw smoke on way home from town. I talked to the neighbor and she was all defensive "We had that fire that got so close so we are all real scared of fire."

Freaking fire was in late summer fifteen years earlier and caused by lightening. It left a scar in the minds of everyone on that side of the mountain. I found out that almost all the calls were from people who lived nearby and would see the smoke on their way home from town.

So any projects in that area we just chip or grind, it is less hassle. Agencies were all fine, they kept saying they were sorry to bother us. We never burned in even remotely marginal conditions. Always in wet or snowy weather, piles were dry and burned out by evening, light wind at most.

We head ten miles down the same mountains and burn all day no problem. FD in that area says we don't have to tell them, but state rules say we do, so I call it in every time.

We have the same problem were I work. One pile got over 100 911 calls so my boss had to call the kmj580 radio station so they would broadcast it during the traffic report.
We did a pile burn near our campground and burned all day no problem but as soon as It got dark campers started calling it in.
 
I did not, but I know several that were involved and thier work history and accomplishments

It wasn’t a let’s burn some **** and make a YouTube video event

And for sure it’s a good thing if done responsibly, that area has seen a lot of tragedy with fire and all it takes is a bad outcome ( perceived or real) or bad press and it’s a huge setback and a loss of faith

I live in Sonoma county and after our devastating fires in 2017 and 2019 people are jumpy and anxious and any sign of smoke gets called in
I log my casual outdoor fire pit “warming” fires with our dispatch center as the FD kept responding out on smoke investigations and Wildland fire call-outs to my place. None since


Sent from my iPhone using see

It's good to see the general public be able to get a bit of hands on education about prescribed fire. Zeke and others trying to get the word out there about it.

I have to put a sign up on the road when burning pine needles by the cabin now since I'm tired of having the fire department show up, if I burn behind on the back 10 acres I can burn day or night...I think having some Calfire and retired forest service as back neighbors helps there.
 
It's good to see the general public be able to get a bit of hands on education about prescribed fire. Zeke and others trying to get the word out there about it.

I have to put a sign up on the road when burning pine needles by the cabin now since I'm tired of having the fire department show up, if I burn behind on the back 10 acres I can burn day or night...I think having some Calfire and retired forest service as back neighbors helps there.

Hey Bud, how are ya ? Name change I see now :)

For sure on all those points. Good to see him and those involved and presenting it in a controlled manner for the lay person to understand


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Been doing alright my friend, had some email issues with the site and had to start a new account. Hope you have been well. I learned a lot last week about how burn day regulations and how agencies and land owner can work around with them. First time I've seen the forest service do pile burning on no burn days during winter, they have been doing site prep to start replanting north of alder springs east of our place. Socal Edison has had a large burn going for the last 2 weeks south of Shaver lake.
 
Been doing alright my friend, had some email issues with the site and had to start a new account. Hope you have been well. I learned a lot last week about how burn day regulations and how agencies and land owner can work around with them. First time I've seen the forest service do pile burning on no burn days during winter, they have been doing site prep to start replanting north of alder springs east of our place. Socal Edison has had a large burn going for the last 2 weeks south of Shaver lake.

Been good. Out on a little miniscus tear on my knee. Waiting for surge date. Otherwise good


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Well I have always learned a lot of the fine details about Fire and western forests from everyone here. This isn’t quite the thread for my newest wondering about it all but I think it is tangentially related enough.

I understand Pine Beetle impacts (have worked around Southern PB a lot) and stand densities and drought mortality and thinning strategies and have also worked on fuel reduction cutting in Montana and know how you need roads to get wood out of the woods and most things related to this, all fairly well (I hope) for never being able to actually walk around in the Sierra Nevadas.

And I believe I have read here over the years that a basic problem with beetle and drought kill is nothing can be done with much of the wood - not enough mill base, perhaps? More wood available than mills to use it?

Yesterday I read about a proposal from a group in California that seemed quite proud of their idea, which was astoundingly simple: build an OSB mill in Cslifornia. Because it doesn’t have one. And that OSB material is imported to California from mills all the way over in the south-eastern states. Where I livein the Great Lakes everyone in the Forestry biz is ecstatic about the opening of a new OSB mill as it will make it even easier to manage small diameter wood, get rid of old Xmas tree plantings with no future use, etc., etc. - & we already had one large OSB mill which is still going.

So I was a little surprised that after all these years of even environmental groups finally agreeing that Man needs to thin forests before fire kills them and thus the obvious question of what to do with the results of all that thinning and all those dead trees - & no one had yet built an OSB mill to put such wood to use? What I’m wondering is, I’m not totally sure, but why hasn’t such a milll ever been built around this seemingly huge supply of small diameter conifer? Am I missing something I don’t understand?

I know well how toxic relations can be between USFS and the private sector. And how much of CA is USFS land. I know a situation in the east where USFS biologists are bull-dozing hundreds of acres of small conifer out of their way (it is not the ‘correct’ conifer), claiming they couldn’t sell it or even give it away. Directly across the property line from their office is a small mill that makes fencing products out of, yup, small diameter conifer. Which is otherwise a bit scarce in that area.
Is USFS policy a reason CA doesn’t already have a mill to make OSB products?
 
Well I have always learned a lot of the fine details about Fire and western forests from everyone here. This isn’t quite the thread for my newest wondering about it all but I think it is tangentially related enough.

I understand Pine Beetle impacts (have worked around Southern PB a lot) and stand densities and drought mortality and thinning strategies and have also worked on fuel reduction cutting in Montana and know how you need roads to get wood out of the woods and most things related to this, all fairly well (I hope) for never being able to actually walk around in the Sierra Nevadas.

And I believe I have read here over the years that a basic problem with beetle and drought kill is nothing can be done with much of the wood - not enough mill base, perhaps? More wood available than mills to use it?

Yesterday I read about a proposal from a group in California that seemed quite proud of their idea, which was astoundingly simple: build an OSB mill in Cslifornia. Because it doesn’t have one. And that OSB material is imported to California from mills all the way over in the south-eastern states. Where I livein the Great Lakes everyone in the Forestry biz is ecstatic about the opening of a new OSB mill as it will make it even easier to manage small diameter wood, get rid of old Xmas tree plantings with no future use, etc., etc. - & we already had one large OSB mill which is still going.

So I was a little surprised that after all these years of even environmental groups finally agreeing that Man needs to thin forests before fire kills them and thus the obvious question of what to do with the results of all that thinning and all those dead trees - & no one had yet built an OSB mill to put such wood to use? What I’m wondering is, I’m not totally sure, but why hasn’t such a milll ever been built around this seemingly huge supply of small diameter conifer? Am I missing something I don’t understand?

I know well how toxic relations can be between USFS and the private sector. And how much of CA is USFS land. I know a situation in the east where USFS biologists are bull-dozing hundreds of acres of small conifer out of their way (it is not the ‘correct’ conifer), claiming they couldn’t sell it or even give it away. Directly across the property line from their office is a small mill that makes fencing products out of, yup, small diameter conifer. Which is otherwise a bit scarce in that area.
Is USFS policy a reason CA doesn’t already have a mill to make OSB products?

Its more so state regulations than usfs policy but it's a double whammy still. There's 1 lumber mill in the southern half of the state at Terra Bella and planned new mill on the auberry mill site suffered a major setback when two log decks burned and severely damaged the portable mill, truck, and generators.

USFS and State regs have caused a number of post fire salvage logging bids locally to fall through. One being dubbed the North fork fire salvage cluster **** by a local usfs Forester, started out at 1000 acres and over 4 years got reduced to 90 acres to log and if I remember right only 50 got done because of rot. At least now the USFS seems more willing log at least post fire in some areas but not enough to encourage major investment in a large mill operation.
 
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