In the news yesterday(I think) I read that the fire in Calif. caught two firefighters off guard and they had to deploy their emergency shelter. It said the fire went over them and they were alright but my question is what is the shelter and do they have oxygen to use as fire would be consuming a large amount in a quick amount of time ? That's gotta be scary as hell.
Forest firefighter ??
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Damn and my wife thinks climbing is dangerous. That's gotta be one scary ordeal. Thank God they survived
I just googled fire shelters and read some stuff on them. Very interesting. No oxygen just the air you trap inside and some air holes in shelter. They said the whole thing could last from 10 to 90 minutes. One survivor said the heat inside was unbearable but the outside wasn't an option. I just can't imagine trying to stay calm and not use all your oxygen. One guy said he just focused on his family and tryed to forget what was going on outside the shelter.
I just googled fire shelters and read some stuff on them. Very interesting. No oxygen just the air you trap inside and some air holes in shelter. They said the whole thing could last from 10 to 90 minutes. One survivor said the heat inside was unbearable but the outside wasn't an option. I just can't imagine trying to stay calm and not use all your oxygen. One guy said he just focused on his family and tryed to forget what was going on outside the shelter.
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The shelters are no more than a fabric similar to the fabric used to make fiberglass with a shiney side and a white side. The shiney side goes out and the white side goes in. The objective when using one of the shelters is to hold it as "air tight" to the ground as possible. When one dies from being overrun by a forest fire such as the ones burning out west it is not actually the fire that kills you, it is the super heated air that one brings into their lungs when breathing within proximity to such a beast. When in the shelter it sounds like a freight train is running you over and the wind blows like your in a tornado. It is very challenging to deploy ones shelter in those conditions let alone be able to get it properly "sealed" to the ground and hold your breathe long enough for the fire to overrun you and let it pass.
Take if from someone who has done such a thing. It is scary and in those situatons it really isnt something you wanna talk about later.
Cntrybo2= Ex forest service/ state forest firefighter
Take if from someone who has done such a thing. It is scary and in those situatons it really isnt something you wanna talk about later.
Cntrybo2= Ex forest service/ state forest firefighter
Magnum783
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I give you all the complements and thanks you deserve there partner I have been in some spooky ones but nothing that I had no place to run from. Props thanks for your hard work and dedication.
Jared
MNTAINGAL23
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That is why they wear wool clothing because it does't catch fire real easy. It could be that they get burned but the clothing protects them also. Cotton would not hold up well with all that heat.
My oldest daughter and son in law both work for the forest service here in Washington state.
When ever there is something that happens I always worry about them because sometimes they are out where there is no phone. They do get to use the satilite phone though.
Luckily this year my daughter is having a baby so she isn't on any fires.
My oldest daughter and son in law both work for the forest service here in Washington state.
When ever there is something that happens I always worry about them because sometimes they are out where there is no phone. They do get to use the satilite phone though.
Luckily this year my daughter is having a baby so she isn't on any fires.
They also wear nomex which is a fire proof used in areospce and race suits for nascar and indy in their clothing.
cntrybo2, all I can say is WOW! and very glad your alright. Job well done. I've got a friend who is a local firefighter and I'm not quite sure his wife understands what might happen on a call. She likes his paychecks though
You would think with all the technology they would have something better.
A small oxygen bottle made to withstand high temps with enough air for a hour or so. Just thinking out loud
Pete
You would think with all the technology they would have something better.
A small oxygen bottle made to withstand high temps with enough air for a hour or so. Just thinking out loud
Pete
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BobEMoto
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Here are some links about one of the first uses of an escape fire. They could have used the covers then.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mann_Gulch_fire
http://www.mysongbook.de/msb/songs/c/coldmiss.html
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mann_Gulch_fire
http://www.mysongbook.de/msb/songs/c/coldmiss.html
The new fire shelters are a couple of layers of aramid with reflective fabric on the outside. It reflects the radiant heat of a fire, however it can't handle convective (hot air) or conductive (hot object directly on the material) heat.
Like everyone said, it's a last ditch device.
Bringing a tank of oxygen isn't neccessary if you deploy the shelter correctly. If you deploy it incorrectly (not finding a good deployment site or not sealing the edges) then an oxygen tank won't help you because the hot air coming in will burn you anyway.
We don't wear wool, we wear nomex with cotton under shirts, underwear, and cotton or wool socks.
If I didn't have nomex then wool or cotton would be my first choice.
The key to surviving a fire is to not get entrapped in the first place.
I'm glad those guys (and anyone who's been burned over) survived, but the fact that they had to deploy their shelters means something went wrong before the entrapment.
Either they didn't have good escape routes and safety zones planned, they didn't post a lookout, or there was a breakdown in communication.
Firefighting is just like tree work. You scout out dangers, mitigate hazards, and check your safety gear before doing any work.
Like everyone said, it's a last ditch device.
Bringing a tank of oxygen isn't neccessary if you deploy the shelter correctly. If you deploy it incorrectly (not finding a good deployment site or not sealing the edges) then an oxygen tank won't help you because the hot air coming in will burn you anyway.
We don't wear wool, we wear nomex with cotton under shirts, underwear, and cotton or wool socks.
If I didn't have nomex then wool or cotton would be my first choice.
The key to surviving a fire is to not get entrapped in the first place.
I'm glad those guys (and anyone who's been burned over) survived, but the fact that they had to deploy their shelters means something went wrong before the entrapment.
Either they didn't have good escape routes and safety zones planned, they didn't post a lookout, or there was a breakdown in communication.
Firefighting is just like tree work. You scout out dangers, mitigate hazards, and check your safety gear before doing any work.
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Old Monkey
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Three of my friends had to deploy shelters. Two of them tell a macho version of the story, the third talks about feeling like he was on the bottom of a swimming pool and unable to breath(he tell his version in an A&E show about firefighters). He said he deployed next to a rock and he thought about bashing his head against it and knocking himself out. I have only deployed shelters in practice but that was enough for me. We set them up on the ground, in the sun on a 80 degree day. We stayed in them for ten minutes and it was miserable. I cannot imagine being in one next to a fire.
We train a lot in the NC Forest Service. During our basic strategy and tactics course we had to dig hand line in a simulation exercise. The division supervisor (instructor) told us on the radio to bail out. While we ran, another instructor told us to deploy our practice fire shelters.
One of our helicopters came over and hovered above us while another instructor (an LEO) threw smoke bombs out.
I watched as the rotor wash ripped one shelter out of the hands of a student.
Supposedly the helicopter's rotors will make a 50mph wind...I can't imagine having to deploy in an even stronger wind with a real fire heading towards you.
Good training really opens your eyes.
One of our helicopters came over and hovered above us while another instructor (an LEO) threw smoke bombs out.
I watched as the rotor wash ripped one shelter out of the hands of a student.
Supposedly the helicopter's rotors will make a 50mph wind...I can't imagine having to deploy in an even stronger wind with a real fire heading towards you.
Good training really opens your eyes.
smokechase II
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shelter up
If you can gets your hands on an old shelter being thrown away they make great thermal protection for tomatoes etc.
The old shelters are going to be phased out by the FS this next year. Many States may still be using them.
Inside out they are a space blanket. Keep those tomatoes toasty on chilly fall nights.
I am absolutely offended that there would be those of you reading this post that would wonder, "have wildland firefighters ever gotten so lost in the cold that they have used their shelters as space blankets for survival from the cold?"
Shame on you. Just because it has happened doesn’t justify your thoughts.
If you can gets your hands on an old shelter being thrown away they make great thermal protection for tomatoes etc.
The old shelters are going to be phased out by the FS this next year. Many States may still be using them.
Inside out they are a space blanket. Keep those tomatoes toasty on chilly fall nights.
I am absolutely offended that there would be those of you reading this post that would wonder, "have wildland firefighters ever gotten so lost in the cold that they have used their shelters as space blankets for survival from the cold?"
Shame on you. Just because it has happened doesn’t justify your thoughts.
That would be one heck of an expensive blanket.
smokechase II
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cheapo
Inexpensive when compared to death by hypothermia.
I think the old shelters were only around $60.
It has been several years but awhile back it was something around $700,000 for a death -(cost to gov / average) but a couple hundred thousand more for very serious injuries.
So when viewed inthat light, either shelter should be regarded as cheap.
Inexpensive when compared to death by hypothermia.
I think the old shelters were only around $60.
It has been several years but awhile back it was something around $700,000 for a death -(cost to gov / average) but a couple hundred thousand more for very serious injuries.
So when viewed inthat light, either shelter should be regarded as cheap.
Jumper
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Also used in the oil industry; the coveralls I am issued here are Nomex III.
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Jumper
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Guess you can't put a price on safety, but are those new shelters 5.5 times more effective than the old ones!!?? Seems like a considerable escalation in price.
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