Fun with ethanol

[angelo c]

Funny how these threads always veer off towards a condemnation of government policy and our society.

For those of you that posted in that vein, what steps (other than complaining on this forum) have you taken to bring about a change in the policies you abhor? You live in a democratic republic, rather than complaining try becoming involved to make this country a better place.

Remember, you elect the individuals who make the rules....

I vote with my $$$....I drive a diesel...and if that goes "corney" I'll role my own veggie fuel...

 

[WoodChuck'r]

What kind of shelf life are you getting with that D12? I think that maybe Pulaski sells that as well, I might be wrong.

When I buy it, it's put in a really well sealed race fuel container. The only time I open it is to mix up 2.5 gallons with the Klotz. It's a 5 gallon can so it gets exposed very very little.

I keep the container in a room temperature room covered up from any kind of light. I've mixed fuel that's been 6 months old since I bought it and I've had no issues whatsoever. I've used the fuel as long as a month or two after I've mixed it with R50 and it works great.

I've been told that storing the fuel the way I do can make it last for years. I've also been told not to use fuel that's any older than a year after being mixed.


How true any of the time frame info I've been given actually is I have no idea. I'm just super careful about how I store it before and after I mix it. I use the fuel long before it has any chance to go bad anyways. So far so good - I don't plan on testing to see what I need to do in order to make the fuel go bad!

 

[angelo c]

Both would prevent ethanol related problems, but I have to advise
customers with a solution that is both economically feasible, and easily
accessible.

Our dealership services everything from weedwackers, up to 30hp commercial zero turns.
And neither one of those answers, is a reasonable solution for anyone but
the enthusiast market that we have here on A/S.

I'd love to tell a women with a push mower to drive to the airport, (30 minutes away)
and attempt to buy avation fuel with a straight face. Or have the balls to
a commercial tree service to order 55 gallon drum of 100+ octane race fuel, to run
in their saws.

Caleb,
I have the same problem driving my lawn mower to the local pump station too...

Not suggesting Avgas is the only way to go, but is is A way to go. I have never had any difficulty purchasing Avgas but I am comfortable with Pilots and know my way around the airports and the staff there. its a communication thing, once the operators feel you are not a terrorist they will welcome you and your $$. Be weary of the Lead, a little goes a long way when it comes to carcinogens.

AirNav: Local Fuel Prices
if you are lucky enough to have an airport that carries MOGAS then you got a home run as it has no ethanol

support your local airport, they are dying daily and never come back once they do.

 

[BloodOnTheIce]

Caleb,
I have the same problem driving my lawn mower to the local pump station too...

Not suggesting Avgas is the only way to go, but is is A way to go. I have never had any difficulty purchasing Avgas but I am comfortable with Pilots and know my way around the airports and the staff there. its a communication thing, once the operators feel you are not a terrorist they will welcome you and your $$. Be weary of the Lead, a little goes a long way when it comes to carcinogens.

AirNav: Local Fuel Prices
if you are lucky enough to have an airport that carries MOGAS then you got a home run as it has no ethanol

support your local airport, they are dying daily and never come back once they do.

The nearest airport is a solid 30 minute drive and it's away from where most of our customer base is anyway, so that's not
really practical to send them there. But there's 2 Marina's and a gas station that have ethanol free available, and their
centrally located to 75% of our customers.

But most people are lazy and will continue to run crap gas, and maybe after getting their stuff repaired 4 or 5 times
they might learn.

 

[angelo c]

The nearest airport is a solid 30 minute drive and it's away from where most of our customer base is anyway, so that's not
really practical to send them there. But there's 2 Marina's and a gas station that have ethanol free available, and their
centrally located to 75% of our customers.

But most people are lazy and will continue to run crap gas, and maybe after getting their stuff repaired 4 or 5 times
they might learn.

Sad...but very true.

 

[shane438]

I buy non-ethanol gas dialy at my local farmers Co-op, I'm in Middle Tennessee and all the area Co-ops are non-ethanol in all three grades of gas. Also around here there is a revolt of sorts with the motorists demanding real gas and the stations that sell it have huge "NO ETHANOL" banners to advertise. I first noticed the difference with my BMW R1100RT. My gas mileage went to hell and I was Freaking out thinking my bike was messed up. I was getting 52mpg on premium, it dropped to 38.6mpg. A friend og mine also noticed it with his bike and we quickly found a source for pure gas and the mpg's came back. Look around your AO and see, you may have real gas available somewhere.

 

[Carl Anderson]

Caleb,
I have the same problem driving my lawn mower to the local pump station too...

Not suggesting Avgas is the only way to go, but is is A way to go. I have never had any difficulty purchasing Avgas but I am comfortable with Pilots and know my way around the airports and the staff there. its a communication thing, once the operators feel you are not a terrorist they will welcome you and your $$. Be weary of the Lead, a little goes a long way when it comes to carcinogens.

AirNav: Local Fuel Prices
if you are lucky enough to have an airport that carries MOGAS then you got a home run as it has no ethanol

support your local airport, they are dying daily and never come back once they do.

Thanks for this link, I found that the little airport less than 15 mins away sells 100LL for an average price of $6.49 (per gallon I'm assuming) and Jet A for $5.89 but no airports within 40 miles sells Mogas. So does anyone know what 100LL and Jet A are and which one might be useable and what type of oil mix should be used, etc?

This airport is described as full service that dispenses fuel from a truck, not pumps so I'm not sure how they would react to a Joe Schmoe like me showing up with a 2.5 or 5 gal gas can and if they would even be able to do it.

 

[jcappe]

Bad gas is only getting worse here as well. Thing is, I have to tip toe about it as I'm in the center of corn country. Some guys get all kinds of mad when you say anything bad about gasohol.

Yep, you definately are careful who you talk to about it around here. Might find you strung up on main street if you don't. :msp_tongue:

 

[sachsmo]

 

[ccicora]

View attachment 203460


I hate it when fuel just doesn't mix.

 

[WoodChuck'r]

Nice cocktail Chris.

 

[J.W Younger]

View attachment 203461View attachment 203461
this 1/2 gallon whisky bottle is full, the stuff on the bottom fell out after adding only a small amount of water. The ethanol was holding all the water it could and just adding a couple more onces made it fall out. Some don't see this as a problem. I'm not one of em.

 

[Johny Utah]

We run into this problem all the time at the dealership. Ethanol is like brake fluid, It is highly hydroscopic. It absorbs moisture. They warn us at "GM Technical College" that even a few drops of water into the fuel system is all it takes to cause the ethanol to separate from the gasoline and cause havoc to the fuel system.

Personally I only mix a gallon at a time, make sure I use it all. Never try to let it sit for more than a week.

Not to be a prick but the word you mean to say is HYGROSCOPIC

Hygroscopy is the ability of a substance to attract and hold water molecules from the surrounding environment through either absorption or adsorption with the absorbing or adsorbing material becoming physically 'changed,' somewhat: by an increase in volume, stickiness, or other physical characteristic of the material as water molecules become 'suspended' between the material's molecules in the process.
:msp_biggrin:

 

[Woodomaker]

AVgas is what I have been using after replacing lines, diaphragms, fuel tanks, etc...on the Stihl and Husky saws.
The 100LL seems to lock up the exhaust valve on the new splitter engine....Lead build up?

 

[J.W Younger]

AVgas is what I have been using after replacing lines, diaphragms, fuel tanks, etc...on the Stihl and Husky saws.
The 100LL seems to lock up the exhaust valve on the new splitter engine....Lead build up?

My spliter gags me with fumes when the winds right so i never use my left over avgas in it but in answer to your question i suspect its the salts used for removing the lead causing the problem.

 

[Kogafortwo]

Back in June, the Senate voted to rescind the federal subsidy to oil refiners for mixing ethanol into gasoline, to the tune of $5 billion. The subsidy ends Dec 31, 2011.

I am watching closely to see what that will mean in 2012 to the price of pump gas, the number of stations "offering" 10% ethanol, and whether it will lead to a general repeal of the ethanol edict.

We can only hope.

 

[Ironhand]

Thanks for this link, I found that the little airport less than 15 mins away sells 100LL for an average price of $6.49 (per gallon I'm assuming) and Jet A for $5.89 but no airports within 40 miles sells Mogas. So does anyone know what 100LL and Jet A are and which one might be useable and what type of oil mix should be used, etc?

This airport is described as full service that dispenses fuel from a truck, not pumps so I'm not sure how they would react to a Joe Schmoe like me showing up with a 2.5 or 5 gal gas can and if they would even be able to do it.

The 100LL is what you want if you go the avgas route. Just use whatever 2-cycle oil you like. I buy mine at a small local airport 5 gallons at a time. The people there are super nice and always want to chat about the evils of ethanol.

 

[Bowtie]

Funny how these threads always veer off towards a condemnation of government policy and our society.

For those of you that posted in that vein, what steps (other than complaining on this forum) have you taken to bring about a change in the policies you abhor? You live in a democratic republic, rather than complaining try becoming involved to make this country a better place.

Remember, you elect the individuals who make the rules....

Good point, and, I vote every election, and I use my voice with keyboard, ink pen, and cell phone.

If we dont change things, we will be talking how we upped the amps to "mod" our electric chainsaws soon. Pitiful.

 

[angelo c]

Thanks for this link, I found that the little airport less than 15 mins away sells 100LL for an average price of $6.49 (per gallon I'm assuming) and Jet A for $5.89 but no airports within 40 miles sells Mogas. So does anyone know what 100LL and Jet A are and which one might be useable and what type of oil mix should be used, etc?

This airport is described as full service that dispenses fuel from a truck, not pumps so I'm not sure how they would react to a Joe Schmoe like me showing up with a 2.5 or 5 gal gas can and if they would even be able to do it.

The 100LL is what you want if you go the avgas route. Just use whatever 2-cycle oil you like. I buy mine at a small local airport 5 gallons at a time. The people there are super nice and always want to chat about the evils of ethanol.

Just ask them nice. let them know you'll leave the cans for them to fill when ever they can if the truck isn't close by. also let them know you'll take the fuel they off loaded from the airplanes that had to be worked on. They can't re-use that fuel and its prefectly good for our use. Make a new friend, offer to work on their trimmers or two stroke stuff. Look around for the other "airport bums" there will always be a few hanging out living the dream...take an intro ride too you might catch that bug too. !!!!

Airport people are some of the nicest folk you'll ever meet...next to chainsaw folks.

 

[shane438]

Y'all need to look at pure-gas.org and buyrealgas.com