Knowledge Test

[BigJohn]

I would ask questions like what kind of beer do you like? How late to stay at the bar. What percent of your salary goes to beer? Where is a good place to buy weed?

If they answer I dont know then hire them. They are moldable like clay!

 

[KentuckySawyer]

When I was a cop I always had to take a knowledge test when applying for a position. They would score and compare. I want to be able to do this and I would like to divide the test into sections so you could see what the strengths and weeknesses are.

Will there be a spelling section in the test?

(Weakness):spam:

 

[SCE1966]

I have thought a lot about having a scaled back IQ test for new hires. Common sense is scarce these days, and finding a guy that catches on to things and retains them is even more rare. I swear ADD (attention deficit disorder) is an epedimic these days. You can learn a lot about a person from tests. However a good work ethic and a tenacious attitude to learn can overcome a lot.

 

[Nickrosis]

...Common sense is scarce these days, and finding a guy that catches on to things and retains them is even more rare. ...However a good work ethic and a tenacious attitude to learn can overcome a lot.

If you're a really small company - say under 5 - you can't really afford an underperformer, even if you're paying them less than dirt. From 5-?, you do have the ability to put a person with a positive attitude but extremely limited skill set in a more, I hate to say it, menial position like sweeping the floor or splitting firewood.

When someone is dragging the organization down or is not benefiting the company even at a low wage, it's time to say goodbye. :-/ But hopefully they can find something somewhere else or realize that they need to learn a skill if they're going to go anywhere.

 

[Dadatwins]

Good advice Nick, as I have worked for a few different municipal agencies I get to see first hand the mixed up bureaucrat attitude that believes a written test is the answer to all job applications. The answers to the test questions are usually the funniest, especially one applicants response to 'what is a false crotch and how would you use one?'. That response still gets a laugh. Unfortunately so many applicants can fly through the test questions and get hired. Had one hire that had never fueled a chainsaw before his first day on the job, he scored 100 on the written test. Of course I am sure PTS will have a better system of hiring than a large municipal entity, but my point is the same, a written test proves nothing, I would rather hire a person with a positive attitude, willing to learn and listen, than the book smart wanna-be.
PTS based on your response early in the thread, I know that you will go ahead and develop a written test and not listen to a bunch of know-nothing-naysayers and I hope in a few months you can bring this thread up and post results as to how the process is working. Good luck.

 

[woodchux]

A basic skill test for tree service hiring would be a great thing.

PTS I would like to see anything that you (or anyone else) comes up with.

Good help is VERY hard to come by , and anything that might help.....I'd like to try.

At least some of the basic stuff like knots ect...

 

[jp hallman]

I've read it all again. My opinion. You do need business advice. You hired a couple bosses, let em' boss. You said you'd like em' to conduct the tests. They know what to look for, questions to ask. Then ask them which one to hire. You have the knowledge you're looking for "inhouse". Use it, you've paid for it already.

 

[PTS]

I appriciate all the input, even though I seem to have come across as a know it all ass.

All of my staff is self created and has had no experience prior to my guidence. I have a hard time allowing them to decide who is most qualified when they are still growing themselves and not yet to the level that I would expect to rely on them to hire. They are not "BOSS" they are crew leaders but I'm still there for direction. I just wanted something to make my life easier. As we continue to get more and more "tree guy" applicants with "experience" the more I think the tests are necessary. No matter how good you are at interviewing and reading people and as a previous cop Ive had lots of experience.... I have still been BS'ed right into offering a job to one who seems more then qualified, and their resume makes them look like a dream and yet they can't even run a saw.

I think the hands on vs. written is a good idea and I might play with that a little bit. I don't necessarily think "written" is the best and only way to go but I think it is a posibility.

So in my defense. It isn't that I "know it all" it is just a possible step in a better direction of hiring for me. Might not work for you. But it might for me.

 

[jp hallman]

True, it might...However; sounds to me like the classic case of a young, know it all buck "reinventing the wheel". Good Luck.

 

[PTS]

Might be but like I told my dad for years if it wasn't for us "young bucks" trying to reinvent the wheel. You would still be riding around like the Flintstones. I tell him if you want to be a boat anchor go ahead but get the hell out of the main channel cause I have places to go.

 

[jp hallman]

Is that about the time he punched you in the mouth and kicked your ungrateful ass out in the street? Then, nowhere else to go you became a cop? Just asking, don't be bitter.
Other wheels need to be "reinvented"...tree service hiring is not high on the world's priority list.

 

[coydog]

typical municipal skills test

1. work climb
find a suitable tree and install 4-5 flags, one at top and the others throughout. climber will ascend safely and touch all flags( flipped in) within a time frame. optional, select a branch for 'removal', and have climber describe in detail how they would remove it including the finish cut( while still in tree after touching final flag), have a real or imaginary obstacle underneath, have them install a lowering line in the appropriate location as part of their work climb have them also describe how they would prune same branch for end weight reduction. If you have a tree that is slated for removal at your disposal a second work climb in hooks could be performed as well as actual demonstation of proper pruning cuts with a chainsaw while aloft.(kind of an oxymoron but it kills two birds with one stone)
2. tree/plant id
have several samples available of local trees/plants
3. knot proficiency
bowline, running bowline, clove hitch, sheet bend, blakes or tautline, etc.
4. chainsaw handling/ maintenance
have candidate take bar and chain off and put back on and start up a mid size saw
5. bucket test
have flags in tree or other tree set for operater to touch from the bucket have them determine placement of the truck , set up the truck properly and safely(outrigger, wheel chocks, etc.) touch flags and fold up boom etc.
test takes about an hour
IMPORTANT
climber/apllicant should sign some sort of a waiver or already be covered by your workman's comp, (municipalities have applicants sign a liability waiver) check with your lawyer.

 

[pbtree]

Hire by attitude, then train for aptitude.

If you insist on tests for applicants, don't use psychological tests - all the good climbers would fail.

Oh yeah!

 

[BigJohn]

Do you really need a test. Are there that many applicants pounding down your door that you need to screen tests? I think I am more than capaple of meeting with someone and talking to them to find out if they are full of sh1t. If went and applied somewhere for a climbing postion or ground lets hope that never happens and they handed me a test or wanted me to climb a test tree I'd probably laugh at them. If they didn't who I was then they're not worth working for.

Hire yourself someone famous.

I had people say to me when I was applying for jobs "if your as good as me I can pay xx$$'s" I find that sorta talk pretty insulting and I walk away.

 

[wradman]

ok

when you look at my avatar picture would that qualify me or is that illegal(no ropes, no bands)at 70 ft

 

[jmack]

outside

I appriciate all the input, even though I seem to have come across as a know it all ass.

All of my staff is self created and has had no experience prior to my guidence. I have a hard time allowing them to decide who is most qualified when they are still growing themselves and not yet to the level that I would expect to rely on them to hire. They are not "BOSS" they are crew leaders but I'm still there for direction. I just wanted something to make my life easier. As we continue to get more and more "tree guy" applicants with "experience" the more I think the tests are necessary. No matter how good you are at interviewing and reading people and as a previous cop Ive had lots of experience.... I have still been BS'ed right into offering a job to one who seems more then qualified, and their resume makes them look like a dream and yet they can't even run a saw.

I think the hands on vs. written is a good idea and I might play with that a little bit. I don't necessarily think "written" is the best and only way to go but I think it is a posibility.

So in my defense. It isn't that I "know it all" it is just a possible step in a better direction of hiring for me. Might not work for you. But it might for me.

take these guys outside go with them point at tree point at saw do this before they are hired.

 

[stihlatit]

Is that about the time he punched you in the mouth and kicked your ungrateful ass out in the street? Then, nowhere else to go you became a cop? Just asking, don't be bitter.
Other wheels need to be "reinvented"...tree service hiring is not high on the world's priority list.

I love this post JP. LOL.

 

[jmack]

stupid

when you look at my avatar picture would that qualify me or is that illegal(no ropes, no bands)at 70 ft

f*in stupid! whut up cowboy? hey look at me! btw thank god yer wearing your hard hat and why is that? i think that should pts test tree

 

[ShoerFast]

Just reading this tread as I noticed it was gaining speed,,,,,, Good read!

Inside our own realms, just one look at a person is going to base our opinion!

The old saying that first impressions are the most important!

Testing is all well and good, and could tell you only if someone has done it once before. (granting that was the right way) But wouldn't tell you beans about how they show up for work and how they work.

Still some of the best interview questions are the old classics, like "Why do you want to work here?" And "why did you leave your last job?" (or may I contact your last employer, and what could they tell me about you?)

I liked the J.C. Penny idea of salting before they taste it!
I had an employer go out to the parking lot and look at and into my truck while I was taking his general aptitude IQ test,,,,,, he latter told me he looked into my truck (from the outside) and said he hired me as it passed what he was looking for, not spotless clean, and not that "lived in look" but an example of "busy" , "with that paid for look",,,,,, he also hired for the NASA program before he had his own business.

On the other hand, I had worked for an Airline that hired a guy I culled in an interview about 6 months earlier, when I questioned the GM, he told me he just needed to fog some mirrors, as there just wasn't enough good help available. That was for an Aircraft Mechanic!

Kevin

 

[jp hallman]

Hiring a man that works with his hands and tools...look at his hands and tools.If he has quality tools, cared for tools, and all of the tools he needs. Great!
If he's a timber faller might not hurt if he has all of his fingers and most of his teeth. Choker bells have taken a few teeth, so can't hold that one against him. Fingers? Well, fingers are just good to have! Hard to hold a saw without em'.
If I'm hiring somebody to keep my books and the like, Bet your sweet bippy some sort of written test will be administered. This a good thread. Makes me want to go take a few tests just to shake up a few managers. I might even go apply for a "gumment" job! I'll get it, become an alcoholic and blame it on timber sale protesters...live out the rest of my days with my feet kicked up living off "The Man".