Odd Firewood Pricing Question

[MarcS]

My neighbor gave me permission to cut on his property which has about 10 years worth of standing dead and down oaks of the larger variety and I'm wondering what a fair price would be per cord. He's happy to let me clean things up but I want to pay for it so things don't come back a few years later about how I owe him etc. etc. If it was just one or two trees I wouldn't worry about it but I want to really have at it and stock pile a bunch of wood this spring, maybe 15-20 cord to start. Oak stumpage rate doesn't seem like a fair price (don't know what that is for that matter) because these are ugly trees that no logging outfit would mess with anyway. I'm talking winching leaning blowdowns out of healthy trees, trimming broken off spars flush with the ground, and removing half rotten stuff. The benefit to me is that it's a lot of big stuff in excess of 3'-4' diameter which will yield a lot of wood and gives me a chance to play with my larger saws.

Any thoughts?

 

[Circle B MN]

Almost sounds like he should be paying you. If I have to pay for logs and cut them myself, $10 a cord is my usual offer. For $80 a cord I can have logs delivered to me. I do appreciate your thoughtfulness in wanting to be fair and giving to the man.

 

[indiansprings]

Down here the going price is 15-20 bucks a cord when you do clean up.

 

[Dalmatian90]

Two prices I've seen in Connecticut:

State Forest lottery: $30/cord, they issue ~200 permits per year. This is thinning trees marked by a forester.

Southern Conn. Water Authority: First time permit holders $75/year + $25/cord for five cords; subsequent years is $40 annual + $25/cord. This program includes both thinnings marked by a forester and/or tree tops left over from logging.

=========
Statistic that shows how poorly run/funded the state forest program is:

State Forests: 180,000 acres, the have a lottery for under 200 two cord permits/year (400 cords total).

Southern Connecticut Water (New Haven area): 21,000 acres, 500 permit holders, since you pre-pay for the first five cords/year (which can be rolled over to the next year year if you don't cut all five), and can pay per cord over that...I'm guessing they probably sell 2,500 cords/year.

 

[RAMROD48]

Depends on how nice you want to be...I have paid up to $25 a cord...

 

[MarcS]

Thanks guys, you got exactly what I was asking for. I was actually thinking $25 a cord so now I know I wasn't that far off. It's worth it to me since his property borders mine and it is easy for me to just go cut for an hour or two when I've got time and then haul it home behind the atv at my leisure.

I'll have to explain exactly what a cord is since nobody around here has any idea but I'll probably offer $20/cord to give myself a little room if I decide to sell some.

 

[browneye]

i wouldnt pay no more than 5 or 10 bucks a cord..... it sounds like to me you are doing him a favor....

 

[darkbyrd]

i wouldnt pay no more than 5 or 10 bucks a cord..... it sounds like to me you are doing him a favor....

Cleaning up someone's woods and making them safer is kinda a favor, so a favor for a favor is what? I think this would just be part of being a good neighbor. Of course, helping him out cash-wise is very neighborly too.

 

[TMFARM 2009]

start low around $15.00 a cord so if he gets greedy and wants $40.00 a cord you can move more.. maybe hit your price easier...
i have been in this situation before, they didn't want anything till they find out you will pay for it, then wamm, they want gold for it..
example ( a guy i know has a homemade wood splitter for sale has set for twenty years, but couldn't decide on price. we talked about it for a while he says maybe somewhere around ???? $400.00 maybe,after 10 minutes talking to the guy he throws out a firm price of a $1000.00 i tell him i will buy new for that price..)
so he tells me if he doesn't get $1000.00 for it he will scrap it...
i told him i would help him load it...

 

[freemind]

I understand you want to be neighborly and all......

Still, if he was going to pay someone to clean up his woods he was too lazy/unable to do, then think what it would cost HIM. I doubtl highly that a forestry management company would work for 20 bucks an hour.

So even if he did want 20 a cord, he would still be in the red for what he would have paid a forestry management company.

I wouldn't pay squat, personally. If he comes back later, let him know that your labor and equipment is worth a minimum of 50 bucks an hour. I doubt he will want to trade bills.

 

[MarcS]

Well I talked to him tonight and I offered $20 a cord and he said that was more than fair to him. I'm not sure why some of you guys think I'm giving myself the shaft at $20 a cord. If I was paying taxes on 250 acres I wouldn't just let someone come and harvest all the oak they felt like and not give me something for it.

I only wish I had $5000/acre (the going rate in my area) laying around so I could buy 40 acres or so of nice timber land. It kind of sucks having to work out various deals/arrangements with different people every year in order to have wood to burn every winter.

 

[willbarryrec]

I only wish I had $5000/acre (the going rate in my area) laying around so I could buy 40 acres or so of nice timber land. It kind of sucks having to work out various deals/arrangements with different people every year in order to have wood to burn every winter.

I hear you on that!...oh do I ever...My one burning desire in life is to have some wooded land to manage for firewood and eventually timber...maybe have enough room to build my homestead and room to grow food for myself.

Rep sent for being a stand up guy and not trying to just get everything for free you can! ( unlike what seems like most of the country)

Don't get me wrong I LOVE free stuff but sometimes getting things for free can cost you in other ways then money...You never know what might happen if your neighbor is really happy with the work your doing.
Cheers!

 

[CrappieKeith]

20$ is nothing compared to what that cord will make in heat. If the land owner is happy then you made a nice score!

 

[Swamp Yankee]

Good Relations

You did the right thing. The landowner is probably tickled that you offered to pay, and is most certain to give you first crack at anything else that needs to be cut. If you pull out 15 cord, that's only $300 which is cheap especially for something so close. Around here that's 1-1/2 cord of seasoned CS&D, so the rest is gravy so to speak.

One additional thought though you seem like the kind of guy that would anyway, respect his property. If it's muddy, don't go in and rut it up. If there's any small leaners or widowmakers, take them down if you can safely do so and rough pile any brush. Most important, bring a garbage bag and pick up any trash you may find. If the landowner sees you taking care of things for him, you may just have a place to cut for a long time.

Take Care

 

[1harlowr]

Make sure he knows you have thought of selling some of the wood. If he finds out later you are selling some of the wood he might not like it. Maybe he is just being neighborly to let you cut for yourself without it even occuring to him some might be sold.

It would be one thing to let someone cut for their own winter heat. It's another when someone sells the wood without the owner's approval.

Wouldn't want him to put a stop to you cutting for your own use.

 

[Danno]

I totally get paying him for this opportunity, but where's the line with this stuff. The local tree guy should be giving the lady down the street about $30 bucks for the oak i saw them taking down last fall. Instead I hear that she paid $600 for him to do it. He bucked and split it right there by the street and then took it straight to his firewood customer.

I'm not saying you are wrong, and I'm not saying that my local tree service is wrong, either. I'm just wondering where the line is that dictates whether or not you get paid or you pay.

 

[Beefie]

Make sure he knows you have thought of selling some of the wood. If he finds out later you are selling some of the wood he might not like it. Maybe he is just being neighborly to let you cut for yourself without it even occuring to him some might be sold.

It would be one thing to let someone cut for their own winter heat. It's another when someone sells the wood without the owner's approval.

Wouldn't want him to put a stop to you cutting for your own use.

:agree2: You don't want this to happen , so make sure you let him no that you would be selling some of it down the line.


Beefie

 

[zogger]

That's woodlot management

My neighbor gave me permission to cut on his property which has about 10 years worth of standing dead and down oaks of the larger variety and I'm wondering what a fair price would be per cord. He's happy to let me clean things up but I want to pay for it so things don't come back a few years later about how I owe him etc. etc. If it was just one or two trees I wouldn't worry about it but I want to really have at it and stock pile a bunch of wood this spring, maybe 15-20 cord to start. Oak stumpage rate doesn't seem like a fair price (don't know what that is for that matter) because these are ugly trees that no logging outfit would mess with anyway. I'm talking winching leaning blowdowns out of healthy trees, trimming broken off spars flush with the ground, and removing half rotten stuff. The benefit to me is that it's a lot of big stuff in excess of 3'-4' diameter which will yield a lot of wood and gives me a chance to play with my larger saws.

Any thoughts?

You are doing a service weeding his garden. A woodlot is just a big garden and crippled/odd/dead tree removal is a valuable service down the road, leading to marketable timber and also a more natural "park" like feel for he and his family to enjoy their woods.

I'd say thanks and just have him over for dinner a few times, stuff like that. Make it pretty, clean up the brush or make neater stacks of it, make some nice trails, maybe throw a few log benches in there.

I know in the past I have gotten paid to clean up wooded areas, as part of over-all estate caretaking. Heck, I still do it just for fun when I am out walking the dogs, I drag deadfalls (chunks I am never going to cut for firewood) into berms to help with erosion control and just make the woods neater. I sort of "terrace" the hillsides better.

And my boss doesn't even know it! He's kinda real old and fat now, doesn't get back into the woods at all anymore, but *I*do, and I always make places nicer wherever I live.

Do the same with that guy's woodlot, you'll get to cut forever. Just treat his land like you owned it yourself, and the real owner will be pleased as punch.

 

[MarcS]

All good advice guys. I did mention possibly selling some of it but I need to revisit that and make sure it's still kosher. Everyone and their brother sells wood around here so I'm not sure it's really worth the effort.

 

[TMFARM 2009]

if you pay for it it should not be an issue at all...