Opinions on fireplace insert

[046]

notice the ash hole in floor. that's been converted into an outside air, updraft duct. so I don't use any fresh air from inside house.

if your insert is not producing smoke at operating temp. then it's burning very cleanly. how much smoke comes out of chimney after wood stove reaches operating temps is a sure fire indicator if stove is burning cleanly.

proof positive is how much creosote comes out chimney after a full season. after two full seasons, my chimney had little to no creosote buildup using my JUCA insert.

JUCA is constructed from 1/4in plate and rated for coal. seems an updraft fresh air vent is required to burn coal. I'll be trying out coal hopefully real soon. still need to chase down coal grate and coal.

Juka looks like a huge unit but would seem very inefficient. any idea on your effeciency rating. the problem i see is that you are sending the air you paid to heat back up your chimney by not having xternal combustion air. the unit im heating with is completely sealed using external combustion air. i only get a small amount of smoke out of my chimney only when restocking. zero smoke when at operating temp and i usually keep the insert at about 400 to 450 and could let it get hotter if needed but find that seems to be my best operating temp. so far i have only hooked up one of the xtra zones to the basement but have the capability of hooking up two.

juka? is it epa rated

 

[allthegross]

interesting...now makes more sense. how about the btu and efficiency rating

 

[046]

flat don't remember that btu ratings are... don't think mfg ever gave an effeciency rating. If I had to make a guess. I'd say newer EPA rated stoves with secondary burn would be more efficient, than JUCA with it's open burn design.

JUCA's design has been in production 20+ years. it's strength is super efficient heat exchange. entire insert is double wall 1/4in thick. in other words insert is hollow allowing air max contact time. it's one big efficient heat exchanger.

interesting...now makes more sense. how about the btu and efficiency rating

 

[allthegross]

flat don't remember that btu ratings are... don't think mfg ever gave an effeciency rating. If I had to make a guess. I'd say newer EPA rated stoves with secondary burn would be more efficient, than JUCA with it's open burn design.

JUCA's design has been in production 20+ years. it's strength is super efficient heat exchange. entire insert is double wall 1/4in thick. in other words insert is hollow allowing air max contact time. it's one big efficient heat exchanger.

OK I HAVE DONE SOME RESEARCH ON IT NOW...IM WILLIN TO BET YOU SELL THESE THINGS OR WORK FOR THEM IN SOME WAY. IF I JUST PULLED YOUR CARD JUST P.M. ME AND LET ME KNOW I WONT TELL. LOOKS LIKE IT HEATS WELL THOUGH

 

[046]

thanks for remembering me treeco!!

allthegross, sorry to disappoint you but I have absolutely no interests in JUCA.

as a matter of fact, technology has progressed since I've purchased a JUCA insert. my recommendations is to check out the newer EPA wood stoves. without question they are more efficient than JUCA.

JUCA is no slouch either, but no way is more efficient than newer technologies. JUCA also has some advantages... like being able to burn green and seasoned wood cleanly.

takes almost twice as much green wood to equal heat output using seasoned wood. soooo... no you don't want to burn green wood, unless of course you run out of wood near end of season and are forced to. anyone ever done that?

it's also rated for coal, which I hope to be trying soon. still trying to find out how much smoke coal will generate.

firebox is 12 cubic feet or close to having OWB capacity inside. can easily burn 1ft x 2ft logs if I want. another neat feature of JUCA is use of original firebrick, ash dump and gas lighter tube. very easy installation due to no duct work required.

OK I HAVE DONE SOME RESEARCH ON IT NOW...IM WILLIN TO BET YOU SELL THESE THINGS OR WORK FOR THEM IN SOME WAY. IF I JUST PULLED YOUR CARD JUST P.M. ME AND LET ME KNOW I WONT TELL. LOOKS LIKE IT HEATS WELL THOUGH

 

[Wood Doctor]

Federal Airtight 288

I bouught this Federal Aiitight 288 (large) about 20 years ago, and it still works very well.

I imagine it would just barely fit on an 18" hearth extending from the fireplace opening. This is not a zero-clearance insert, but more of an extension, similiar to a free-standing stove that gets more radiant heat into the room.

These models may not even be available anymore, but even a used one would probably work well for you. Mine easily handles a 24" to 25" log and has a side loading door that I really like.

The cook top of this stove will reach 1400 degrees when the north wind is howling away outside. I have this stove connected to a masonry chimney that's about three stories high, so the draft is enormous. The secondary combustion chamber and the internal air circulation that was designed into the stove provides excellent control of the fire and very complete combustion. I seldom have any cinders remaining at all, regardless of what species of wood that I burn. This stove swallows "all nighters" like jaws, so I nicknamed her "Jaws".

I can generally boil off 2 gallons of water a day to add moisture to the air by using just one tea kettle. At night, I turn on a thermostatically-controlled blower that circulates more convection heat into the room.

The downside is that I am now having trouble finding parts, and after 20 years, a few are in need of replacement. I'm somewhat convinced that it will be difficult to improve on Jaws.

 

[046]

doctor ed, that looks like an excellent wood stove!!

that side loading feature really looks handy. looks like no blower is needed.

would you please post pictures of secondary burn chamber?
really interested in how airtight did that. does this model have a cat converter?

 

[Wood Doctor]

More Federal Airtight Features

would you please post pictures of secondary burn chamber? really interested in how airtight did that. does this model have a cat converter?

This model does have a cat converter, but I only use it about half the time. They are also getting hard to find. Instead, I have a 3/16" cast iron plate in the cat flue chamber that has a bunch of 3/8" holes in it, equally spaced.

That plate gets red hot also and will take the flue gases to 1300 F. I notice very little reduction in burn time when using the plate (and it's a lot easier to clean). I believe Federal suplied this as a damper choke for those wanting to burn coal rather than wood. With the draft I have from my tall chimney, I sometimes think I'm burning coal. Heheheh.

The way that secondary combustion chamber works, a block off plate drops down using a handle on the far left above the loading door. That locks into position and redirects almost all the flue gases to go into the secondary chamber at the top of the stove and then out the cat combuster flue. From there it exits to the chimney.

With the block off plate open, the flue gases would simply go directly from the firebox to the chimney, the path of least resistance. That's how you light the stove. Then when the gases reach about 400 to 500 F, I close the block off plate and send the secondary chamber into action. When that occurs, (about 15 minutes after initial light up) the cook top creaks and growns like a working slave as it heats up, and the whole stove starts to get hot immediately.

Another neat feature of this stove is the ash pan below the shaker grates. Even with the fire running, you can open that door below the main combustion chamber, pull out, and empty the ash pan. If you time it right, the ashes in the pan are surprisingly only a step above room temperature. I could dump these directly into a plastic trash bag without fear--no joke.

The shaker grates filter the ashes and hold the hot ones above. Theoretically, you could run this stove for several weeks and never let the fire go completely out, dumping the ashes once every six hours after shaking the grates a few trimes. In short, this was an ingenious design, and I'm not sure if there are any stoves out there that replicate it today.

 

[046]

sure sounds like a very well though out design.

so you are running stove without a cat due to no parts? newer designs do away with cat completely basically by using a secondary burn, raising temps high enough to do a complete burn. hence no creosote with no cat converter.

JUCA does the exact same thing with an open burn design. insert is designed to accelerate upward draft by careful design of burn chamber angles. result is similar to forced air draft systems used by almost all new commercial gas fired furnaces and some epa rated wood furnaces.

it sure sound like your insert had the best of both designs 20 years back. secondary burn and cat.

proof of how clean your insert is burning without a cat is how much smoke your chimney is putting out after reaching temps. and of course how much creosote is removed upon cleaning chimney.

JUCA puts out almost no smoke after reaching operating temps. almost no creosote was removed during cleaning of chimney after two seasons of using insert as 100% heat source.

This model does have a cat converter, but I only use it about half the time. They are also getting hard to find. Instead, I have a 3/16" cast iron plate in the cat flue chamber that has a bunch of 3/8" holes in it, equally spaced.

That plate gets red hot also and will take the flue gases to 1300 F. I notice very little reduction in burn time when using the plate (and it's a lot easier to clean). I believe Federal suplied this as a damper choke for those wanting to burn coal rather than wood. With the draft I have from my tall chimney, I sometimes think I'm burning coal. Heheheh.

The way that secondary combustion chamber works, a block off plate drops down using a handle on the far left above the loading door. That locks into position and redirects almost all the flue gases to go into the secondary chamber at the top of the stove and then out the cat combuster flue. From there it exits to the chimney.

With the block off plate open, the flue gases would simply go directly from the firebox to the chimney, the path of least resistance. That's how you light the stove. Then when the gases reach about 400 to 500 F, I close the block off plate and send the secondary chamber into action. When that occurs, (about 15 minutes after initial light up) the cook top creaks and growns like a working slave as it heats up, and the whole stove starts to get hot immediately.

Another neat feature of this stove is the ash pan below the shaker grates. Even with the fire running, you can open that door below the main combustion chamber, pull out, and empty the ash pan. If you time it right, the ashes in the pan are surprisingly only a step above room temperature. I could dump these directly into a plastic trash bag without fear--no joke.

The shaker grates filter the ashes and hold the hot ones above. Theoretically, you could run this stove for several weeks and never let the fire go completely out, dumping the ashes once every six hours after shaking the grates a few trimes. In short, this was an ingenious design, and I'm not sure if there are any stoves out there that replicate it today.

 

[Wood Doctor]

so you are running stove without a cat due to no parts? newer designs do away with cat completely basically by using a secondary burn, raising temps high enough to do a complete burn. hence no creosote with no cat converter.

JUCA does the exact same thing with an open burn design. insert is designed to accelerate upward draft by careful design of burn chamber angles. result is similar to forced air draft systems used by almost all new commercial gas fired furnaces and some epa rated wood furnaces.

it sure sound like your insert had the best of both designs 20 years back. secondary burn and cat.

proof of how clean your insert is burning without a cat is how much smoke your chimney is putting out after reaching temps. and of course how much creosote is removed upon cleaning chimney.

JUCA puts out almost no smoke after reaching operating temps. almost no creosote was removed during cleaning of chimney after two seasons of using insert as 100% heat source.

Actually, I have found that the hot cast iron, perforated plate works about as well as a cat combustor. After that "magic" 1000 F is reached or more, there is practically no smoke visible from the chimney.

I generally only have the chimney swept about every three to five years. The draft has never indicated a required sweep because it is always strong. I sweep it routinely and next year it's due. I also have trouble finding chimney sweeps that can reach the top with enough extensions. Most refuse to climb to the top and work top down. They need about a 35' reach.

The 100% heat source is facinating. When I bought this invention in 1987, I don't think JUCA or Quad were around. Jotul and Vermont Castings were, but neither had the features of the Federal Airtights.