Safety parameters for descent hitches

[NeTree]

So... does anybody besides me actually use a figure-8 at ALL?

 

[Bradley Ford]

Originally posted by TheTreeSpyder
i think that a system is as strong as it's weakest link; if we will cut corners here, why not lower the strength of the whole system?

I believe that when I descend with a dynamic rope system my hitch is the weakest link in my system.

Originally posted by RescueMan
In the cave rescue community, we've been experimenting with the Dog-'n-tails as a means (actually the ONLY means) of descending a loaded rope (a rope with a casualty hanging on it), as any mechanical rappel device requires slack below the device.

What criteria does the cave rescue community use to judge the Dog-'n-tails (or any other) hitch?

 

[NickfromWI]

Originally posted by Eagle1
Nick. just curious??

Do you think one can desend soley on a Blake?

Well, if you're talking about SRT, I'm tempted to say yes. Now, could a person tie a Blakes out of 1/2" climbing line on SRT and descend safely??? I doubt it, but it may be worth trying. If anything, I bet it'd be a jerky descent.

Now, if you were climbing on an 11mm line, and you tied the blakes out of like a 13mm technora or vectran line, hmmmm maybe you could.

Someone's gotta try it out, I guess. On belay the whole time, of course.

love
nick

 

[Koa Man]

Originally posted by netree
So... does anybody besides me actually use a figure-8 at ALL?

I do, usually only when I want to make an impressive drop out of a tall coconut palm.

 

[Bradley Ford]

Originally posted by RockyJSquirrel
To be honest, I'm not even concerned with how my hitch handles 300 lbs. I have it dialed in for my weight, not JPS's weight. Advanced hitches can be weight sensitive. Therefore you must adjust the number of wraps or braids in order to dial them in for your weight.

Because your hitch is "dialed in" for your weight, is the hitch the weakest link in your climbing system? (If not, what is?)

 

[Eagle1]

Using a Blakes, I descend all the time. I use 1/2 rope. It is very smooth believe it or not. You just have to keep your hand under the hitch to control speed. I trust it. I really dont make a habit of it though. Normally if i descend the stick I still have the lanyard, if I have to come down fast, as long as I have a crotch, I have no problem coming down on the Blake.

 

[Lumberjack]

Originally posted by netree
So... does anybody besides me actually use a figure-8 at ALL?

I use it for repeling when I am not on the i'D or i am repeling for fun. I still like the 8, it is smooth and sweet. The i'D is ok (I wouldnt remove it to put on the 8) but for repeling I perfer the 8.


Carl

 

[NeTree]

Glad to see I'm not a COMPLETE dinosaur.

 

[Burnham]

No way, NE, or I'm a dino too. I almost always rappel on an eight. Do you use a deaf 8, one of the small models? Or a large rescue style, w/ ears? How about you, Carl?

Any of you using a rescue 8, have you seen or used one of the type with ears on the side, versus on the top?

 

[NeTree]

I use a classic "8"... no ears.

Tried the Resue 8 with the ears, but it just leaves something to get snegged on while you're carrying it around, whereas the smooth profile of the classic avoids that.

JMH Preferance...

 

[Lumberjack]

I perfer the Rescue 8, when it is applicable. The ears do get caught up on alot of things, so I put it in the bag on the back of my saddle, if it becomes a problem. I like the deaf 8's small size, but I started using the Rescue when I first started repellin.

In an emergency (drop the 8 i'D and whatever else) I can and have used the kong bent gates on the side of my saddle (used to hold my junk) to come down on a munter hitch. I have done it before, but just to try it out. Never know when I might need it.


Carl

 

[NickfromWI]

In my streamline state of mine, I don't think the 8 is worth carrying around. When ever I rappel down (as opposed to descending on a friction hitch) I tie a munter. I'll either leave the spliced eye clipped and munter where my friction hitch just was, or I will double the climbing line over my TIP and tie the munter with both hanging ends of the climbing line.

It might sound bulky, but it works nicely. It's not as smooth as using an 8, and the 8 doesn't put as many twists in the line, but it only takes a few seconds to ket the twists out after rappel and it's one less thing to carry around.

love
nick

ps- I would prefer the 8 if I was doing longer rappels...more material to dissipate the heat.

 

[Burnham]

That's a drawback to the rescue 8, for sure, NE. I would carry mine binered by the large upper hole instead of the regular rigging hole, which seemed to help reduce snagging. Then I got one of Surety's RQ3 Q-8 rescue 8s, which has ears on the side. Actually they are shaped more like horns, or a cleat on a boat deck. Way nicer to use, with easy adjustable friction levels available, and very controllable lock/unlock manuever. But either way you carry it, it can snag. I hang it from a gear sling behind my hip, and for some moves I'll tuck it inside the leg pad on my New Tribe (Ness) saddle. That keeps it out of the way quite well.

You ought to give one of these a try, Carl. It's a big improvement over the usual 8 w/ ears.

I'll try posting a picture.

 

[Burnham]

Here we go...

 

[Lumberjack]

Originally posted by NickfromWI
It might sound bulky, but it works nicely. It's not as smooth as using an 8, and the 8 doesn't put as many twists in the line, but it only takes a few seconds to ket the twists out after rappel and it's one less thing to carry around.

love
nick

ps- I would prefer the 8 if I was doing longer rappels...more material to dissipate the heat.

The munter is easy to use, I just perfer having 8's heat sink on all the repels, but the munter is fun. The first time I used it my groundy said "You got a million ways to go up and down the rope"

Also the munter is more involved to lock off than an 8.

Aint options great?

Carl

 

[NeTree]

As I said, I use an 8 for longer descents, like anything over 30 feet maybe. Otherwise, I just slide down my Blake's.

 

[Lumberjack]

Yea to me the munter is fine to 30-40 foot, if its the easyist to go down on. I wouldn't take off the i'D to use a munter or an 8, unless it is over say 100 foot, then I perfer the 8.


Carl

 

[RescueMan]

Also the munter is more involved to lock off than an 8

Actually, the munter is relatively simple to lock of with a mule knot.

 

[NickfromWI]

Thank you, RescueMan....never underestimate the power of the slip knot!

I have the book that that image is from.....it's a shorty but a goodie!

love
nick

 

[Lumberjack]

Originally posted by RescueMan
Actually, the munter is relatively simple to lock of with a mule knot.

Yea, the mule can be extremely helpful in some rigging situations. When you get ready to go, just pull the tail and off you go!

Thanks, I had forgotten how to tie it, but remembered the name.


Carl