jblimbwalker
ArboristSite Operative
any good ideas out there for sucuring rope ends, besides the electrical tape idea? I use liquid plastic and a friend of mine uses shoe goo. I'm interested in any other ideas.
securing rope ends
- Thread starter jblimbwalker
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Tim Gardner
ArboristSite Guru
Liquid electrical tape works better than plasti dip IMHO. It does not take as long to dry and comes with a brush and seems to be a little more durable. I also use the liquid tape to protect the corners of my cube to keep the springs from coming out. 
Whipping the ends with braided nylon twine has outlasted any type of whipping I have tried. Get some high quality needles from the boat supply store and research different ways to do it.
Whipping the ends with braided nylon twine has outlasted any type of whipping I have tried. Get some high quality needles from the boat supply store and research different ways to do it.
NickfromWI
Addicted to ArboristSite
Whip it good
Nothing (and I mean NOTHING) beats a good, properly done whipping.
love
nick
Nothing (and I mean NOTHING) beats a good, properly done whipping.
love
nick
Eric E.
ArboristSite Operative
Whip it and Dip it!
I have a 5/8ths rigging line that was whipped then dipped in rubber dip. It has stayed together for about 4 years, not heavy use though.
I have a 5/8ths rigging line that was whipped then dipped in rubber dip. It has stayed together for about 4 years, not heavy use though.
Matt Follett
ArboristSite Operative
Whippy Do!
treeclimber165
Member A.K.A Skwerl
Whipping is great when you have time to do it. But for those situations on the job where you need to fix the end of a rope before it unravels, I just wrap with a short piece of tape, make a fresh cut (through the tape), melt the end with a lighter and then remove the tape.
Kneejerk Bombas
ArboristSite King
Re: Whip it good
Ida thunk you would go for a properly done backsplice!
Ida thunk you would go for a properly done backsplice!
Artistree
ArboristSite Lurker
I use electrical Heat Shrink tube on the ends of all my lines now. Just slip it over the end and heat with a lighter and you get a nice tight seal. I usually leave the tube a little longer than the rope so that it shrinks over the core too. For lines that get heavy use I go for a couple of coats. Had one on my split tail for five months now with no wear.
NickfromWI
Addicted to ArboristSite
back splice
Good guess, Mike!
However, most of the time, a back splice adds unwanted bulk at the end of a line, though there are some lines that you can do an "invisible" back splice.
love
nick
Good guess, Mike!
However, most of the time, a back splice adds unwanted bulk at the end of a line, though there are some lines that you can do an "invisible" back splice.
love
nick
John Paul Sanborn
Above average climber
If you cut the core and match the cover up it's not too bad.
Not that I can match anything to save my life.
I'm a rubber dipper.
Not that I can match anything to save my life.
I'm a rubber dipper.
Tom Dunlap
Addicted to ArboristSite
Brion Toss recommends the Butane Backsplice as one means of securing the end of the line
Tom
Tom
NickfromWI
Addicted to ArboristSite
Butane?
Tom,
If I'm not mistaken, Brion very much UN-reccomends the butane backsplice. He talks bad about it in The Riggers Apprentice, and at the Advanced Splicing Class, he was very anti-flame.
love
nick
Tom,
If I'm not mistaken, Brion very much UN-reccomends the butane backsplice. He talks bad about it in The Riggers Apprentice, and at the Advanced Splicing Class, he was very anti-flame.
love
nick
I was wondering how do you get a split tail to last five months. Do you use moth balls? Anyway I like to take the end and wrap it tightly with tape and then cut it with a very sharp knife. Then when the wife's not looking sear the end on the electric stove. A setting around 5 works good, not too hot. Then I like to whip and stitch the end or sometimes just some heat shrink tubing.
Why no butane Nick? Too tempting to huff it?
Why no butane Nick? Too tempting to huff it?
Tom Dunlap
Addicted to ArboristSite
Nick,
You're right. I chose the wrong word. Should have said "writes about".
In his Chapman's Nautical Guides "Knots" he writes, "There are a number of "modern" alternatives to whippings. These range from glues designed to stick the strands together to the infamous "Butane Backsplic" {fusing the strand with a cigarette lighter}. Bot no one has come up with anything else as secure, soft, durable, and pleasing to eye and hand as Palm-and-Heedle Whipping.
Tom
You're right. I chose the wrong word. Should have said "writes about".
In his Chapman's Nautical Guides "Knots" he writes, "There are a number of "modern" alternatives to whippings. These range from glues designed to stick the strands together to the infamous "Butane Backsplic" {fusing the strand with a cigarette lighter}. Bot no one has come up with anything else as secure, soft, durable, and pleasing to eye and hand as Palm-and-Heedle Whipping.
Tom
treeclimber165
Member A.K.A Skwerl
So what is wrong with melting the end of the rope using a lighter? I've rarely had to do it twice on a rope, it usually lasts the life of the rope without coming undone. On my lifelines I intentionally try to make a bit of a nub on the end so my friction hitch will not pass off the rope easily. I do this since I refuse to tie a figure 8 knot in the tail of my lifeline so it can get hung up in a crotch (This was required when I was at Davey, I ignored that rule). I never have to worry about whipping coming unravelled after the groundman grinds the end of the lowering rope into a driveway with a log.
I realize this damages the fibers in the last 1/4" of rope. But this is not a safety issue, since any termination knot will have at least a 1" tail. What would be a downside to melting the ends of your ropes?
I realize this damages the fibers in the last 1/4" of rope. But this is not a safety issue, since any termination knot will have at least a 1" tail. What would be a downside to melting the ends of your ropes?
timberfell
ArboristSite Member
I agree with 165. With my berz 0 matic free standing on end, I can have both hands working the rope around the flame. You can get as fancy as you want, even to the point where you get a good fusion without turning the end of the rope black. I put a piece of hockey tape around the cut end and leave about 1/8'' of fiber sticking out. It holds, it's quick and it doens't ruin any rope.
i lightly butane backsplice to seal the package trying not to harm or mushroom the line.
Then i tape with bright electric (diffrent color on each end ie. bring me the red end of blue). Then i put 2 pieces overlapping over the end, aafter that i start a few inches back, spiral to the end neatley then spiral back down to finsh. On a standard 1/2" line, i make the tape job 2"+; so as to mark where to leave a proper tail sticking out of the knot for security according to the 4xdiameter for medium-soft lay line rule of thumb.
On a 3 strand, i wind up to the tip of the line agianst the twist of the line, so that as the tape job turns at the top it comes down finishing back to start to spiral with the lay/ twist of the line; then taking a tool to press it into the twist nicely. When i made tails to make the Blakes with out of 3 strand; i would cut/seal the end of the tail to a point against the lay (otherwise it will tend to unravel), then do follow the above process. This left a nice 'knitting needle' point to easierly lace the final stages of the Blakes; especially when i was experimenting with a 5/8" 3 strand for tails (kinda a little more picky about being set right; but the mechanics held true). 5/8"tails was an interesting trial and lesson; but perhaps can't recomend it; was looking for strength and longer life in tail; but feel that was reaching a little far.
The dips have lasted me a while, shoo-goo very innovative strategy! i think the tape is brighter, more available and smoother, easier to replace on the fly than dips.
Then i tape with bright electric (diffrent color on each end ie. bring me the red end of blue). Then i put 2 pieces overlapping over the end, aafter that i start a few inches back, spiral to the end neatley then spiral back down to finsh. On a standard 1/2" line, i make the tape job 2"+; so as to mark where to leave a proper tail sticking out of the knot for security according to the 4xdiameter for medium-soft lay line rule of thumb.
On a 3 strand, i wind up to the tip of the line agianst the twist of the line, so that as the tape job turns at the top it comes down finishing back to start to spiral with the lay/ twist of the line; then taking a tool to press it into the twist nicely. When i made tails to make the Blakes with out of 3 strand; i would cut/seal the end of the tail to a point against the lay (otherwise it will tend to unravel), then do follow the above process. This left a nice 'knitting needle' point to easierly lace the final stages of the Blakes; especially when i was experimenting with a 5/8" 3 strand for tails (kinda a little more picky about being set right; but the mechanics held true). 5/8"tails was an interesting trial and lesson; but perhaps can't recomend it; was looking for strength and longer life in tail; but feel that was reaching a little far.
The dips have lasted me a while, shoo-goo very innovative strategy! i think the tape is brighter, more available and smoother, easier to replace on the fly than dips.
treeclimber165
Member A.K.A Skwerl
The main thing I never liked about taping is that it ALWAYS comes off on hot, sticky days and always leaves a sticky goo on my rope ends. This is especially true for any type of electrical tape. I try to remove the factory tape before the rope gets used too much, or else it leaves another sticky goo when it finally falls off.
I do like the color coding idea.
I do like the color coding idea.
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John Paul Sanborn
Above average climber
I think Toss' dislike is more aesthetic then anything else, also a good whipping will usualy last longer in other uses.
Are there any chemicals out there that will weld the fibers like modle glue does? So you get a good caot of goo on the end and it fuses to the fiber.
Maybe a question for the maker.
Are there any chemicals out there that will weld the fibers like modle glue does? So you get a good caot of goo on the end and it fuses to the fiber.
Maybe a question for the maker.
NickfromWI
Addicted to ArboristSite
Aesthetics.....
The anti-butane sentiment does come largely from aesthetics. Few will deny that a whipping looks better than a melting. Also you should consider your health! Burn a lot of rope and imagine a film of melted, blackened polyester lining your lungs!
Also, and this is a matter of craftpersonship, a glob at the end of the rope might have a sharp "burr" hanging off it. If that were to run through your hand at high speed, who knows what it will do?!
Finally, who would want to miss out on the fun of whipping your rope!
love
nick
The anti-butane sentiment does come largely from aesthetics. Few will deny that a whipping looks better than a melting. Also you should consider your health! Burn a lot of rope and imagine a film of melted, blackened polyester lining your lungs!
Also, and this is a matter of craftpersonship, a glob at the end of the rope might have a sharp "burr" hanging off it. If that were to run through your hand at high speed, who knows what it will do?!
Finally, who would want to miss out on the fun of whipping your rope!
love
nick
