Spindly burr oak

[wysiwyg]

I recently cut down a ~25 ft tall Norway pine. The tree had a burr oak growing right next to it, so close that the oak grew between the branches of the pine, which gave the oak full support as it grew. As I prepared to fell the pine, I first carefully removed the branches of the pine that would have interfered with the oak as the pine fell. When I cut the pine down, the oak was not damaged, but it also no longer had the support of the pine and arched over until the the tip hit the ground. The oak is about 15 feet tall and only 3" DBH.

Will this tree ever be able to support itself if left in its current condition? If I cable it to another tree, will it always be dependant on the cable for support? Would it survive and still flourish if I top it off to the point where it can support its own weight standing upright without cables? It's located in a "wild" woody area in the back yard and not part of any formal landscape. TIA.

 

[Guy Meilleur]

Originally posted by wysiwyg
the oak no longer had the support of the pine and arched over until the the tip hit the ground. Will this tree ever be able to support itself if left in its current condition?
Doubtful.
If I cable it to another tree, will it always be dependant on the cable for support?If it's cabled--guyed is the term-- loosely it will move and add girth and can eventually stand on its own. Would it survive and still flourish if I top it off to the point where it can support its own weight standing upright without cables?

Yes but you will have to select a new leader to be the new top, out of the several sprouts that arise from the wound that you would make. Rarely is this kind of heading cut the best course of action, but it may be; can you post a picture?

I would guy it instead, and not just cuz that's muh name.
O and next time you have one tree leaning on another you may want to keep the trunk of the other around to use as a stake.

 

[Dadatwins]

I would probably stake and guy it loosely to see results for a while before cutting anything off. If tree was shaded by one that was removed the last thing the trunkwood needs is it to be overexposed to sun scald by lopping off the top leaves. A picture would be helpful to see whole situation.

 

[wysiwyg]

Thank you for your replies. I managed to get the tip of the tree wedged into the canopy of a nearby tree, which has been holding it pretty well the past few days despite the occasional breeze. Upon further inspection I think I will be able to GUY it to just one stake since it has a tendancy to fall in only one direction. My plan was to use some nylon rope with a piece of old hose against the trunk of the tree. Will this suffice?

I thought about keeping the trunk of the old tree as a stake, but I felt unconfortable about making the cuts at the required height, which would have required a ladder (I'm not a climber) - which is a big no-no.

I'll try to get a picture posted this weekend.

 

[Guy Meilleur]

Originally posted by wysiwyg
I felt unconfortable about making the cuts at the required height, which would have required a ladder (I'm not a climber) - which is a big no-no.

If a ladder was a big no-no, then I'd be a big not-not, but I'm not.

Using achainsaw while on a ladder, yeah, that's trouble. But using a handsaw, less danger. Best yet may be a stout polesaw, you can do a lot with those from the ground.

Guying with rope-in-hose short-term ok I think.

 

[wysiwyg]

Here are some pictures of the staked tree. It was staked 2 weeks ago. All I had were two 6-ft garden stakes I tied together with 17 gage wire. I used the same wire to hold the tree to the stake (about 9 feet off the ground), and a piece of old soaker hose to cushion the area where the wire would touch the tree.

Despite staking the tree so high, the top still bends over with all the weight of the leaves and branches being concentrated at the very top of the tree. I don't have the means to stake it any higher, should I consider topping it?



Picture of entire tree (starts straight up then bends to upper left corner of picture)

Top part of tree, top of stake in lower right corner

Detail of tree attachment

 

[Guy Meilleur]

With that much sprawling horizontal weight yes I would prune. Start with the stuff growing sideways and work your way back until you see the trunk lift up. Actually there is in your middle picture a nearly upright side branch that looks like a good new top. Note that the girth narrows just beyond it. That narrowing spot is a very natural target to select.

I am NOT advocating topping, but given your tree's structure, reducing its crown to that point may be the best answer. What's the difference, some may ask? That upright side branch is a good node because it has a branch protection zone intact. Cutting back to it makes sense and and is not topping and follows ANSI.

Depending on light competition etc, the side branch beyond that vertical may work even if it produces a leaning tree.

Nice pictures; saved many words of pointless debate. (I hope)

 

[wysiwyg]

Thank you for the quick response Guy.

In regards to the branch I should cut to, do you mean the one that is almost directly in the middle of the middle picture that is going straight up then angles to the upper left?

When do you suggest I do the cutting? Thanks again.

 

[Guy Meilleur]

Originally posted by wysiwyg
In regards to the branch I should cut to, do you mean the one that is almost directly in the middle of the middle picture that is going straight up then angles to the upper left?
Yes, that one or the one beyond it. Generally, the less you have to remove to get good structure the better.

When do you suggest I do the cutting? Thanks again.

The sooner, the better, since leaves are fully formed now would be fine.

 

[Dadatwins]

I think this is where Guy said to cut and I agree, will hopefully straighten tree out. Start at upright past this one toward top and see if that works, but I would come down no further than the line. Make a nice clean cut with a pruner or lopper and try not to cause it to rip.

 

[Guy Meilleur]

Yup, that's the line, daddyo;

tho I may give the sprig betond a try first. You can always cut more but it's dam hard to put em back.

 

[wysiwyg]

Whoops, I didn't see the last two replies until now. But I went ahead and topped it at the point where Guy suggested in his last reply...I was able to get the tree to stand upright at this point by moving the stake a bit.

The cut was made just to the right of the two dead upright twigs in the picture. The branch jutting to the right out of the frame is the branch Dadatwins suggested to make the cut just above.

Here's a pic to show how much was lopped off. The loppers give an idea how big it is. It definitely was a lot of top weight.

 

[Dadatwins]

Now lets see how well the tree does. Hopefully the tree will send some new growth out so you can start training a new top. Lets hope it gains some strength so it can stay up with out stake.